2022-2023 IUBB Roster Projection

[hoosierbgh]

28 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

The “burning bridges with Indiana high school coaches” stuff is overblown. Woody didn’t recruit Leal. Through two years at IU he hasn’t shown an ability to contribute at this level. If you have the chance to substitute someone like Sean McNeil for an end of the bench guy like Leal, you take it. If it makes Leal’s high school coach mad, who cares? How many times do we recruit players from his high school? 

Woody has a top 5 recruiting class, only 1 of the players is from Indiana, and he’s by far the lowest ranking player in the class. There’s nothing special in the water at Indiana high schools. Indiana players are far less important when you can recruit nationally and land 5 star recruits from prep schools across the country. That’s the route Woody’s trying to take. 

Maybe, maybe not. Either way running Leal off is still really shortsighted and not the most likely scenario. 

I don't really care where recruits come from as long as they buy in but eventually Woody is going to want and need top talent from Indiana regardless of where else he's getting recruits. Overlooking talent close to home because he's having success elsewhere is again shortsighted. It's not all or nothing. 

[Chris007]

I guess I'm the only one who looks at next year's roster and says if we have to cut someone Leal is the obvious answer. I have him as #13 on the roster. I have all freshmen ahead of him by the time the season starts. Gunn can shoot it as well and is a lot more athletic. But I'm not on the staff so we'll see what happens.

[Chris007]

1 minute ago, hoosierbgh said:

Maybe, maybe not. Either way running Leal off is still really shortsighted and not the most likely scenario. 

I don't really care where recruits come from as long as they buy in but eventually Woody is going to want and need top talent from Indiana regardless of where else he's getting recruits. Overlooking talent close to home because he's having success elsewhere is again shortsighted. It's not all or nothing. 

So if not Leal then who?

[Class of '66 Old Fart]

From Assembly Call last night -

If Trayce returns next season, Indiana will have FOUR players on its roster ranked in the top-35 in the RSCI composite recruiting rankings.  That's never happened in the 24-year RSCI database.  We had three in 2016 (Yogi, TB, JB) and in 2005 (Bracey, DJ, Vaden).

[hoosierbgh]

2 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

So if not Leal then who?

Experience says it will likely be someone relatively few of us want to lose. Kopp actually makes the most sense to me.  To be clear I like him better than many but with only one year left and the prospect of falling far down the depth chart, I could see him being persuaded to move on. I think JG is the most likely to leave though, unfortunately. 

[IUc2016]

11 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

So if not Leal then who?

LD. I was never impressed with him when we recruited him. then the few minutes I saw him get this year he looked awkward and way out of his league. 

Leal can provide quality minutes when needed and will embrace the role of good teammate and bench mob. 

[hoosierbgh]

1 minute ago, IUc2016 said:

LD. I was never impressed with him when we recruited him. then the few minutes I saw him get this year he looked awkward and way out of his league. 

Leal can provide quality minutes when needed and will embrace the role of good teammate and bench mob. 

I could see LD deciding to move on if TJD returns, especially after adding Reneau. However, your description of him fits the vast majority of non 5 star freshman bigs going to high major schools. It fits plenty of 5 star freshman bigs too. 

[JimmerNoe]

I think the big gamble with running someone off or asking someone to leave is that you better make sure you win big as a result.

If those guys leaving turns you into a perennial power again, it doesn’t matter, because kids will want to come play for a top of the BIG Indiana.

But if you have one season of success and then need to dip back into those waters after a down year, they may not be as ready to drop everything for us. I personally love Leal and think it would be awkward to ask not only a Mr. Basketball, but a Bloomington native to leave.

[Trish]

We had a walk-on play before Logan this year. He may not be ready and may need another year which happens in college basketball, yes.

Sure he was ranked nicely but from our history, we know rankings really don't mean anything.

If Woodson is playing a walk-on before a scholarship player, we may have a problem. 

I rather "Crean" Logan than Leal. Leal is the hometown kid, indiana fan growing up. We can't play everyone but Leal is the culture kid you need in your program. 

[Chris007]

16 minutes ago, IUc2016 said:

LD. I was never impressed with him when we recruited him. then the few minutes I saw him get this year he looked awkward and way out of his league. 

Leal can provide quality minutes when needed and will embrace the role of good teammate and bench mob. 

But at some point, Leal has to become more than just a cheerleader using up a scholarship. 

[cthomas]

2 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

But at some point, Leal has to become more than just a cheerleader using up a scholarship. 

I'm not so sure that he does. There won't be many minutes for those last three or four spots on the roster. Guys filling those spots who are also good for the culture are hard to find. 

[MoyeNeeded]

9 minutes ago, Trish said:

We had a walk-on play before Logan this year. He may not be ready and may need another year which happens in college basketball, yes.

Sure he was ranked nicely but from our history, we know rankings really don't mean anything.

If Woodson is playing a walk-on before a scholarship player, we may have a problem. 

I rather "Crean" Logan than Leal. Leal is the hometown kid, indiana fan growing up. We can't play everyone but Leal is the culture kid you need in your program. 

Fans would be at a high majority that getting rid of Leal is highly unacceptable.

[IUc2016]

8 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

But at some point, Leal has to become more than just a cheerleader using up a scholarship. 

I disagree. The 12-13th kid on the roster doesn't play unless injuries plague the team. It is nice to have someone in that spot who is a great teammate and won't be pissed at lack of playing time causing issues in the locker room. 

