They “Retired” Coach Woodson Thread

[Golfman25]

19 minutes ago, Redcamaro said:

Man, I can't see how we don't land a couple of stud guards from the portal after the season. Perception everywhere is that our weakness is guard play. People see how well we play the inside game. Keep the core together and with our NIL package we should be able to draw some interest.

The Mike Woodson going to the portal for success is going to crash and burn.  Book it.  Looks like we'll need 4-5 studs to come in.  Yet if you look at last year's numbers:  Of the top 25 players -- Bama, Gonzaga, TCU and TX each got 2.  If you drop to down to top 50 -- Nova, Kansas, and WVU each got 3. 

Now who's going to convince me, the Mike Woodson is going to be able to pull 3-4+ of the top players from the portal against some of the better programs in the nation.  Give me a break.  It's a pipe dream.  

[Hoosierfan2017]

With the way college sports are changing, IU could be in danger of being relegated to some lesser league given how bad we are at basketball and football. How many other Big 10 schools have worse basketball/football results recently than IU? 

[Home Jersey]

13 minutes ago, rcs29 said:

So save $ and fly him in from wherever after every game and do that.
 

But then it's not "cool" anymore because he doesn't have the cache of being IUBB's HC. Lol

[Stuhoo]

3 minutes ago, Hornsby said:

Think of all the stud coaches we missed out in because our administration is incompetent.

Matta
Beilein
Steven's
Dusty May up next on the list.

You gotta be beyond incompetent to miss out of all of them.

Sent from my SM-A146U using Tapatalk
 

The combined college coaching record of those three that we "missed out on" by hiring Woody?

32-31

Woody's record since then?

61-39

 

Because Beilein and Stevens have not returned to the college game (a combined 0-0 record), and Matta has been meh at Butler.

If you're gonna constantly (and I mean constantly) be nasty to IU and Woody, at least try to maintain accuracy.

[IndyHoops]

36 minutes ago, Ngw7183 said:

All the more reason every P6 school will have one in next 2/3 years or less. GM is needed by all. Football even more so. 

some can’t remove their displeasure for all things Woody and see anything else. 

How many “GM” roles are out there for all sports and colleges in the nation?

[Sardinefarts1991]

Where is everyone coming up with this GM thing?  Or are we just guessing that's probably the bandaid they are gonna use to keep Woody?

[IUCrazy2]

2 hours ago, Chris007 said:

From what it sounds like the family that wanted to keep Woody here a 4th year and employs QB has agreed to put more money into our NIL efforts. They are going to give Woody every chance to get the players he wants in this portal. 

Unless that is a permanent commitment then who cares?  If it is true that Woody thinks he has to build out of the portal every year they are going to have to pony up all that money until he is gone and all that to likely have a ceiling of what he did with 2 NBA draft picks last year.

He isn't the answer but leave it to people who made their money off shopping malls to throw their weight behind a coach who is stuck in the 80's and 90's.  It is really on brand.

[ap2345]

10 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

The combined college coaching record of those three that we "missed out on" by hiring Woody?

32-31

Woody's record since then?

61-39

 

Because Beilein and Stevens have not returned to the college game (a combined 0-0 record), and Matta has been meh at Butler.

If you're gonna constantly (and I mean constantly) be nasty to IU and Woody, at least try to maintain accuracy.

Matta has been better than meh if you actually watch the improvements he’s made given what he was taking over when he got back to Butler although he wasn’t a real candidate last time.

[Home Jersey]

15 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

The combined college coaching record of those three that we "missed out on" by hiring Woody?

32-31

Woody's record since then?

61-39

 

Because Beilein and Stevens have not returned to the college game (a combined 0-0 record), and Matta has been meh at Butler.

If you're gonna constantly (and I mean constantly) be nasty to IU and Woody, at least try to maintain accuracy.

I'm not saying we necessarily "missed" on all those coaches because I didn't follow that stuff so closely at the time.

However, with all due respect, this "stat" does seem sort of disingenuous based on Beilein and Stevens having not coached in college during that time. The stat is really just comparing Woody to Matta, so it's fair IMO to say he shouldn't have been included on Hornsby's original list. I recognize it's been a long time since those guys have coached college basketball and it's no guarantee they would have been more successful than Woody here. But they had done it before, Woody hadn't. Not sure I'd say we "missed out" on them but would find it fair to put them in the category of stud coaches who aren't employed here. Where you place the blame for that (administration or elsewhere) is probably up for interpretation - who knows how realistic they actually were at the time? Apparently not very... Would they have done a better job? I definitely think so.

I do agree with your last point 100%. Realizing I'm more negative than usual at the moment but yesterday's news is hard to swallow. Wound is still fresh and people are venting, little bit of hyperbole (some of which I am also guilty of) going on.

