So some concerns I’m having...

[Brass Cannon 24,222]

We value the ball about as much as I valued my Transformers growing up

We think effort is optional

We don’t care about FTs to the extent I’m not sure the team knows those points count

There seems to be no accountability. Players do stupid stuff and continue to play and even start. 

Player development seems to be non existent. Juwan is about the same same as last year same as Al. Green and Smith look worse than last year and Moore is still not good enough to be a rotation player 

 

Yeah I just really don’t like what I am seeing mostly because this doesn’t appear to be a funk at this point it’s the norm as it’s been the majority of the season. 

[Deserthoozier 924]

Just now, Brass Cannon said:

We value the ball about as much as I valued my Transformers growing up

We think effort is optional

We don’t care about FTs to the extent I’m not sure the team knows those points count

There seems to be no accountability. Players do stupid stuff and continue to play and even start. 

Player development seems to be non existent. Juwan is about the same same as last year same as Al. Green and Smith look worse than last year and Moore is still not good enough to be a rotation player 

 

Yeah I just really don’t like what I am seeing mostly because this doesn’t appear to be a funk at this point it’s the norm as it’s been the majority of the season. 

Al looks better. No game flow since Marquette.

[WayneFleekHoosier 47,923]

Justin Smith has been abysmal. Free Throws for him are a wild adventure.

Justin Smith is worse this year than Bad Troy Williams and couldn’t hold a candle to Good Troy Williams.


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[azguybob 108]

turned it off at haftime...dont watch IU get blown out....surprised at the final margin..only 21 ?...Coach K must have called off the dogs earl

y.

[ap2345 7,552]

I think Morgan has hit his ceiling as a player. Durham has gotten better. Davis is limited by his athleticism plus he’s missed a lot of time with injury. Moore has gotten better but he doesn’t get much time for whatever reason. McRoberts has gotten better with his jumper. Smith I don’t understand and Green is what he is and isn’t changing. Plus you have 5 new players with one of them likely out for the season in Hunter. Saying none of the players have gotten better is a ridiculous hot take with no substance to it.


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[Brass Cannon 24,222]

1 minute ago, ap2345 said:

I think Morgan has hit his ceiling as a player. Durham has gotten better. Davis is limited by his athleticism plus he’s missed a lot of time with injury. Moore has gotten better but he doesn’t get much time for whatever reason. McRoberts has gotten better with his jumper. Smith I don’t understand and Green is what he is and isn’t changing. Plus you have 5 new players with one of them likely out for the season in Hunter. Saying none of the players have gotten better is a ridiculous hot take with no substance to it.


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You literally just said a player we haven’t seen is better. But I’m the one with a ridiculous hot take with no substance. 

[MikeRoberts 6,914]

I don’t see an identity or a system with this program under Archie. We should have seen one by now. It looked like Crean ball out there- terrible shots and the most absurd, unforced turnovers.

Agree for the most part except I felt IU had an identity under Crean. It was a fast pace under Crean where we tried to outgun the opponent ever night. If we played at home and got running we could beat anyone. If our opponent forced us into the half court or played a zone we were beatable. There was a brand. Albeit a flawed brand but I knew what we were, good or bad.

 

I don’t know what our brand is or who we are. What are we good at? What do we stand for under Archie?

 

 

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[Bailey7878 2,506]

I don’t see an identity or a system with this program under Archie. We should have seen one by now. It looked like Crean ball out there- terrible shots and the most absurd, unforced turnovers.

I agree.

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[ap2345 7,552]

You literally just said a player we haven’t seen is better. But I’m the one with a ridiculous hot take with no substance. 

Here is the reason I said that. When he has come into games he hasn’t looked to do to much unlike last year when he looked to shoot it every time he touched the ball. Also multiple players have mentioned how hard he’s been working in practice and pushing the other guys but hey what do I know. You can agree with my take on more if you’d like but that doesn’t excuse the fact that it’s obvious other guys have gotten better but you can ignore that too if you’d like.


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[Brass Cannon 24,222]

Just now, ap2345 said:

Here is the reason I said that. When he has come into games he hasn’t looked to do to much unlike last year when he looked to shoot it every time he touched the ball. Also multiple players have mentioned how hard he’s been working in practice and pushing the other guys but hey what do I know. You can agree with my take on more if you’d like but that doesn’t excuse the fact that it’s obvious other guys have gotten better but you can ignore that too if you’d like.