[MikeRoberts]

8 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

But at some point, Leal has to become more than just a cheerleader using up a scholarship. 

I don’t understand the need to get rid of anyone at this point. You cannot have 13 guys that get minutes and players 11-13 will likely never get anything more than mop up time.

so 11-13 are the good teammates, the good practice players, the good for the program kids and Leal is all that. If Woodson needs more than 11 scholarships to construct a well rounded team than he is doing it wrong.

most of the top schools either don’t use all of their scholarships or have a few guys like Leal at the end of it

[HoosierHoops1]

34 minutes ago, cthomas said:

I'm not so sure that he does. There won't be many minutes for those last three or four spots on the roster. Guys filling those spots who are also good for the culture are hard to find. 

We wouldn't be trading the 13th for a planned 10-13 type player. If we got a new player at the expense of a current player, they would be expected to be in the rotation.

[HoosierHoops1]

45 minutes ago, Trish said:

We had a walk-on play before Logan this year. He may not be ready and may need another year which happens in college basketball, yes.

Sure he was ranked nicely but from our history, we know rankings really don't mean anything.

If Woodson is playing a walk-on before a scholarship player, we may have a problem. 

I rather "Crean" Logan than Leal. Leal is the hometown kid, indiana fan growing up. We can't play everyone but Leal is the culture kid you need in your program. 

I think the walk-on went in as a wing, guard. Wasn't playing in a spot that LD would occupy.

[RaceToTheTop]

57 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

But at some point, Leal has to become more than just a cheerleader using up a scholarship. 

To me the question is whose minutes does Dennis get if he comes to IU?  If Trayce returns and JG returns, IMO that's a really full roster already (and I am still of the opinion that next year JG can play the 3).

1's:  JHS and X.....with one moving to the 2 when both are in.

Galloway can play 1-3.

Bates can play the 2 or 3.

Gunn is a 2 or 3.

Leal is a 2 or 3.

Kopp is a 3.

Banks is a 3.

JG is a 3 or 4.

Reneau is a 4.

Race is a 4 or 5.

TJD is a 5.

Duncomb is a 5.

Personally, I'm not big on having JG/Reneau/Race/TJD splitting a total of 80 minutes, which means that one has to get some minutes at the 3 to increase that number.  Best candidate is JG.  Leal likely isn't getting many minutes.  My guess is that Banks will get some time but not major minutes.  If JG gets 10 minutes at the 3, that's 110 minutes for JHS/X/Kopp/Galloway/Bates.  If you figure them getting 30/30/20/20/10 in some manner, where do Dennis's minutes come from?  It's not coming from Leal because he wasn't getting many minutes anyway.  Also not coming from Gunn who likely doesn't play much and in the scenario I've given, neither is Banks.  I can't find a scenario where Dennis gets any kind of real time on the court.....and I'm not sure after playing 30 minutes/game for four years at Wichita State why he would want to enter a scenario where he is always going to be south of 20 minutes.  

[RaceToTheTop]

25 minutes ago, HoosierHoops1 said:

We wouldn't be trading the 13th for a planned 10-13 type player. If we got a new player at the expense of a current player, they would be expected to be in the rotation.

But where is Dennis in the 10?  

To me if he is slotted above Bates, JG, and Galloway, you are taking away minutes from guys who could be here for three more years and could use court time for a guy who would be here for one year and only offers a moderate upgrade.  Defensively, Dennis is very, very good.  Offensively, he's not.

IF the staff knows we have a player that is wanting to move on for whatever reason (which I think the two most likely candidates would be JG or Kopp), then bringing in Dennis or McNeil makes sense.    Forcing out someone for a moderate upgrade doesn't make sense IMO.  It's not that we are trading Leal's minutes for Dennis if Leal leaves because Leal isn't projected to get minutes anyway.  Instead, Dennis would be coming in and getting minutes from Bates or someone that is already a rotational player.  

[rcbowla]

When's the last time anyone used a 13 man rotation even remotely consistently? Pushing Leal out to make room for a talented kid that will be pissed off on the end of the bench makes zero sense to me. Leal is perfect for the role and has 3 years left but we want someone who is more talented and more likely to pout when the PT isn't there and then leave after 1 year? What does that accomplish besides pissing off two kids and the people close to them?

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[Hoosierfan2017]

23 minutes ago, HoosierHoops1 said:

We wouldn't be trading the 13th for a planned 10-13 type player. If we got a new player at the expense of a current player, they would be expected to be in the rotation.

That’s why I’m 100% in favor of it. We’re not talking about swapping Leal for a different 13th guy. We’d be replacing the 13th guy with a rotation player, which in turn would push someone else to the end of the line. It’d make us a better team. I think McNeil makes us better next year than Leal does, so it’s a no brainer to me. Talent wins in basketball. Acquire as much of it as you can. That leads to winning, which leads to momentum, which leads to top recruits.

We got some momentum last year when we made it to the semifinals of the conference tournament and then made the NCAA tournament. If we lose to Michigan and miss the tournament do we still get Malik? Maybe, but the staff wouldn’t have as much to sell, and some of our guys like Race and Xavier may have left. 

Elite programs push out and recruit over guys all the time. They still land top talent. If IU becomes an elite team again we wont have to worry about it either.