They “Retired” Coach Woodson Thread

[RaceToTheTop]

53 minutes ago, Ngw7183 said:

 

What am I getting at, Fire Woody, he retires, hire any coach, doesn’t matter, this fanbase has to stop attacking our own players, coach etc in year 2/3. Seems many always take that as lower expectations, nope. You can expect things without attacking and making it worse. 

 

As I have stated repeatedly, I have always been pretty much the last to the party on every coach at IU on the 'fire him' train.  The loudness of the calls to relieve Woodson of his job are louder in his third year after missing the tournament in only season than they ever were for Mike Davis -- who went six years despite years four and five going 29-29 and missing the tournament both years and Tom Crean -- who made it 9 years with five being out of the tournament.  Archie Miller lasted four years and didn't make the tournament ever (although I will give him credit for 2020 when they would have made the tournament).  So, the proper question is WHY are the cries so much louder now in his third season than they ever were for any of the others?  You once asked the board to answer a question in which you accused us of not being worthy to answer.....so let's see if you know the right answer to the question I asked.

[Kentuckysucks]

1 hour ago, Ngw7183 said:

All can be true. I am not ignoring things like system but I am also saying posts like that from Rabby saying that was the reason doesn’t add up. It wasn’t true he wasn’t visited and he knew the system when he committed. But now those are the facts and anything else is crazy talk. 

I can agree a system needs to change while also not believing that is main issue with recruits. Also don’t think fans are reason for him (that is another post) but might be for plenty others. 

Let’s assume he is gone. 

So how do we build back? I don’t think top coaches want to be here. Really believe that. So we get Dusty.

He himself said he wanted to quit same day of taking FAU job and almost did once be realized what he agreed to. He had a breakdown and went home and cried. Now, imagine him in year 3/4 and still missing tourney. You have to admit that is very possible. No way this fanbase gives him a break because his offense is nice. 

In 14 years what was our best team? Think about what led up to that. The fanbase fully backed off. They rallied behind one of the worst rosters ever. Few years later, program was number 1 in country.

All things can be true but we have a tendency to make things worse.  When multiple guys like TJD, Leal and now an IU family being recruited is saying the same thing, we can’t just toss it away and laugh which is what is done. You can be mad at the coach, want him 100%!gone and still realize this has to change. 
 

What am I getting at, Fire Woody, he retires, hire any coach, doesn’t matter, this fanbase has to stop attacking our own players, coach etc in year 2/3. Seems many always take that as lower expectations, nope. You can expect things without attacking and making it worse. 

We are not Kansas, UNC or UK. We don’t get that liberty right now.  

Everyone I know associated with the program hates Woody.   Capital W.  If the worst happened tomorrow 80% of the IU fan base would pop the champagne.  It is what it is. Bring in Pearl or Dusty. What is the worst that can happen?  Woody is disgusting beyond belief.  Just an awful human being. 

[OKHOOSIER]

1 hour ago, Ngw7183 said:

All can be true. I am not ignoring things like system but I am also saying posts like that from Rabby saying that was the reason doesn’t add up. It wasn’t true he wasn’t visited and he knew the system when he committed. But now those are the facts and anything else is crazy talk. 

I can agree a system needs to change while also not believing that is main issue with recruits. Also don’t think fans are reason for him (that is another post) but might be for plenty others. 

Let’s assume he is gone. 

So how do we build back? I don’t think top coaches want to be here. Really believe that. So we get Dusty.

He himself said he wanted to quit same day of taking FAU job and almost did once be realized what he agreed to. He had a breakdown and went home and cried. Now, imagine him in year 3/4 and still missing tourney. You have to admit that is very possible. No way this fanbase gives him a break because his offense is nice. 

In 14 years what was our best team? Think about what led up to that. The fanbase fully backed off. They rallied behind one of the worst rosters ever. Few years later, program was number 1 in country.

All things can be true but we have a tendency to make things worse.  When multiple guys like TJD, Leal and now an IU family being recruited is saying the same thing, we can’t just toss it away and laugh which is what is done. You can be mad at the coach, want him 100%!gone and still realize this has to change. 
 

