BGleas

Or, just maybe we're replacing 4 starters and more, so I'm describing what I'm looking for in those replacements. It wasn't a refection of those starters were losing. Hmm LMAO! And no, I wouldn't consider Bates a "dawg" that doesn't mean our team didn't have that. Especially in the PSU example we were discussing on HSN.

I think we're largely agreeing. I want multi-skilled athletes all over the court, especially the 1-4. Banks fits the profile of an ideal 4, but agree that he might not be ready yet and that we need to find someone ready to play that spot while Banks develops. I guess my point on needing bigs and Reneau is that I do not want a lineup of Reneau at the 4 and an even bigger, post players at the 5. That brings us right back to where we've been but with a drop-off because none of those guys will be as good as TJD. We need an athletic 5 as you described with multi-dimensional athletes and skilled players surrounding that big. For now, Reneau is what we have at that spot and he is very promising, albeit not the ideal profile. But, I do not want another big that takes back to having two post players in the lineup. That just doesn't fit the profile of teams going deep in March. Again, I think we're largely agreeing here in what we want the team to look like, just coming at it from a bit different angles.

Completely agree. You need a defensive minded backup there that can actually give you 15-20mpg. A guys with length and that offensively can pick and rim run/finish. But not a post guy offensively.

You're too focused on the "stars" or what people had hoped Bates and Geronimo were. The reality is both guys are one-dimensional players. Forget the rankings and the potential, and go get multi-skilled players that can do multiple things on both ends. That's what these teams still playing have. No, they don't have anyone with Bates "potential", but they have guys that can do a variety of things on both ends. Guys that can bit shots, create shots and are dawgs. Despite the potential and athleticism, that isn't Bates or Geronimo.

I'm not really worried about the 5, and really don't want a post-dominant 5 coming in that wants to start. We need athletes and multi-skilled ballers at the 1-4. These teams from the Sweet Sixteen on aren't built with post-dominant 5's and aren't running their offense through the post. Woodson has also said he doesn't really want that. Let's go with Reneau at the 5, go get him a quality, serviceable athletic backup that can rebound, block some shots and switch defensively. Then go fill out the roster with multi-skilled, athletic dawgs and ballers that just love to hoop. I want guys like Banks at the 4, and go get a guy in the Watford, Troy Williams, Miller (kid from Miami), Jalen Wilson or Pickett mold at the 4, and then find as many ballers and hoopers at the 1-3 as you can. I don't think either of the Furst or Kaufman-Renn rumors are true, but even if they are I would really only want those guys backing up Reneau. Not starting alongside him.

I think you're overthinking this. According to several reports we were very much in with Dexter Dennis and several other high level transfers in the event that TJD and Race Thompson left last offseason. Both guys stayed, so sticking with the current group made sense. So by most reports Woodson had guys ready. Then his two current recruiting classes mirror the style of play with JHS, Banks, Gunn, Reneau, Cupps and Newton. Those two classes are one big (Reneau), a combo guard (JHS) an athletic wing(Gunn), a long, athletic forward/wing combo (Banks), a skilled PG (Cupps) and an ultra-athletic guard/wing (Newton).

Exactly. Especially when you're pretty consistent in getting top 5 or so seeds, with the occasional 1-2 seed mixed in. Before someone references Crean, he never had that consistency. Keep racking up top 4-5 seed apparences and you'll more then likely breakthrough. Jay Wright, Bo Ryan, Tony Bennett, Lute Olsen back in the day, etc.

They haven't been mediocre though. Losing in the tournament doesn't make them mediocre. Bad losses? Absolutely. But, he's won 25+ games in 6 of the last 8 years. During that time he's won outright or shared 3 Big Ten regular season titles and a BTT Title. He's been to 4 Sweet Sixteens and an Elite 8. I get it, getting to Final Four's and winning a National Title is the ultimate goal, but fans put way too much on a single elimination tournament. Again, the losses the last 3 tournaments have been bad. I'm not debating against that. But you don't fire a coach with his record and consistency. I mean, Jay Wright was a coach that couldn't win in March...until he did. There are other examples of coaches that took a long time to get to a Final Four or win a title. I hope Purdue and Painter never get there, but the tournament is about 'at-bats' as a high seed, and Matt Painter gives that. Firing him would be a huge mistake.

Firing Matt Painter would be crazy.

There is nobody worse at any job then a college ref calling a charge. They're obsessed with everything being a charge. That call was horrible.

I agree. Galloway has had a good year and by far been the better player. The good news is that with Galloway, Kopp and Bates there are plenty of minutes to go around for each. For Bates, it's all about defense. When he isn't a negative defensively, and he often is, then he gets the time to settle in offensively. The 2nd half against Michigan at home and in the BTT he was bringing it defensively so he got more time to get into a flow offensively. It's pretty simple for him.

As of late, It was really just the home game vs Iowa and the game at MSU, otherwise we've been pretty good defending the 3. In conference games, our 3pt defense was 3rd in the conference.

I'm going to have to record today's game and watch later tonight, so do want to make one note after my posts earlier. As I said earlier, I think JG is basically a matchup play at this point, but I do think today could be one of those days. I think Reneau could struggle with a smaller, perimeter oriented PSU and get in foul trouble if he's on Pickett. I do think JG could have success today if he gets the opportunity. He could effectively play minutes on Pickett IMO.

Ok, sounds good. Though curious why you deleted the section on Galloway/Kopp/Stewart from last season when you quoted me?

Race was terrible yesterday, completely agree. He's been up and down since coming back. JG was bad in limited minutes yesterday too, and Malik was great in the 2nd half. JG had a great game and a half when Race was hurt, he was average to bad the other 3 and a half games. It's not really debatable. The reality is that two coaching staffs haven't trusted him. I wish that wasn't the case, but he just hasn't earned the minutes. Bates hasn't largely either. Bates is often a defensive liability. When he focuses on defense he plays, when he doesn't he's unplayable. 2nd half against Michigan and 2nd half yesterday he was locked in defensively and he was rewarded for it. He just rarely does that. Some notes on the Stewart/Kopp thing: There was a 7 out of 8 game stretch last season in Jan/Feb before Galloway's groin injury, where he played more minutes then at least one of Kopp or Stewart and in most of those games he played more then both. There was a 3 out 4 game stretch where both Kopp and Stewart's minutes were in the teens and Galloway's were 20+. He also started 3 games in a row before his groin injury. Honestly, it feels like you're creating this Woodson narrative because you hitched your wagon so hard to JG the last two years and it just hasn't happened for him.