Fire Coach Woodson Thread

[IUCrazy2 2,341]

Just now, Stuhoo said:

And that one positive example, Florida?

Their tournament hopes just took a major hit with a loss just now to?

Vanderbilt

How are they selling this?  Seriously, I want to be in a room with the Cooks and Simons discussing investment opportunities in my pet rock business if they think dropping $6 million on a likely bubble ceiling basketball team is a good use of their money.  I have always heard that rich people did not get that way by being stupid and wasting money but here we are.....

[JSHoosier 19,826]

7 minutes ago, HoosierTrav said:

Just 3D chess man. Woody’s has been playing possum this entire time. Truthfully, he’s a genius and super high energy. While he was missing the 20+ prime recruiting days, he was working tirelessly to identify and watch film on portal players that fit his modern system of inside out ball and completely ignoring fugazi analytics data. 
 

We’re just underestimating Woody guys. His incredible will to win as a player has led to an ASTONISHING career win % of .463  at the NBA level. That winning like…..ALMOST HALF of his games! 
 

You guys are just meanies and non knowers of ball… or 3D chess. Completely unfair criticisms of a genius coach. 

He'll be unbeatable once Armond Hill wakes up.

[8bucks 6,347]

I may not be remembering well but didn’t Beard have success bringing in a lot of portal players?  Admittedly Beard is seemingly a very good coach though.  
 

There is a path here for success next year but that seems more like a 6-9 seed level vs a championship level squad. The path doesn’t have to all be portal guys as Woody has been able to pull in decommitts every year too. 
 

If MR, MM and Gallo are back then he needs 4-5 starter quality pick ups. I could see where it is an easy sell to a center to come here using TJD and Ware as examples. So now we need 3-4 others in an area where he has struggled (guards/wings). If we assume Gallo, MR, MM and new center start we need another guard who can do it all. If the #1 do it all pg is where we throw a lot of this new NIL $ perhaps he can be lured. Maybe as an extra incentive we bring on his coach/advisor as other teams have done. Remember, this is the dream scenario so I get some liberties here. 
 

Now you have your starters set and then you need to get 2-3 others who can give us very productive minutes. Going to be a hard sell if these guys can start elsewhere but these guys can be your younger portal guys who would have 2 more years to play.  
 

The key is keeping guys like MR, MM and Gallo. Lose 2 of them and the chance to succeed is hard to envision. 

[AH1971 1,446]

I still want to know what the end game with Woodson is?

I keep coming back to the whole “Archie got 4 years so Woodson gets 4 years” narrative. Is there a legitimate plan? Or are we just simply delaying the inevitable? You have to either fire/force retirement or extend Woodson after the next season. Are we letting Woodson coach in hopes he can step down on a higher note? Are we going to extend him so he actually has a prayer recruiting the class of 25 and beyond? 
 

I think it’s pretty clear the administration has no clue or plan going forward. The further and further Woodson sinks this program the harder it is to climb out of and harder to attract a quality replacement. Dolson needs to say something.

[Stuhoo 79,705]

9 minutes ago, Ngw7183 said:

No, there are tons of examples guys. A lot considering this is a new thing that keeps changing and small sample size.

Last year, KSU had 12 of them. UConn’s was loaded with transfers. SD St 4 of 5 top scorers were transfers. Texas and Xavier was 4/5 main starters. Maimi 3/5.  

Irony is majorly of teams who live at top 15 level, are made up of transfers. 

Here is example at Texas Tech when they brought in 9 and when to sweet 16. 

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/ncaa-basketball/news/texas-tech-transfer-portal-sweet-16/itde2lojxnpfebsjtcuaxny7

Okay, so true; it is possible.

But it’s not likely, especially in light of these portal-ists likely perception of the program.

It also most certainly does not fit Indiana’s brand. Our fan base does not want to root for mercenaries, though I suppose if they’re winning mercenaries people would come around.

Color me extremely skeptical.

[RaceToTheTop 24,940]

12 minutes ago, Ngw7183 said:

No, there are tons of examples guys. A lot considering this is a new thing that keeps changing and small sample size.

Last year, KSU had 12 of them. UConn’s was loaded with transfers. SD St 4 of 5 top scorers were transfers. Texas and Xavier was 4/5 main starters. Maimi 3/5.  

Irony is majorly of teams who live at top 15 level, are made up of transfers. 

Here is example at Texas Tech when they brought in 9 and when to sweet 16. 

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/ncaa-basketball/news/texas-tech-transfer-portal-sweet-16/itde2lojxnpfebsjtcuaxny7

You made a quote about 65% of the sweet sixteen consisting of transfers one year.  I get that teams consist of a lot of transfers and that includes winners but I’m doubting that 65% number.

[ronzo4IU 104]

It does seem like a really good way to not have to go out on the high school recruiting trail though.

[Hoosier1984 1,554]

27 minutes ago, southernindianahoosier2 said:

Posted elsewhere but:

Woodson wants to buy experienced, aging, and expensive players turning IU into the Yankees.