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Lol oh people said he was better. Sorta like how people said Smith and Green were better. 

And lol if you think the designated towel waver improving slightly is a sign of good player development. 

Has Mcroberts gotten better or is he just more willing to shoot. He was able to shoot 3 years ago. 

So maybe Al improved. Obviously not faulting them for Davis. Juwan you admit has reached a plateau 

So 1 out of 6 players who came back are noticeably improved if you think Al improved. His PER improved by a modest 4 points against a soft schedule 

[ap2345 7,552]

Lol oh people said he was better. Sorta like how people said Smith and Green were better. 
And lol if you think the designated towel waver improving slightly is a sign of good player development. 
Has Mcroberts gotten better or is he just more willing to shoot. He was able to shoot 3 years ago. 
So maybe Al improved. Obviously not faulting them for Davis. Juwan you admit has reached a plateau 
So 1 out of 6 players who came back are noticeably improved if you think Al improved. His PER improved by a modest 4 points against a soft schedule 

You have your opinion I have mine. But we’ll be fine after IU wins their next 7 games which I think they will and heads into the Michigan game with a 12-2 record.


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[mdn82 25,510]

Well that was a **** show. No way around it. Most expected around a 20 point loss. We got it. Best team in the country on their court. It sucks. Defensively we are slow on rotations right now. Turnovers need to be fixed now. We don’t have the shooters to turn it over more than 20% of our possessions. We just can’t give up possessions. We will lose. Coaching wise I was disappointed in leaving Justin Smith in so long. I understand we are limited skill wise past him but I would take my lumps with Jake who has a motor. A kid with a motor will go further than a skilled kid with no motor. Anyone can sugar coat that but dude has not been there this year. He has been a detriment to this point. I expected less from DD and I feel better with him and moving Juwan to the 4 than having Smith in there. His play just feels like Hollowell to me. The skills are there. The will is not.


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[cthomas 6,303]

2 minutes ago, mdn82 said:

Well that was a **** show. No way around it. Most expected around a 20 point loss. We got it. Best team in the country on their court. It sucks. Defensively we are slow on rotations right now. Turnovers need to be fixed now. We don’t have the shooters to turn it over more than 20% of our possessions. We just can’t give up possessions. We will lose. Coaching wise I was disappointed in leaving Justin Smith in so long. I understand we are limited skill wise past him but I would take my lumps with Jake who has a motor. A kid with a motor will go further than a skilled kid with no motor. Anyone can sugar coat that but dude has not been there this year. He has been a detriment to this point. I expected less from DD and I feel better with him and moving Juwan to the 4 than having Smith in there. His play just feels like Hollowell to me. The skills are there. The will is not.


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Scathing rebuke for Smith, but at this point it's hard to disagree. I guess nothing coming out of summer workouts can be believed.

[jk34 1,105]

30 minutes ago, mdn82 said:

Well that was a **** show. No way around it. Most expected around a 20 point loss. We got it. Best team in the country on their court. It sucks. Defensively we are slow on rotations right now. Turnovers need to be fixed now. We don’t have the shooters to turn it over more than 20% of our possessions. We just can’t give up possessions. We will lose. Coaching wise I was disappointed in leaving Justin Smith in so long. I understand we are limited skill wise past him but I would take my lumps with Jake who has a motor. A kid with a motor will go further than a skilled kid with no motor. Anyone can sugar coat that but dude has not been there this year. He has been a detriment to this point. I expected less from DD and I feel better with him and moving Juwan to the 4 than having Smith in there. His play just feels like Hollowell to me. The skills are there. The will is not.


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Thinking the same earlier. Davis and Morgan in the front court makes complete sense at this point.  Let Justin see the flow of the game until one of them gets their 2nd foul.(around the 18min. mark)                     Still think the switch will turn on for JS, too much talent.