What am I getting at, Fire Woody, he retires, hire any coach, doesn’t matter, this fanbase has to stop attacking our own players, coach etc in year 2/3. Seems many always take that as lower expectations, nope. You can expect things without attacking and making it worse. 

We are not Kansas, UNC or UK. We don’t get that liberty right now.  

I appreciate you taking a more nuanced approach here despite several points I fundamentally disagree with. I am not going to respond to all your points, but there are a couple things here that I will.

You talk about building back now but the systemic issue existed before the decommit, hence the noise and the thread. At worst this was a 3 year rebuild even with Liam, at best it is depending on year over year portal hauls to maintain any momentum--that is simply not shown to be sustainable at the high major level. Woody is not going to be here until he is 70 and that was true before the decommit. That is why people saw the need for change. Call it too soon, call it whatever you want, delaying the inevitable is not a logical way to run the program. 

Blaming fans is generally nonsense, and I am not getting into that beyond this--can fans be better? Yes. Is tweeting at 'croots dumb? Yes. Is painting the entire fanbase with that brush fair to excuse the coaching failures? No. 

Lastly, and this is the main tone of the post that we do not deserve to be an elite fan base. Think about what you are saying. Your argument boils down to "IU has been bad for 24 years, so fans have no right to be passionate or complain." The reason the fan base even gets brought up in situations like this is because it has stuck by the program despite two decades of mismanagement. I could argue that the fan support is the only thing that still resembles the schools you mentioned. We are not Top-10 in wins in the last ten years. We are Top-6 in attendance. Currently, IU is number 10 nationally in money (read: fan money) spent on NIL stores. The very players that seemingly could be scared off by the lunatic fringe, also profit in HUGE amounts-- again, because of the fan base. The fan base acting like we are Kentucky, UNC or Kansas is the only remnant of our blue blood status. Saying it doesn't deserve to be is obtuse.

[IUHoosier5]

SIAP: it’s real. Unbelievable. 

[JSHoosier]

6 hours ago, TheWatShot said:

Wednesday night: news about Woodson

Thursday night: news about McNeeley

Friday night: women's team with a nuclear meltdown

 

What's going to be the bad news tomorrow night? 

Mike Woodson extension and only a 12m buyout after 6 years.

[JSHoosier]

6 hours ago, rcbowla said:

You are in denial and that's OK. Truth is he's coming back unless someone gets through to him that it's in his best interest not to. That's the gist of it I'm afraid. Even if he does leave our admin will probably hire the 1984 US Women's Gymnastics coach.

Coached the Olympics? Sounds too qualified. No way.

[JSHoosier]

6 hours ago, iubhounds2 said:

They actually lucked into that too. The prior year if Wisconsin had not broke hiring him to the news when Knight told them to hold off until he decided for sure, pissing Knight off, he would have been at Wisconsin instead of IU. He called Bo Schembecler (sp) to ask what he would do and Bo said "screw 'em" because they didn't hire him to be their head football coach due to lack of head coach experience. I think at the time he was an assistant at Miami of Ohio. What an amazing school that would have been with those two coaches under contract.

Wow, kind of makes IU leadership look somewhat borderline semi competent. Kind of impressive.

[94Bulldog]

7 hours ago, LamarCheeks said:

Woody shows up at halftime Sunday. 

"Man, I was blindsighted by this whole time change thing." 

And when asked about it at Monday’s press conference he’s going to say “Again; I’m not going to sit here and talk to you guys about daylight savings time, I’m just not.  I shouldn’t have to answer to you to about that.”

[Ghost of Rick Majerus]

7 hours ago, LamarCheeks said:

Woody shows up at halftime Sunday. 

"Man, I was blindsighted by this whole time change thing." 

Now this is funny. 

[IUCrazy2]

5 hours ago, OKHOOSIER said:

I appreciate you taking a more nuanced approach here despite several points I fundamentally disagree with. I am not going to respond to all your points, but there are a couple things here that I will.