But given his 2 point guards that stylistic couldn’t be further apart, he doesn’t have a strategy on what he’s going to target to plug into his system that has yet to be defined.

And in doing so, we’ll likely miss on Dusty May

What have I missed?

Kathy is spelt with a C

[AZ Hoosier 6,547]

19 minutes ago, OKHOOSIER said:

To go in a different direction, and I am just spit balling here, what does everyone think about potential locker room dynamics with the players that stay and the players we purchase? Does it fracture? Really curious how someone like MR or GC would feel about playing with 4-6 new hired hands? Seems awkward, but maybe money is all that matters and as long as everyone is getting theirs it will be fine. Thoughts?

And a twist on your thought... how does the amount of money an MM or MR might get vs what a mercenary might get affect team chemistry? I don't see this scenario working at all... too many variables placed in the hands of a man that can't coach... but I would like to watch a post game press conference or two. :D 

[PartyintheVillas 36]

I bet the academic support staff is thrilled with bringing in 9 transfers a year.

[Stuhoo 79,705]

2 minutes ago, Ngw7183 said:

With all that, not going to keep arguing it. 

Understand most feel it won’t work even when given examples. That is fine. 

Understand - sleepy, forgetful, lazy Woody needs to go. But he isn’t and you might want to look into how this might work because it is the plan. There are more positive examples than you may realize with this bouncing right back to a tourney team. Not going to write a thesis on it and cite every example.

we can agree do disagree and will see how it works. Plenty were wrong on their projections for this year and certain players. Maybe you will be wrong on this and pleasantly surprised. 

Dang, if I was pleasantly surprised and it worked? That’d be fantastic.

I appreciate your caveat that we have to keep enough pieces from the current team. The first hint toward that will be seeing who goes through senior night tomorrow.

[OKHOOSIER 1,979]

Just now, Stuhoo said:

Okay, so true; it is possible.

But it’s not likely, especially in light of these portal-ists likely perception of the program.

It also most certainly does not fit Indiana’s brand. Our fan base does not want to root for mercenaries, though I suppose if they’re winning mercenaries people would come around.

Color me extremely skeptical.

Except those examples given other than San Diego State involved what we want here: new coaches. That is the difference. TT is probably the best example for the style, given they have continued to go portal heavy after the Beard exodus. That could also be a side effect of recruiting to Lubbock Texas vs a program decision. UCONN is simply a fabrication. They had 1 transfer portal this year (Cam Spencer) and three the year before. KSU, also new coach, had 2 for this year. Teams basically are not doing this unless they have to. 

[IUCrazy2 2,341]

1 minute ago, PartyintheVillas said:

I bet the academic support staff is thrilled with bringing in 9 transfers a year.

School!!!?  We talking about school!!!??

[8bucks 6,347]

3 minutes ago, RaceToTheTop said:

You made a quote about 65% of the sweet sixteen consisting of transfers one year.  I get that teams consist of a lot of transfers and that includes winners but I’m doubting that 65% number.

I can’t imagine 65% unless maybe that is just players who play considerably. This article outlines how impactful the portal has been and there were some teams with no transfers and some with a ton. 
 

https://www.on3.com/transfer-portal/news/how-each-team-has-used-the-transfer-portal-to-get-to-the-sweet-16-alabama-houston-kansas-state/

[Muskie for three 307]

2 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

Dang, if I was pleasantly surprised and it worked? That’d be fantastic.

I appreciate your caveat that we have to keep enough pieces from the current team. The first hint toward that will be seeing who goes through senior night tomorrow.

That might be the most important money spent for players .

[JF87 1,413]

32 minutes ago, theriverpilot said:

Some interesting points but what insight(s) do you have to label these additions as “probable”? I ask because Woodson already has a reputation for hit-n-miss on the higher level portal players. 
Also, what’s plan B if those probable additions don’t pan out?

My guess is dollar amounts needed have been discussed with the players representative. 

[Uspshoosier 45,047]

6 minutes ago, Ngw7183 said:

There are more positive examples than you may realize with this bouncing right back to a tourney team.

That’s not the end result though.   Woody came back to win B1G titles and National Titles.   Sure any coach can turn it around from a non tourney team to a tourney team.  The difference between a bubble team that makes it to a teams that don’t is very small.   Sure Woody can piece together a tourney team there are 36 at large chances to do that but can he piece together a B1G or National title team?   In my opinion he won’t ever sniff either one of those 

[wirenuts 1,055]

The hope that I have in all of this is that dusty may covets the IU job enough to wait around a year. If he goes to Ohio state, he will stomp our ***** for the next decade

[Banksyrules 4,525]

45 minutes ago, Ngw7183 said:

You can be skeptical but former elite athletes rarely ever lose the will and competitiveness. 
 

His did have a “young” team with Ware, Malik, MM being his best guys. This is why he will get more upper class starters this year. 

My guy they're all competitive. What separates them from each other? Time. Effort. Talent all of which he sorely lacks. 

[Demo 19,620]

Since Woody has lost faith in young players, we’ve found the perfect 24-25 Indiana Hoosier. 28 years old and 3 years of eligibility.