Woody is our guy, I'm rooting for them to figure it out and finish strong/have a great year next year. Just wishing I could see a more realistic path toward that happening... with so much going on this month and next, I'm looking forward to the news cycle giving us more reasons to be hopeful/optimistic/excited. 

[HoosierHuddle]

Long-time, first time. This is a cool community and I figured I'd start posting...I won't add much, if any, in the way of intelligent conversation but I probably won't anger too many either. To paraphrase, "I gotta lot of thoughts and now, you people are going to hear about them". I am not in a position to hear things that are interesting like Chris007 does or know people (maybe?) like KathywithaC does but I do have information from time to time...typically about football, a program that should have prepared us for having blind hope with no rational expectation for success!

I'm not at all happy Woodson is back, no need to rehash any of the reasons. It's an illogical decision made on the basis of faulty thinking and people in power flexing their privilege to keep a man employed for selfish reasons. The head coach at Indiana University, in any sport, should be a position of merit. Not one kept because of connections to donors and past accomplishments (not as a coach though). That horse has been beaten to death. Moving on...

-Given the extremely large war chest of NIL funds that Mike Woodson and his staff (whoever that may be...I think it's likely all three assistants stay and a recruiting GM type, perhaps a Kenny Payne?, gets added to the staff. Armond Hill might be done, who knows) are being handed by the collectives plus more funds from the Simon family, Indiana will be a very attractive option for guys like Mackenzie Mgbako, Malik Reneau and Trey Galloway. They might not love everything about the system Woodson runs but it does not appear to me that they despise the man and the effort is certainly on the floor right now. If we add a good rim-protecting center that can move and play out of the paint on offense and then pair him with Malik (who really needs to become a better rebounder and stop fouling so much), convince Mgbako to come back and add Liam McNeeley...that's a good start. Find 2-3 difference-making guards with a huge offer of NIL funds and we'd be cooking. My hope would be it would be good enough to get like a 7-seed in the tournament. Maybe we win a round or two and Woody feels good enough about things to "gracefully retire" feeling he has stabilized IU basketball. That's best case scenario, obviously. Much guff will be given about needing to acquire a rim protecting center but if Malik is in the lineup, it's kind of a must. He's not big enough and not a good enough defender or rebounder to play him at center. He'd foul out in 15 minutes per game.

-How does everyone think Woodson will want to handle the non-conference schedule next season? I could see him wanting to rack up 9 or 10 wins in guarantee games instead of making it a really challenging non-conference slate. It'll be a lot of new pieces and I could see him justifying an easy non-conference schedule (we'd have to actually thump those teams to not tank our NET rating this time around) by pointing out all of the new players. I just don't see him wanting to go play a bunch of high-profile games again with the pressure on.

[AH1971]

12 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

The combined college coaching record of those three that we "missed out on" by hiring Woody?

32-31

Woody's record since then?

61-39

 

Because Beilein and Stevens have not returned to the college game (a combined 0-0 record), and Matta has been meh at Butler.

If you're gonna constantly (and I mean constantly) be nasty to IU and Woody, at least try to maintain accuracy.

I don't think he's alluding to those 3 in the present day:

Matta circa 2003-04

Beilein 2006

Stevens 2011 or 2014-15

[AH1971]

7 minutes ago, Sardinefarts1991 said:

Where is everyone coming up with this GM thing?  Or are we just guessing that's probably the bandaid they are gonna use to keep Woody?

Goodman suggested it last night

[mdiu28]

2 minutes ago, HoosierHuddle said:

Long-time, first time. This is a cool community and I figured I'd start posting...I won't add much, if any, in the way of intelligent conversation but I probably won't anger too many either. To paraphrase, "I gotta lot of thoughts and now, you people are going to hear about them". I am not in a position to hear things that are interesting like Chris007 does or know people (maybe?) like KathywithaC does but I do have information from time to time...typically about football, a program that should have prepared us for having blind hope with no rational expectation for success!

I'm not at all happy Woodson is back, no need to rehash any of the reasons. It's an illogical decision made on the basis of faulty thinking and people in power flexing their privilege to keep a man employed for selfish reasons. The head coach at Indiana University, in any sport, should be a position of merit. Not one kept because of connections to donors and past accomplishments (not as a coach though). That horse has been beaten to death. Moving on...

