College Bball Thread

[Ryno6284 2,628]

On 4/19/2021 at 2:12 PM, ElectricBoogaloo said:

There is an interesting history there with it being a French word.

I'm pretty sure the French have a different word for cockburn.

Gonorrhea?

[Stuhoo 80,103]

Lunardi pegged us as a 7 seed today. Not sure if he included Kopp in his equation.

[go iu bb 5,644]

Grading the coaching hires from 2017.

Spoiler: IU/Miller get a C (which seems generous to me)

 

https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/college-basketball-coaching-changes-grading-the-best-and-worst-hires-from-2017-after-a-full-recruiting-cycle/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=news_tab&utm_content=algorithm

[Brass Cannon 24,485]

6 minutes ago, go iu bb said:

Grading the coaching hires from 2017.

Spoiler: IU/Miller get a C (which seems generous to me)

 

https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/college-basketball-coaching-changes-grading-the-best-and-worst-hires-from-2017-after-a-full-recruiting-cycle/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=news_tab&utm_content=algorithm

A C?  Who did the grading? UNC? 

[go iu bb 5,644]

6 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

A C?  Who did the grading? UNC? 

It certainly wasn't a Purdue great or anyone else from the B1G. They would've given it an A or A+.

[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,205]

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,205]

He needs to call them out

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

[Brass Cannon 24,485]

3 minutes ago, woodenshoemanHoosierfan said:

 

 

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 

 

Pretty sure it doesn’t violate any actual rules though. 
 

There’s nothing to stop Woodson from telling a kids high school coach that he would love to recruit him if he ever gets the chance again. 

[cthomas 6,391]

We are already on the slippery slope. College basketball is going to look a lot like the NBA going forward. I don't like it but think we are perfectly positioned to take advantage of it. The kids who have come to IU in the last few weeks have all referenced CMW's NBA experience as a reason for choosing IU. Those who panned IU hiring CMW are going to be on the outside of the new nature of college basketball.

[Brass Cannon 24,485]

1 minute ago, cthomas said:

We are already on the slippery slope. College basketball is going to look a lot like the NBA going forward. I don't like it but think we are perfectly positioned to take advantage of it. The kids who have come to IU in the last few weeks have all referenced CMW's NBA experience as a reason for choosing IU. Those who panned IU hiring CMW are going to be on the outside of the new nature of college basketball.

Agreed. Programs able to lure kids with facilities will be well poised.  
 

There’s also an advantage to building thru transfers.  They have exhausted their one time transfer. So as a head coach they will be less likely to transfer again. 

[RaceToTheTop 25,278]

8 hours ago, woodenshoemanHoosierfan said:

 

 

He needs to call them out

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 

 

Not sure that a rule should be made that only helps out players who haven’t produced.  
 

Truth, in my opinion, is that for years we have treated athletes differently in terms of transferring than we have other students.  That’s wrong.  While it sucks to have a player you’ve invested time in leave, that’s life.  

[Josh 12,610]

8 hours ago, go iu bb said:

Grading the coaching hires from 2017.

Spoiler: IU/Miller get a C (which seems generous to me)

 

https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/college-basketball-coaching-changes-grading-the-best-and-worst-hires-from-2017-after-a-full-recruiting-cycle/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=news_tab&utm_content=algorithm

It's a generous grade because he's trying to save face from calling it a home run hire initially.  I've seen many people saying that he was a great hire that just underperformed.  No.  He performed exactly the way it was expected for such a terrible hire.  He was an F then, he's an F now.  People are just too proud to admit they were wrong 4 years ago.

[RaceToTheTop 25,278]

7 hours ago, Brass Cannon said:

Agreed. Programs able to lure kids with facilities will be well poised.  
 

There’s also an advantage to building thru transfers.  They have exhausted their one time transfer. So as a head coach they will be less likely to transfer again. 

On the other end, programs with playing time/feature roles to offer also can bring in players.  I think we are seeing an exchange of low/mid major players who have succeeded and  players at p6 conferences who haven’t been getting much PT.  But those players transferring from the high majors,despite lack of PT, were there for a reason — their talent didn’t just disappear.

