General Coach Candidate News

[Josh 13,232]

21 minutes ago, str8baller said:

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/basketball/2019/01/22/which-state-birthed-most-active-nba-players-per-capita-indiana/2524079002/

 

 

https://1075thefan.com/playlist/the-top-10-states-that-have-produced-the-most-nba-and-aba-players/item/1

you can quantify many ways. But they do these nba lists every so often and Indiana is always top 5. In the one linked were 5 but basically 3 if you throw out the small pop outliers like n. Dakota.  
 

 

 

Indiana puts out more basketball talent than most and that’s largely due to our great HS system. 

The link is 7, not 5?

I get we have a lot of talent in Indiana, but some years (a lot of years?) we don't.  I hate when we put more stock into an indiana kid than others.  Or when we get a superiority complex over a kid based on his zip code than anything else.  Or when we grade an IU basketball coach based on what the high school coaches say.

Just seems crazy to me

[Old Friend 8,667]

2 hours ago, Stuhoo said:

All good with the counterpoints! And  I am all for getting the next big thing.

But Cignetti is a terrible comparison. He was an FBS assistant for 24 years including under Saban at Bama, and had JMU ranked. So he was in the locker rooms of the biggest of big programs watching how they were run. McCollum has never played against a ranked team. Not as a player, grad assistant, assistant, or head coach.

There are many other next big things that have a resume of success. Why is McCollum better than Ray Harper, Crutchfield, or Greg Tonagel? The answer; he may be and he may not be.

McCollum is having a really good first year at Drake, but if he doesn’t win at UNI this week then UNI will be the #1 seed in their conference going into their conference tourney. And then Drake will need to win that tourney to make the NCAAs.

Another point I heard made about McCollum; he has a team of players that are completely ingrained whose system this year; that’s why they look so connected. And in a mid major there’s enough athletic similarities to top D2 that he can succeed, especially early. 

 

Who's your horse, and why?   Maybe we should start there.

I don't think Cignetti is a terrible example at all.  McCollum was a head guy in his early 30's.  Cignetti not until he was in his 50's.  Your point (or at least the one to which I was responding) was the size of the entity for which the head coach, whoever he is, will be responsible.  I don't think, given the environment and current set of rules, McCollum is much less qualified than anyone else and he can flat coach.  Who's to say  a few of Drake's players (they have 8 non-seniors including 3 of their top 5 scorers) don't come with him?  That'd help the connectivity just like James Madison players helped in football.  That team already beat Vanderbilt, Miami, and Kansas State, so they can play at the power 5 level.

The argument against him in my opinion is he's never recruited at a level this high, nor has he recruited or coached with or against the size.   Woodson was used to the size and is still abysmal, so there's no guarantee either way and I understand that.  I'm just far more interested in him than I am someone like Buzz Williams or Mick Cronin.

But....that's my opinion.  I think I'm more interested in Schertz than McCollum.

[Muskie plays the four 727]

10 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

Who's your horse, and why?   Maybe we should start there.

I don't think Cignetti is a terrible example at all.  McCollum was a head guy in his early 30's.  Cignetti not until he was in his 50's.  Your point (or at least the one to which I was responding) was the size of the entity for which the head coach, whoever he is, will be responsible.  I don't think, given the environment and current set of rules, McCollum is much less qualified than anyone else and he can flat coach.  Who's to say  a few of Drake's players (they have 8 non-seniors including 3 of their top 5 scorers) don't come with him?  That'd help the connectivity just like James Madison players helped in football.  That team already beat Vanderbilt, Miami, and Kansas State, so they can play at the power 5 level.

The argument against him in my opinion is he's never recruited at a level this high, nor has he recruited or coached with or against the size.   Woodson was used to the size and is still abysmal, so there's no guarantee either way and I understand that.  I'm just far more interested in him than I am someone like Buzz Williams or Mick Cronin.

But....that's my opinion.  I think I'm more interested in Schertz than McCollum.

Shertz would be fun basketball to watch for sure 

[Old Friend 8,667]

2 hours ago, Stuhoo said:

That’s why he’s a risk. But he’s learned from the best of the best at the top of the top for 15 years. He’s a dude. And he’s a dude at Duke, not at some school that would be a five point neutral court underdog to the current IU trainwreck.

