Mike Woodson to be next IUBB coach. Thad Matta to be associate AD

[Papacap]

8 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Lunacy? Yeah, in my opinion.  

A 63 year old head coach giving college his first try.  No system in place to be an elite recruiter.  Players will have to just trust him because he can’t point to prior success.  
 

Ask yourself this, if any other B1G team made this hire or an equivalent hire based on all the on paper data we would fully expect it to fail.  
 

Doesn’t mean it will, and I hope it doesn’t. 

No, I wouldn’t expect it to fail. It might fail. And I might think there were better options. But I wouldn’t expect it to fail. Because I don’t understand the thought that Woodson won’t be able to recruit. It’s not rocket science. It’s developing relationships. And I think Woodson will be able to do that. Am I guaranteeing it? No. But I think Woodson will be able to the type of players he wants.

The last two hires, we selected coaches that made a deep run in the tourney and had some success at their school. Worked wonders for us. Guess we should have done that again based on the paper data you referenced.

 

 

Edited March 31, 2021 by Papacap

[WayneFleekHoosier]

3 minutes ago, mdiu28 said:

Lolz. It seems like you're the one that's already convinced yourself of something....

I can't stand how some people only care about the "stars" attached to a recruits name. Like that translates to instant success. If Woody can develop kids, I'd argue that's a hell of a lot better - see Victor Oladipo and OG Anunoby - find guys that have athleticism and an incredible work ethic and sign them up. 

I have strong opinions. I’ve been right almost universally.  I’m happy to see what Woodson can do.  I was done with Archie a year ago.  So any change is at least a chance at a better product.  
 

It’s not all about “stars” to me but attracting those “stars” is what ALL coaches try to do because they know it gives them the best odds of success.  The transfer market might shift the demand on the principle.  We will see. 

[8bucks]

Lunacy? Yeah, in my opinion.  
A 63 year old head coach giving college his first try.  No system in place to be an elite recruiter.  Players will have to just trust him because he can’t point to prior success.  
 
Ask yourself this, if any other B1G team made this hire or an equivalent hire based on all the on paper data we would fully expect it to fail.  
 
Doesn’t mean it will, and I hope it doesn’t. 

We definitely would have made fun of the hire. We always laugh at our opponents when we think they did worse or something we would never do. We have been wrong so often on these as well. We even thought we had the best staff in basketball when Archie started.

I don’t mind the hire even if not my top choice and I hope all this expert opinion criticism from the media fuels him towards early success. This though may require some luck in recruiting as his player development will take some time I would think.




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[WayneFleekHoosier]

4 minutes ago, Papacap said:

No, I wouldn’t expect it to fail. It might fail. And I might think there were better options. But I wouldn’t expect it to fail. Because I don’t understand the thought that Woodson won’t be able to recruit. It’s not rocket science. It’s developing relationships. And I think Woodson will be able to do that. Am I guaranteeing it? No. But I think Woodson will be able to the type of players he wants.

The last two hires, we selected coaches that made a deep run in the tourney and had some success at their school. Worked wonders for us. Guess we should have done that again based on the paper data you referenced.

 

 

Nope. I haven’t been happy with any coach selection so far.  
 

1-When Crean was hired, I wanted Few or Tony Bennett

2-Miller- wanted Donovan, Bennett, or a stealing of a successful power 5 coach. 
 

3. Woodson- Stevens, Scott Drew, Oats, or the stealing of a succesful power 5 coach.  
 

I realize I’ve had my hopes too high, but if reports of 7 mil a year are true we could have aimed so much higher.  
 

one big plus, is the older alumni/players feel warm and cuddly about this hire.  And maybe that’s the secret sauce.  Dakich has been saying it for years. We are about to find out. 

[Papacap]

3 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Nope. I haven’t been happy with any coach selection so far.  
 

1-When Crean was hired, I wanted Few or Tony Bennett

2-Miller- wanted Donovan, Bennett, or a stealing of a successful power 5 coach. 
 

3. Woodson- Stevens, Scott Drew, Oats, or the stealing of a succesful power 5 coach.  
 

I realize I’ve had my hopes too high, but if reports of 7 mil a year are true we could have aimed so much higher.  
 

one big plus, is the older alumni/players feel warm and cuddly about this hire.  And maybe that’s the secret sauce.  Dakich has been saying it for years. We are about to find out. 

OK, if you are aiming that high, I get it the disappointment for the last 3 hires. And the beauty of it is, results will determine this, so it’s not like we won’t find out if this will work.

[IUBBx5Banners]

12 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Nope. I haven’t been happy with any coach selection so far.  
 

1-When Crean was hired, I wanted Few or Tony Bennett

2-Miller- wanted Donovan, Bennett, or a stealing of a successful power 5 coach. 
 

3. Woodson- Stevens, Scott Drew, Oats, or the stealing of a succesful power 5 coach.  
 

I realize I’ve had my hopes too high, but if reports of 7 mil a year are true we could have aimed so much higher.  
 

one big plus, is the older alumni/players feel warm and cuddly about this hire.  And maybe that’s the secret sauce.  Dakich has been saying it for years. We are about to find out. 