[Dave from Dayton 3,062]

31 minutes ago, Josh said:

It's a generous grade because he's trying to save face from calling it a home run hire initially.  I've seen many people saying that he was a great hire that just underperformed.  No.  He performed exactly the way it was expected for such a terrible hire.  He was an F then, he's an F now.  People are just too proud to admit they were wrong 4 years ago.

I did not have Archie Miller in my top 4 prospective coach hires.  But, I did think that he would get a look.  And I was pleasantly surprised that he was hired.  Thought he was a better fit for IU than any of the previous coaches since RMK.

Heck, his teams beat Syracuse and OSU etc in the NCAAT.  His teams played like teams.  Improved throughout the year.  Sure, it was Dayton.  But, he turned Dayton into a winner after Brian Gregory.  The cupboard was left bare.  He left Dayton in a very good position.

Defense worked at Dayton.  He had very good ballers.  They dove for the loose balls.

But, that didn't work at IU.  Was it Archie Miller's coaching? Well, he is responsible, right?

It couldn't be that he couldn't turn IU around because of the crap handed to him by Crean and Glass.  Miller never did get a good PG to initiate his offense.  That is on Miller.  Miller never got the team to play like a team...integrating Romeo into the idea of sharing the ball and playing as a team did not happen.  That lack of getting IU a new culture did not work.  That is on Miller, too.   

The injury card could be played.  Rob P getting his head banged...never really came back to what was envisioned when he was a freshman.  Romeo's hand, Brunk's back, Al's ankle, Armaan's ankle...just to mention a few.  But injuries hit all teams, right?

But, isn't some of the problem on Glass and the inability to get rid of players because of the grades issues?  

So, the players kept good grades, and there was a reloading going on.  The latter was way too slow.  Especially after the extension that Glass gave Crean.  Miller had to go.  He had lost the team and the momentum in recruiting.

I wouldn't give his hire and his performance F's.   The hire, maybe a C.  His performance maybe a C- or a D+.  IU settled on Archie Miller...seems IU could not attract the best coaches.

Things have changed with Dolson at the top.    IU seems to have a vision...for the future...and keeping IU's basketball history, now with CMW.  NBA-style is being implemented...with IU's banners held up for all to see.  But, the push on expanding recruiting beyond the boarders of the state is different.  

It wasn't all Archie's fault.  But he did have to go.  It was past time.

 

Edited April 21, 2021 by Dave from Dayton

[Josh 12,610]

15 minutes ago, Dave from Dayton said:

But, isn't some of that on Glass and the inability to get rid of players because of the grades issues?  

So, the players kept good grades, and there was a reloading going on.  The latter was way too slow.  Especially after the extension that Glass gave Crean.  Miller had to go.  He had lost the team and the momentum in recruiting.

 

I'm sorry, but this is an excuse.  I don't even believe it to be true.  I've heard rumors that he wasn't allowed to lose any players, but that's refutable by facts.  Firstly, he booted Grant Gelon.  Secondly, he could have released recruits from their LOI with no apr hit.  Instead, he pushed to keep them.  Sorry, but the story doesn't add up.

Even if Glass told him to keep the players so there wasn't an apr hit, we have to think about what that means.  The apr hit would have kept us out of the ncaa tournament.  Clearly Glass must have thought this was an ncaa team, and the fact that Miller couldn't get the team there would indicate that Miller was a big flop in his eyes instantly.  

The only thing I blame Glass for was hiring a terrible coach.  Everything else is on Archie.

[Dave from Dayton 3,062]

53 minutes ago, Josh said:

I'm sorry, but this is an excuse.  I don't even believe it to be true.  I've heard rumors that he wasn't allowed to lose any players, but that's refutable by facts.  Firstly, he booted Grant Gelon.  Secondly, he could have released recruits from their LOI with no apr hit.  Instead, he pushed to keep them.  Sorry, but the story doesn't add up.