This is an argument that probably needs to stop.  His current Drake team vs the current IU team isn't up for discussion unless you think he can only recruit Valley-level players to Indiana.  He's a great basketball coach.  He could and would, like ANY coach at Indiana, recruit and land FAR better players.   With far better players and better coaching, Indiana beats Drake by 25 on most nights.  That the game would be this close (5 points or so I'm reading) is a much worse indictment of Mike Woodson than McCollum.  To me, that argument (this season's matchup between Drake and IU) is silly.  (I love that word)

Also, long term vs short term.  Long term?  Can anyone make a claim McCollum doesn't have a better than average chance to succeed at Indiana all things considered?   The dude has won BIG for his entire career regardless of talent level.  We're not going from making canned soup to making microchips for Gen 27 space suits, here.  Bigger and more athletic players ain't THAT much different.

[RoadRage 3,012]

3 minutes ago, Uspshoosier said:

I think Drake is a good team.  I’ve watched most their games and the whole run in the non conference where they beat Kansas st and Vandy. I’ve also seen them get taken to OT at home by Indiana St which is having a down year.    IU has lost 1 possession games to teams that are currently being projected as protected seeds  on the road and home and have beaten them on the road.   College basketball is crazy which is why it’s the greatest sport ever so anything can happen but I see no way Drake beats IU easily.  Could they win? Yeah but no way easily.   IU would probably be favored in the game 

Maybe….but the reason I said easily is we have not fared well against teams that play very good defense. Drake has the third best scoring defense in the country. But my easily comment was probably ill-advised, just getting sick of all the anti-McCollum/Cronin knob polishing…….

[Banksyrules 5,342]

……….looks at board………I’m too old for this @$%…………zzzzzzzzzzzz…..zzzzzzzzzzzz

[Stuhoo 89,563]

24 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

Who's your horse, and why?   Maybe we should start there.

I don't think Cignetti is a terrible example at all.  McCollum was a head guy in his early 30's.  Cignetti not until he was in his 50's.  Your point (or at least the one to which I was responding) was the size of the entity for which the head coach, whoever he is, will be responsible.  I don't think, given the environment and current set of rules, McCollum is much less qualified than anyone else and he can flat coach.  Who's to say  a few of Drake's players (they have 8 non-seniors including 3 of their top 5 scorers) don't come with him?  That'd help the connectivity just like James Madison players helped in football.  That team already beat Vanderbilt, Miami, and Kansas State, so they can play at the power 5 level.

The argument against him in my opinion is he's never recruited at a level this high, nor has he recruited or coached with or against the size.   Woodson was used to the size and is still abysmal, so there's no guarantee either way and I understand that.  I'm just far more interested in him than I am someone like Buzz Williams or Mick Cronin.

But....that's my opinion.  I think I'm more interested in Schertz than McCollum.

I can you a quick ‘top of my head’ list of 15 that are more qualified than McCollum. And even better, I’ll leave the Stevens, Pearl, Drew, Few, etc types out- so guys that IU have a legit chance with:

Schertz, McDermott, Byington, McCasland, Buzz, Calhoun, Gates, Pitino jr, DeVries, Luke Murray, Collins, Brownell, McMillan, McDermott And the best of all… Otz! That’s 15 off the top of my head and 13 of them are 52 or under.

 

and I even left Cronin off for you

 

 

[Magnanimous 5,362]

4 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

I can you a quick ‘top of my head’ list of 15 that are more qualified than McCollum. And even better, I’ll leave the Stevens, Pearl, Drew, Few, etc types out- so guys that IU have a legit chance with:

Schertz, McDermott, Byington, McCasland, Buzz, Calhoun, Gates, Pitino jr, DeVries, Luke Murray, Collins, Brownell, Medved, McMillan, Cronin

that’s 16 off the top of my head.

And the best of all… Otz! That’s 17

 

 

 

[Stuhoo 89,563]

13 minutes ago, Magnanimous said:

 

I’m trying to think of some way in which Pitino Junior would not be a better hire than McCollum. I’m having a ton of trouble coming up with some category where McCollum would be better other than division two championships.

So help me other than division 2 championships what is a single way that McCollum would be more qualified for the Indiana head coaching job than Pitino Junior?

and FWIW, Luke Murray would be the equivalent of taking the number two person in a very large, very successful corporation, and promoting him to CEO whereas McCollum would be the equivalent of promoting a hyper successful branch manager to CEO 

 

[RoadRage 3,012]

Just now, Stuhoo said:

I’m trying to think of some way in which Pitino Junior would not be a better hire than McCollum. I’m having a ton of trouble coming up with some category where McCollum would be better other than division two championships.

So help me other than division 2 championships what is a single way that McCollum would be more qualified for the Indiana head coaching job than Pitino Junior?