Most options you listed weren’t obtainable. It’s like me saying I wish we would’ve hired Coach Spo

1. Few hasn’t left the NW in his entire life. Maybe he would’ve come for bigger $ but he was a 1st round flameout at the time  (unfair rep obviously) and who knows if he wanted a rebuild. 
And Bennett wasn’t even at UVA when Crean was hired.

2. Donovan was never coming. Bennett maybe? If he knew how good his 17-18 team could be, no chance he comes. What P5 coach then?

3. We tried to get Stevens. By all accounts, Oats wasn’t an option. Agree with you on Drew. 

So maybe we could have gotten Drew with the big $$$ offer that we seemed finally ready to make this time. 

Edited March 31, 2021 by IUBBx5Banners

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Nope. I haven’t been happy with any coach selection so far.  
 
1-When Crean was hired, I wanted Few or Tony Bennett
2-Miller- wanted Donovan, Bennett, or a stealing of a successful power 5 coach. 
 
3. Woodson- Stevens, Scott Drew, Oats, or the stealing of a succesful power 5 coach.  
 
I realize I’ve had my hopes too high, but if reports of 7 mil a year are true we could have aimed so much higher.  
 
one big plus, is the older alumni/players feel warm and cuddly about this hire.  And maybe that’s the secret sauce.  Dakich has been saying it for years. We are about to find out. 

I will say, I got behind the Crean hire. The super slow rebuild was a huge turnoff.

Archie, I always said if he could recruit like Sean we’d have similar success. Well the FBI sting and/or the IU admin or whatever never let this come through. Even though I didn’t like the hire, I still expected better results.

We are in the tank. Woodson has the best chance to look good. Going above .500 in conference will be good enough for most. I guess that’s what I expect. Middle of the pack compared to lower third. 4 or 5 years of middle of the pack.


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[Uspshoosier]

1 minute ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

I will say, I got behind the Crean hire. The super slow rebuild was a huge turnoff.

Archie, I always said if he could recruit like Sean we’d have similar success. Well the FBI sting and/or the IU admin or whatever never let this come through. Even though I didn’t like the hire, I still expected better results.

We are in the tank. Woodson has the best chance to look good. Going above .500 in conference will be good enough for most. I guess that’s what I expect. Middle of the pack compared to lower third. 4 or 5 years of middle of the pack.


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Your done being a super fan though right? This hire put the nail in the coffin if i remember right.   Turned you into fair weather fan.    I don’t believe it though.  I think you will be here day 1 next year hanging  on every play and hoping for the best 

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Most options you listed weren’t obtainable. It’s like me saying I wish we would’ve hired Coach Spo

1. Few hasn’t left the NW in his entire life. Maybe he would’ve come for bigger $ but he was a 1st round flameout at the time  (unfair rep obviously) and who knows if he wanted a rebuild. 

And Bennett wasn’t even at UVA when Crean was hired.

2. Donovan was never coming. Bennett maybe? If he knew how good his 17-18 team could be, no chance he comes. What P5 coach then?

3. We tried to get Stevens. By all accounts, Oats wasn’t an option. Agree with you on Drew. 

So maybe we could have gotten Drew with the big $$$ offer that we seemed finally ready to make this time. 

 

I’ll never be convinced that doubling someone’s salary doesn’t bring us an elite coach (any coach will listen to 7 mil a year). Indiana has made the decision to find the diamond in the rough.

 

The Crean and Miller hire both made enough sense if you are trying to find the next up and comer. There’s an inherent risk in raising the level.

 

We’ve yet to “steal a coach” and flex our muscles on a coach that’s been successful at the level we are trying to win at.

 

I agree with you, they only appeared ready to spend for this hire. But were they? We supposedly go after Stevens at 7mil then drop off to option B back at the dollar amount they feel good about? Then of all the coaches they could contact, we contact Holtmann?? It’s crazy.

 

I think it was always going to be an Indiana guy on this hire. It’s been the mantra for years from the talking heads. Hope they are right.

 

 

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[WayneFleekHoosier]

Your done being a super fan though right? This hire put the nail in the coffin if i remember right.   Turned you into fair weather fan.    I don’t believe it though.  I think you will be here day 1 next year hanging  on every play and hoping for the best 

I’ll always hope for the best. It would be a cool underdog story like Tom Allen. But if the results go the way I expect, I’ll quickly adjust my dedication. I’ve been a Cubs fan my whole life. I know how to come into a season strong and save myself a bunch of time when the writing is on the wall. Hope I’m pleasantly surprised.


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[Magnanimous]

I think the big thing those individuals who are critical of Woodson’s age are forgetting is that he turned 63 last week. He may as well be an old 62. Just so we’re all putting this hire in the right context...

[Uspshoosier]

1 minute ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

I’ll always hope for the best. It would be a cool underdog story like Tom Allen. But if the results go the way I expect, I’ll quickly adjust my dedication. I’ve been a Cubs fan my whole life. I know how to come into a season strong and save myself a bunch of time when the writing is on the wall. Hope I’m pleasantly surprised.