Even if Glass told him to keep the players so there wasn't an apr hit, we have to think about what that means.  The apr hit would have kept us out of the ncaa tournament.  Clearly Glass must have thought this was an ncaa team, and the fact that Miller couldn't get the team there would indicate that Miller was a big flop in his eyes instantly.  

The only thing I blame Glass for was hiring a terrible coach.  Everything else is on Archie.

The APR is just one of the issues that was there.  It seemed to exist.  I also do not know beyond a shadow of a doubt.  It is not refutable by facts that you present.  Those are somewhat circumstantial.  Plus, the released recruits do not hit the APR.  And you ignore the fact that if he had done that, late in the recruiting period, then the cupboard would have been even more depleted.

You ignore the injuries, you ignore the recruiting inside of the state issue.  You ignore the support to the staff that Dolson obviously is doing to supplement CMW.  That did not happen for Archie Miller's staff.

Not so much excuses as everything is not dependent solely on the coach.  The coach has to be put in the position to take advantage of the situations.  Glass didn't give Archie Miller a boost like Dolson is giving CMW.

But, clearly, Archie Miller didn't perform up to IU's standards. But IU is not on probation.  IU is in good shape APR wise.  IU's cupboard was not bare.  And the in-state recruiting is not broken like Crean left it.

Edited April 21, 2021 by Dave from Dayton

[Josh 12,610]

46 minutes ago, Dave from Dayton said:

The APR is just one of the issues that was there.  It seemed to exist.  I also do not know beyond a shadow of a doubt.  It is not refutable by facts that you present.  Those are somewhat circumstantial.  Plus, the released recruits do not hit the APR.  And you ignore the fact that if he had done that, late in the recruiting period, then the cupboard would have been even more depleted.

You ignore the injuries, you ignore the recruiting inside of the state issue.  You ignore the support to the staff that Dolson obviously is doing to supplement CMW.  That did not happen for Archie Miller's staff.

Not so much excuses as everything is not dependent solely on the coach.  The coach has to be put in the position to take advantage of the situations.  Glass didn't give Archie Miller a boost like Dolson is giving CMW.

But, clearly, Archie Miller didn't perform up to IU's standards. But IU is not on probation.  IU is in good shape APR wise.  IU's cupboard was not bare.  And the in-state recruiting is not broken like Crean left it.

I'm not ignoring anything.  I'm very cognizant of all the issues Archie had.  These were his issues that he either did not fix, would not fix, or broke himself.  He was a terrible coach.

All the rest is excuses.

[Honkyman 1,670]

Dave from Dayton said: "And the in-state recruiting is not broken like Crean left it."

_____________

"In-state recruiting is not broken..."?  IU did not receive a commitment from a single member of Indiana's 2021 high school class, considered to be the best in several years. The two best 2021 players--Trey Kaufman and Caleb Furst--are headed to Purdue. The in-state recruiting, if not broken, was in steep decline under Archie Miller as many players had realized that the program was a mess.

 

[reconmkd 4,348]

4 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Dave from Dayton said: "And the in-state recruiting is not broken like Crean left it."

_____________

"In-state recruiting is not broken..."?  IU did not receive a commitment from a single member of Indiana's 2021 high school class, considered to be the best in several years. The two best 2021 players--Trey Kaufman and Caleb Furst--are headed to Purdue. The in-state recruiting, if not broken, was in steep decline under Archie Miller as many players had realized that the program was a mess.

 

Lander was 2021 class but reclassed. Not arguing just stating facts, I have no dog in this one.

[go iu bb 5,644]

1 hour ago, Honkyman said:

Dave from Dayton said: "And the in-state recruiting is not broken like Crean left it."

_____________

"In-state recruiting is not broken..."?  IU did not receive a commitment from a single member of Indiana's 2021 high school class, considered to be the best in several years. The two best 2021 players--Trey Kaufman and Caleb Furst--are headed to Purdue. The in-state recruiting, if not broken, was in steep decline under Archie Miller as many players had realized that the program was a mess.

 

Crean alienated many of the state's HS and AAU coaches. I think Dave was referring to that and not missing out on recruits because of a bad product on the floor.