What did McCollum do to you? He can only win the games he has the opportunity to play, he’s won 80% of them! Somebody has to give a winner like this a shot, we sit back and play it safe and hire Woodson and some want Cronin, and guys like McCollum to go other schools, have great success, then we want them but it is too late, they are no longer interested in us. I’m all for paying big money and hiring Stevens, Donovan, Wright, Pearl or even Drew, but most seem to be saying we are going after Brownell or Cronin. If that is the direction we go, I’d rather take a chance on McCollum or Beard!

[Hornsby 3,870]

McCollum is the most intriguing candidate IMO. Lot of valid points for and against. I doubt we go with him but also think it’s likely he ends up a pain in our backside at Iowa along with Dusty at UM. 

Many said the same thing about archie

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[Hornsby 3,870]

What did McCollum do to you? He can only win the games he has the opportunity to play, he’s won 80% of them! Somebody has to give a winner like this a shot, we sit back and play it safe and hire Woodson and some want Cronin, and guys like McCollum to go other schools, have great success, then we want them but it is too late, they are no longer interested in us. I’m all for paying big money and hiring Stevens, Donovan, Wright, Pearl or even Drew, but most seem to be saying we are going after Brownell or Cronin. If that is the direction we go, I’d rather take a chance on McCollum or Beard!

Is take hom over bronwell in a heartbeat but this was suppose to be a time we got a big name guy. No excuse with the money we have.

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[Magnanimous 5,362]

1 minute ago, Hornsby said:

Is take hom over bronwell in a heartbeat but this was suppose to be a time we got a big name guy. No excuse with the money we have.

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All the great (“big name”) coaches have left college basketball or are about to croak. 

[RoadRage 3,012]

Just now, Hornsby said:

Is take hom over bronwell in a heartbeat but this was suppose to be a time we got a big name guy. No excuse with the money we have.

Sent from my SM-A146U using Tapatalk
 

I agree, but that is not what a lot of people who supposedly have inside info are saying. I am hearing Brownell, Cronin, and Pitino Jr..I am all for going for an elite coach and I hope that is where this is headed!

[Magnanimous 5,362]

20 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

I’m trying to think of some way in which Pitino Junior would not be a better hire than McCollum. I’m having a ton of trouble coming up with some category where McCollum would be better other than division two championships.

So help me other than division 2 championships what is a single way that McCollum would be more qualified for the Indiana head coaching job than Pitino Junior?

and FWIW, Luke Murray would be the equivalent of taking the number two person in a very large, very successful corporation, and promoting him to CEO whereas McCollum would be the equivalent of promoting a hyper successful branch manager to CEO 

 

Pitino stunk in the Big Ten? IU shouldn’t be hiring guys that washed out at Minnesota just a few years ago? 

I get you don’t like the idea of hiring McCollum right now, and logically there are other guys with D2 and/or MVC success you could both make an argument for and against, but continuing to throw Pitino Jr’s name out there really hurts your argument in these discussions. The guy wouldn’t be a candidate at most Big Ten schools right now, so why should he be for IU?

[WayneFleekHoosier 51,425]

Mullins dropped 52 tonight.  Thanks Woody. 

[8bucks 7,554]

31 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

I can you a quick ‘top of my head’ list of 15 that are more qualified than McCollum. And even better, I’ll leave the Stevens, Pearl, Drew, Few, etc types out- so guys that IU have a legit chance with:

Schertz, McDermott, Byington, McCasland, Buzz, Calhoun, Gates, Pitino jr, DeVries, Luke Murray, Collins, Brownell, McMillan, McDermott And the best of all… Otz! That’s 15 off the top of my head and 13 of them are 52 or under.

 

and I even left Cronin off for you

 

 

No fair getting McDermott twice. I like him too but he isn’t good enough to be counted twice. 

[RaceToTheTop 31,134]

9 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Mullins dropped 52 tonight.  Thanks Woody. 

4-D chess.  Recruits can't decommit if they never commit to you.

[Hornsby 3,870]

I agree, but that is not what a lot of people who supposedly have inside info are saying. I am hearing Brownell, Cronin, and Pitino Jr..I am all for going for an elite coach and I hope that is where this is headed!

Pitino Jr got run out of minnesota. Minnesota!!! Doing good in new Mexico is nothing he doesn't play anyone good. Cronin I'd take but bronwell has been very very average over his career. You can't base the hire because he finally had one good year. His career is totally average.

 

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[iubb 4,833]

https://twitter.com/petethamel/status/1893515153825562796?s=46

Interesting that there have been zero rumors or stories like this one wrt to the IU head coaching position.

Wonder why…


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