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Just trust your guy Slater who is the most informed insider in the business in my opinion.   He says Woodson will be fine and that age won’t be a problem just needs him 2 sharks on the bench with him.  

[P92]

3 hours ago, lillurk said:

I’d really recommend the Fisch interview that quote is from. Woody’s always learning and growing as a coach, willing to admit he doesn’t know it all and adapt.

Mentions liking having interchangeable 6’6”-6’7”+ guys to switch on defense, learning to love the three, putting shooters around stars...all encouraging.

Personally, having watched IU play too many waterbug guards and too few rangy forwards for years, the size/athleticism emphasis is music to my ears. 

I hate the three guard offense. Our last championship had a true center in Dean Garret and great forwards in Thomas and Calloway. Woody gets it.

[IUBBx5Banners]

2 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

 

I’ll never be convinced that doubling someone’s salary doesn’t bring us an elite coach (any coach will listen to 7 mil a year). Indiana has made the decision to find the diamond in the rough.

The Crean and Miller hire both made enough sense if you are trying to find the next up and comer. There’s an inherent risk in raising the level.

We’ve yet to “steal a coach” and flex our muscles on a coach that’s been successful at the level we are trying to win at.

I agree with you, they only appeared ready to spend for this hire. But were they? We supposedly go after Stevens at 7mil then drop off to option B back are the dollar amount they feel good about? Then of all the coaches they could contact, we contact Holtmann?? It’s crazy.

I think it was always going to be an Indiana guy on this hire. It’s been the mantra for years from the talking heads. Hope they are right.


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I’m with you 100% that we should’ve made a $5M+ offer to the clear cut guys (Beard, Oats, etc) and should’ve floated a $7M+ offer to guys like Wright or Bennett. 

But there’s a lot we don’t need know - maybe the $7M was a Stevens-only exception. Maybe we did backchannel and see if $7M gets us a home run hire.

But I think the reality is the job isn’t nearly as attractive as we’d like to believe. And for a coach making $4M, is another couple million worth leaving a program they’ve built, the life they’ve established there, the stability, etc. for a job in a tough conference with a fan base that has (perceived) unrealistic expectations? 

Perhaps it’s a tougher sell than maybe we’d like to admit 

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Just trust your guy Slater who is the most informed insider in the business in my opinion.   He says Woodson will be fine and that age won’t be a problem just needs him 2 sharks on the bench with him.  

Well, if he gets sharks and recruits dogs, I’ll raise my antennae. That’ll be the key, almost always is. You know I’ll pay attention to see who he targets and who he lands. It’ll foretell the future.

Also, some coaches have a better eye for talent than others (not all *stars* are created equally) I hope that’s Woodson.


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[IUBBx5Banners]

3 hours ago, lillurk said:

I’d really recommend the Fisch interview that quote is from. Woody’s always learning and growing as a coach, willing to admit he doesn’t know it all and adapt.

Mentions liking having interchangeable 6’6”-6’7”+ guys to switch on defense, learning to love the three, putting shooters around stars...all encouraging.

Personally, having watched IU play too many waterbug guards and too few rangy forwards for years, the size/athleticism emphasis is music to my ears. 

Agreed. Just look at last 2 national champs. Nova and UVA played 4 G/Fs, with the 2-4s being 6’5-6’9. Both had a smaller lead PG (Guy and Brunson) and both played a smallish big man (Spellman for Nova and a couple of 6’9 guys at UVA). 

Its a versatile approach that can really hum and be devastating if you can field a lengthy team with multiple creators. Also, I think it’s also easier to recruit into that type of system where you can target archetypes and mix and match strengths and weaknesses

[Hoosierfan1901]

Final Four Bound in 2022, Book it.

[cthomas]

Ok, I readily admit that I don't know what I'm talking about most of the time, but I'll take a guy who's passionate about being here over a guy who takes a job because the money was too good to pass up. I've also heard enough from people with first hand experience to believe that this man can coach and relate to players. Assistants and translating to the different landscape will be important. I think he understands that. When he said something like 'at the end of the day, it's just basketball', I thought this guy gets it. Maybe I'm the idiot I always tell my wife I am, but I think a lot of people will be eating crow when this is over.

[Golfman25]

1 hour ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Lunacy? Yeah, in my opinion.  

A 63 year old head coach giving college his first try.  No system in place to be an elite recruiter.  Players will have to just trust him because he can’t point to prior success.  
 

Ask yourself this, if any other B1G team made this hire or an equivalent hire based on all the on paper data we would fully expect it to fail.  
 

Doesn’t mean it will, and I hope it doesn’t. 

Not a chance in hell this "fails."  May not get another banner right away, as that is an extreemely difficult these days, but we'll compete in the big 10 and make tourney runs.  Guarantee will be at least as good as Crean and Miller, and in all likelihood way, way, way, better.   Any recruit that doesn't listen to Woody isn't smart enought to play at IU.  

[hoosierbannerd]

14 minutes ago, Hooserfan1901 said:

Final Four Bound in 2022, Book it.