You talk about building back now but the systemic issue existed before the decommit, hence the noise and the thread. At worst this was a 3 year rebuild even with Liam, at best it is depending on year over year portal hauls to maintain any momentum--that is simply not shown to be sustainable at the high major level. Woody is not going to be here until he is 70 and that was true before the decommit. That is why people saw the need for change. Call it too soon, call it whatever you want, delaying the inevitable is not a logical way to run the program. 

Blaming fans is generally nonsense, and I am not getting into that beyond this--can fans be better? Yes. Is tweeting at 'croots dumb? Yes. Is painting the entire fanbase with that brush fair to excuse the coaching failures? No. 

Lastly, and this is the main tone of the post that we do not deserve to be an elite fan base. Think about what you are saying. Your argument boils down to "IU has been bad for 24 years, so fans have no right to be passionate or complain." The reason the fan base even gets brought up in situations like this is because it has stuck by the program despite two decades of mismanagement. I could argue that the fan support is the only thing that still resembles the schools you mentioned. We are not Top-10 in wins in the last ten years. We are Top-6 in attendance. Currently, IU is number 10 nationally in money (read: fan money) spent on NIL stores. The very players that seemingly could be scared off by the lunatic fringe, also profit in HUGE amounts-- again, because of the fan base. The fan base acting like we are Kentucky, UNC or Kansas is the only remnant of our blue blood status. Saying it doesn't deserve to be is obtuse.

Co-f---ing-sign

I liked that response but just liking it wasn't enough.  Spot on.

[IUCrazy2]

4 hours ago, IUHoosier5 said:

SIAP: it’s real. Unbelievable. 

And you gotta think the reason his Dad is invested like that is because they view Indiana as an institution as one of the better options but they just have an issue with management.  Same with Sisley.  Get any semi-competent coach in here and we can still land that 2025 class that has kids you build around.  This portal Uber alles approach isn't a winner.  It is lazy, short term thinking that not only is going to sink Woodson, it is going to put his inevitable replacement in a deeper hole than they should be.

[JSHoosier]

5 hours ago, OKHOOSIER said:

I appreciate you taking a more nuanced approach here despite several points I fundamentally disagree with. I am not going to respond to all your points, but there are a couple things here that I will.

You talk about building back now but the systemic issue existed before the decommit, hence the noise and the thread. At worst this was a 3 year rebuild even with Liam, at best it is depending on year over year portal hauls to maintain any momentum--that is simply not shown to be sustainable at the high major level. Woody is not going to be here until he is 70 and that was true before the decommit. That is why people saw the need for change. Call it too soon, call it whatever you want, delaying the inevitable is not a logical way to run the program. 

Blaming fans is generally nonsense, and I am not getting into that beyond this--can fans be better? Yes. Is tweeting at 'croots dumb? Yes. Is painting the entire fanbase with that brush fair to excuse the coaching failures? No. 

Lastly, and this is the main tone of the post that we do not deserve to be an elite fan base. Think about what you are saying. Your argument boils down to "IU has been bad for 24 years, so fans have no right to be passionate or complain." The reason the fan base even gets brought up in situations like this is because it has stuck by the program despite two decades of mismanagement. I could argue that the fan support is the only thing that still resembles the schools you mentioned. We are not Top-10 in wins in the last ten years. We are Top-6 in attendance. Currently, IU is number 10 nationally in money (read: fan money) spent on NIL stores. The very players that seemingly could be scared off by the lunatic fringe, also profit in HUGE amounts-- again, because of the fan base. The fan base acting like we are Kentucky, UNC or Kansas is the only remnant of our blue blood status. Saying it doesn't deserve to be is obtuse.

And the opposite if love is apathy, fans care enough to be upset. When they don't that's the time to worry about fans.

The program is in this position because IU leadership is a clown show. We want to get back to UK, Kansas, etc status we have to start operating like them; which includes not sticking with crappy coaches in the name of stability or because they played here 40 years ago.