-Given the extremely large war chest of NIL funds that Mike Woodson and his staff (whoever that may be...I think it's likely all three assistants stay and a recruiting GM type, perhaps a Kenny Payne?, gets added to the staff. Armond Hill might be done, who knows) are being handed by the collectives plus more funds from the Simon family, Indiana will be a very attractive option for guys like Mackenzie Mgbako, Malik Reneau and Trey Galloway. They might not love everything about the system Woodson runs but it does not appear to me that they despise the man and the effort is certainly on the floor right now. If we add a good rim-protecting center that can move and play out of the paint on offense and then pair him with Malik (who really needs to become a better rebounder and stop fouling so much), convince Mgbako to come back and add Liam McNeeley...that's a good start. Find 2-3 difference-making guards with a huge offer of NIL funds and we'd be cooking. My hope would be it would be good enough to get like a 7-seed in the tournament. Maybe we win a round or two and Woody feels good enough about things to "gracefully retire" feeling he has stabilized IU basketball. That's best case scenario, obviously. Much guff will be given about needing to acquire a rim protecting center but if Malik is in the lineup, it's kind of a must. He's not big enough and not a good enough defender or rebounder to play him at center. He'd foul out in 15 minutes per game.

-How does everyone think Woodson will want to handle the non-conference schedule next season? I could see him wanting to rack up 9 or 10 wins in guarantee games instead of making it a really challenging non-conference slate. It'll be a lot of new pieces and I could see him justifying an easy non-conference schedule (we'd have to actually thump those teams to not tank our NET rating this time around) by pointing out all of the new players. I just don't see him wanting to go play a bunch of high-profile games again with the pressure on.

Fire Woody

[HoosierHoopster]

2 hours ago, IU22 said:

Do we have to let Woody pick the players? He's not good at it.

Tell  you what, the Simons can pay me to pick the players. I'll do a better job!

[HoosierHoopster]

3 minutes ago, HoosierHuddle said:

..I won't add much, if any, in the way of intelligent conversation

You'll fit right in!

[southernindianahoosier2]

If Quinn is no longer on the Board, can the AD do his job? Or will he still be handcuffed? 

[HoosierHuddle]

2 minutes ago, AH1971 said:

Goodman suggested it last night

I also think it was mentioned in vague terms by Eric on the Spaces thing he did last night. He kinda alluded to all three assistants being back but the staff being somewhat different with an addition. I don't know if the term "GM" was used by him and he was not sure what all the role would entail but it would be primarily recruiting based.

[southernindianahoosier2]

Feels like IU is Blockbuster and we failed to buy Netflix (Stevens in 2011) when we had the chance

Feels like IU is Blockbuster and we failed to buy Netflix (Dusty May in 2024) when we had the chance….

How is it that the Fanbase can see it but no one else does!!!! 

 

[HoosierTrav]

5 hours ago, mdiu28 said:

Thank you for your info!

Keeping someone employed simply because he is "well liked" is the overall problem we have within our administration. They just don't seem to be able to make the decisions I think they know they need to out of fear it'll hurt someone's feelings. Operating from a place of fear is how other programs overtake you and that's what's been happening at IU. We're weak.

Not saying we need new leadership, but we need new leadership. I'm glad to hear Dolson at least understands the problem, he's just handcuffed and that's what pisses me off. If Scott wants to win (I'm positive he does) and sees a way to get us there (Pearl, May, whomever), he should have the freedom to make that move. That's his job. Why do we even have an AD if they don't trust him to make decisions? 

I really hope keeping him isn't some sort of a year-by-year evaluation. That would be a nightmare. Meaning if he makes the tourney next year, he gets another. And so on. Our admin seems dumb enough to go with something like that.

Exactly. Why have an AD? We have a bunch of academics (aside from Buckner) trying to have ultimate say in who coaches our program’s flagship team. 
 

If you lose the fan support of Men’s Basketball, it will negatively impact the others we are building (and attempting to) into winners (wbb and Football). 
 

This time feels different than past times. I think we are going to see a precipitous drop in fan interest and participation. The base was always split between those ticked off at how things were ran and those who felt it was a string of bad luck that would eventually be corrected. Now, the manifestations of the Dunning-Kruger effect and incompetency are unmistakably apparent. This will compel long time supporters to distance themselves. I harbor a deep resentment to such individuals in daily interactions, opting to avoid them entirely. Possessing even a modicum of integrity, why would one compromise this fundamental principle by giving them my time and hard earned money?

[Home Jersey]

6 minutes ago, southernindianahoosier2 said:

If Quinn is no longer on the Board, can the AD do his job? Or will he still be handcuffed? 

Sadly it seems IMO the cesspool of internal politics at IU is a hereditary trait, considering multiple administrations made up of entirely different individuals have operated in the same way over the past ~25 years+. Appears to be a feature, not a bug, of the IU system. Engrained in the institutional culture you may say. The Board should not interfere with an AD making a sports decision aside from where the usual financial and ethical scrutiny is applied. It seems that is how we operate though. 

Now... that is not to say that the Board has not delivered many good things (it has) from an academic and research perspective. It's just that they should stay focused on that and not stick their nose where it doesn't belong. 

Of course a lot of the blame does not IMO rest on the Board, at least not alone. The mega donors were equally part of this call. 

Make of that, what you will in terms of what it means for our ability to field a competitive basketball team anytime soon.