 

[iu-dl 1,441]

We all thought the same thing on Smith and playing time, but I don't think we had an option at that point due to fouls on Morgan/DD. I'd like to know why Forrester gets no playing time at all when Smith is turning it over on offense and getting scorched on defense. If Morgan has hit his ceiling, I'm good with it because he's great. Just stay out of foul trouble. Romeo had no choice but to try to take the game into his own hands. Phinessee did all he could considering the situation. This team will come around and we're never going to be as good as Duke is right now.  They're loaded with NBA starters; it is what it is.  All this talk (not all in this thread, but go read the game thread) about how Miller isn't the right person, destroying the players, etc. is a brash and often knee-jerk reaction.  I wonder if Duke wanted to get rid of Coach K after losing to Gonzaga??  They should have because Duke was supposed to go undefeated, right?  We need to have a little faith, and if we can't, stop watching and stop complaining. Archie will figure out what he can with the talent he has access to.

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

Agree with mdn - once again came away from a Duke game pleasantly surprised by DD. I really think he can be an excellent contributor to the team. Will he ever live up to his #1 HS ranking? A betting man says no. Can he be a key player on a tournament team? Absolutely. Will he have his limitations and flaws? Absolutely. But he’s shown he can quietly play his game regardless of the level of competition. Just needs to stay healthy and get some consistent experience.

 

Agree with the poster who said we’ve seen Juwan’s ceiling. He’s made incredible strides, but something about how he plays doesn’t have that spark. Juwan would thrive on a team where he wasn’t the guy.

 

Que Romeo. He’s a freshman, so I’m not worried. However, he’s the 5th ranked freshman in the country, and he was little boy’d by Zion and Barrett. Tough task going one-on-one against a single one of them, and unfortunately Duke has three/an entire team of stars. IU needs him to score at will or drive and dish at will. With McBob and Fitzner on the floor, the lanes should be open enough for someone as talented as Romeo. I think he was rattled by his first big lights moment, and I expect that to change. I hope he’s angry.

 

Overall, not panicked after an away beat down at Cameron. Disappointed, yes. Annoyed, yes. BUT - we won the second half. The team showed some kind of response. Archie should build from that. I think he can too. Marquette was not just a fluke.

 

 

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[BGVille Hoosierfan 2,909]

We just dug ourselves too big of a hole mostly caused by A LOT of uncharacteristic turnovers and missed bunnies. We came out and looked scared and never was able to get into a rhythm. This Duke team may be the best college basketball team EVER assembled. I would be surprised if they lose another game. Only teams with major length stand a chance coupled with Duke having a VERY poor shooting night. Let's see how we come back and respond to start the B1G. I'm still a believer in this team regardless of that outing last night.

 

 

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[Brass Cannon 24,222]

21 minutes ago, jbell833 said:

We just dug ourselves too big of a hole mostly caused by A LOT of uncharacteristic turnovers and missed bunnies. We came out and looked scared and never was able to get into a rhythm. This Duke team may be the best college basketball team EVER assembled. I would be surprised if they lose another game. Only teams with major length stand a chance coupled with Duke having a VERY poor shooting night. Let's see how we come back and respond to start the B1G. I'm still a believer in this team regardless of that outing last night.

 

 

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Is something uncharacteristic if it happens more than half the time?  We are averaging 19+ turnovers these last 4 games

[bigrod 2,848]

These are my concerns:

The 3 point and overall shooting percentage trend since CAM has taken over. Now we can't finish at the basket either.

The foul shooting trend since CAM has taken over. (Not encouraging if you look at his Dayton teams either.)

The constant lazy passes and turnover trend.

Why are Forrester and Moore not even able to offer a couple minutes for others to rest?

The tentative play every time a team applies some pressure.

Why so many injuries? Are we too concerned about bulking guys up?

I've been a fan of CAM and I was one of those who thought he was a great hire. However, these trends are disturbing. He had nothing last night. I was not expecting a win, but largely, they didn't even show up.

[Hoosierfan2017 20,822]

8 hours ago, Brass Cannon said:

We value the ball about as much as I valued my Transformers growing up

We think effort is optional

We don’t care about FTs to the extent I’m not sure the team knows those points count

There seems to be no accountability. Players do stupid stuff and continue to play and even start. 

Player development seems to be non existent. Juwan is about the same same as last year same as Al. Green and Smith look worse than last year and Moore is still not good enough to be a rotation player 

 

Yeah I just really don’t like what I am seeing mostly because this doesn’t appear to be a funk at this point it’s the norm as it’s been the majority of the season. 

Al is a much better player. He's more than doubled his 3 point attempts per game and went from a 28.6% shooter to a 42.9% shooter.