[hper50]

9 hours ago, Golfman25 said:

It makes perfect sense that you would have an anonymously sourced "Woodson's back" report to lower the temperature while the final 2 weeks of the season play out.  Things were extremely intense.  We'll be out of the BTT in a week and assuming no NIT there is time to sit down and figure out where the program is going.  If the "he's back" report is 100% legit, there is zero reason Dolson's name wouldn't be attached to it.  We are being fed a lot of BS.  

With all that has gone on, there is no way he's back.  It's impossible.  No sane person keeps him.  Woodson's only pitch is he'll do the impossible -- that which has never been done before.  It's not happening.  

While I love the idea of this and the optimism, source aside, just don’t see it happening with the portal opening on Monday after the tournament. Unless Dusty/someone else is already lined up and ready to go. 

Woody would have to step down willingly at this point. Which will never happen. Would love to be wrong though  

 

[coonhounds]

I am beginning to think alot of you guys are emailing the wrong people lol. I think the donors need to feel pressure. It sucks cause we need them but of there just cruising along like nothing is happening while the world burns nothing will change. Just my thinking. Also boo Buckner whenever in public lol. Joking kinda but I do want a change desperately

 

Sent from my SM-A326U using Tapatalk

 

 

 

 

[str8baller]

2 hours ago, JSHoosier said:

Wow, kind of makes IU leadership look somewhat borderline semi competent. Kind of impressive.

They were. They were one of the worst basketball and football programs in the B1G all the way until the 90’s when they finally got some leadership in the AD and hired a guy named Pat Richter. He hired Barry Alvarez who turned the football program into a big time program. Shortly there after they hired **** Bennett who turned the basketball program around. They hired Ryan after. Alvarez was talented enough they let him retire to become the AD though the 2000’s.  
 

They went from one of the worst programs to one of the best in the conference by firing incompetent people and hiring talented ones. They’re literally one of the prime examples I use when I recommend to keep getting rid of idiots until you finally hire some talent. You’ll know it when you have talent because you’ll see the results.  

[Class of '66 Old Fart]

9 hours ago, Demo said:

Correct, which doesn’t make him rare. Stevens, Donovan, Mike Montgomery, there’ve been plenty of guys who left college for the League and exponentially more who’ve never entertained coaching in college. They didn’t want to sell themselves to 17 year olds. They didn’t to want spend their summers watching travel ball. They didn’t want to do meet and greets with alumni or raise money for the library. They wanted to coach basketball minus the superfluous crap. Nothing wrong with that, but it’s the nature of this gig. The single most fundamental miscalculation that the powers that be made when hiring Woody was buying into the idea that we’ve been fed for years that IUBB HC was his “dream job.” No, it’s not and it may never have been. IUBB HC was his dream TITLE. He loves to be RECOGNIZED as the IUBB HC but at heart he has no stomach for the job. I don’t know, maybe if they’d hired him in ‘09 he might have evolved into one, maybe even a successful one. But in 2024 at 65 years old he’s not evolving into one now. This needs to be recognized and admitted, either by Woody or the decision makers. Another year is a stone waste of time and money because no matter how it goes it’s simply not moving you forward.

Sorry, had to get that one out of my system. 

A thousand likes.  To Woody, his position is nothing more than an ego stroke so he can be referred to as HC.  

[NashvilleHoosier]

9 hours ago, Demo said:

Correct, which doesn’t make him rare. Stevens, Donovan, Mike Montgomery, there’ve been plenty of guys who left college for the League and exponentially more who’ve never entertained coaching in college. They didn’t want to sell themselves to 17 year olds. They didn’t to want spend their summers watching travel ball. They didn’t want to do meet and greets with alumni or raise money for the library. They wanted to coach basketball minus the superfluous crap. Nothing wrong with that, but it’s the nature of this gig. The single most fundamental miscalculation that the powers that be made when hiring Woody was buying into the idea that we’ve been fed for years that IUBB HC was his “dream job.” No, it’s not and it may never have been. IUBB HC was his dream TITLE. He loves to be RECOGNIZED as the IUBB HC but at heart he has no stomach for the job. I don’t know, maybe if they’d hired him in ‘09 he might have evolved into one, maybe even a successful one. But in 2024 at 65 years old he’s not evolving into one now. This needs to be recognized and admitted, either by Woody or the decision makers. Another year is a stone waste of time and money because no matter how it goes it’s simply not moving you forward.

Sorry, had to get that one out of my system. 

I keep seeing that he wanted the job when Archie got it and felt snubbed. Imagine if we did hire him then. Does he put the same level of effort into recruiting? No portal to fall back on. Does he put in the work to land Romeo? TJD? With no portal I’m sure he recruits HS a bit harder but I can’t imagine he would have had the stomach to take on the full job only 4 years earlier. Only good thing that would have come from that is we’d already be done with him. 

[hoosierbannerd]

9 hours ago, LamarCheeks said:

Woody shows up at halftime Sunday. 

"Man, I was blindsighted by this whole time change thing." 

"Yeah, just gotta get that sun over the hump"...

[IndyHoops]

9 hours ago, Ngw7183 said:

All can be true. I am not ignoring things like system but I am also saying posts like that from Rabby saying that was the reason doesn’t add up. It wasn’t true he wasn’t visited and he knew the system when he committed. But now those are the facts and anything else is crazy talk. 

I can agree a system needs to change while also not believing that is main issue with recruits. Also don’t think fans are reason for him (that is another post) but might be for plenty others. 

Let’s assume he is gone. 

So how do we build back? I don’t think top coaches want to be here. Really believe that. So we get Dusty.

He himself said he wanted to quit same day of taking FAU job and almost did once be realized what he agreed to. He had a breakdown and went home and cried. Now, imagine him in year 3/4 and still missing tourney. You have to admit that is very possible. No way this fanbase gives him a break because his offense is nice. 

In 14 years what was our best team? Think about what led up to that. The fanbase fully backed off. They rallied behind one of the worst rosters ever. Few years later, program was number 1 in country.

All things can be true but we have a tendency to make things worse.  When multiple guys like TJD, Leal and now an IU family being recruited is saying the same thing, we can’t just toss it away and laugh which is what is done. You can be mad at the coach, want him 100%!gone and still realize this has to change. 
 

What am I getting at, Fire Woody, he retires, hire any coach, doesn’t matter, this fanbase has to stop attacking our own players, coach etc in year 2/3. Seems many always take that as lower expectations, nope. You can expect things without attacking and making it worse. 

We are not Kansas, UNC or UK. We don’t get that liberty right now.  

You are missing the point completely.

if Woodson:

* had any kind of high school talent coming in that fans could get excited about watching develop over the next few years

* was out recruiting Indiana kids hard. Doesn’t matter if you get all them. But was putting in the work

* admit some changes need to be made on offense instead of doubling down on basketball is played “inside-out”

* wasn’t trying to build the entire roster from the portal. Making Indiana “Portal U”

Serious question, what is there to be positive about for an IU basketball fan? DePaul and some other programs would love to have the following IU does. The fan base is one of the biggest selling points for IU right now. NIL is what it is because of the fans.

Let’s play another game… OSU fired Holtmann half way through this year after ONE bad year. He made the NCAA five years in a row. Are the OSU fans the problem?

Howard is barely hanging on at Michigan this year after ONE bad year.The previous 2 years Howard WON THE BIG TEN, went to the Elite Eight AND made a Sweet 16, are the Michigan fans the problem?? 
 

The fact is Woodson is going to get fired next year. He simply isn’t a good enough college coach to pull off what needs to be done next year. So why wait? So we can be like Michigan next year? So we can fire a former player half way through the season like OSU? Or is IU not at the same level as OSU and Michigan in basketball?

 

Edited March 9, 2024 by IndyHoops

[NashvilleHoosier]

9 hours ago, Ngw7183 said:

We are not Kansas, UNC or UK. We don’t get that liberty right now.  

This message needs to be delivered loud and clear….and the person who needs to hear it the loudest and the clearest is Mike Woodson.