The Season Is Finally Over, Now Where Does This Program Go?

[ap2345]

You obviously miss the point.  I would take a Victor Oladipo and an OG Anunoby any day if the price is Peter Jerkin or any of the others mentioned.  Crean's approach of recruiting "diamonds in the rough" brought a couple of great players to IU who helped IU win Big 10 Championships and get to the Sweet 16.  That approach also brought in some guys who rarely played. I have no problem with that.  As I said, Bobby Knight recruited guys who almost never got up from the end of the bench and watched while the regular players won three national championships. It's time to get over Tom Crean who is now gone for two years and focus on how to make the current program competitive again for conference championships and getting into the NCAA Tournament.

The thing is even though Vic and OG were lower rated recruits they still had athletic traits that the other guys you mentioned did not have. Priller and Jurkin didn’t have really anything except some size and Gellon could shoot and was 6’5 but he struggled with other skills and was limited athletically.


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[Brass Cannon]

8 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Priller and the rest are so completely beside the point of anything to do with anything related to the success or lack of success in IU basketball. Indiana won Big Ten Championship with players like those you mentioned sitting on the bench (and there were never 4 Prillers on the bench at any one time). Crean recruited McDonald's All Americans (Zeller, Ferrell, Blackmon, and Vonleah), 4 stars, and yes some diamonds in the rough like Oladipo and Anunoby. Some of those diamonds in the rough didn't work out. But having those guys on the bench had zero impact on IU's performance. Some fans seem to hang on to Tim Priller and others who left the building long ago as a way to avoid to discussing the reality of today. It strikes me as odd. I can only suggest you get over it and focus on what IU basketball should be in the future.

They won with them and then fell off the cliff the next years because there weren’t players ready to step up and contribute. 

[Honkyman]

Fell off the cliff? IU won the Big Ten Championship in Crean's 2nd to last year. Some fans blame injuries for this year's disappointment. But had OG Anunoby not been lost for the rest of his sophomore year, Indiana's season would have been much different. Crean was not fired because the program "fell off the cliff." He was fired because a couple of Sweet 16s and a couple of Big Ten Championships were not enough for the fan base.

[Walking Boot of Doom]

I think keyboard warriors are getting way out ahead of them selves on Archie. No one is denying the serious flaws, but I think some aren’t seeing the potential. He’s a young coach, we a promising background, and it takes time to learn and build a sustainable program. There’s no way around it.

Go ahead, point out the anomalies like Beard and I guess maybe Holtman. But they are anomalies. Too many coaches have backed Archie’s talent, including the vaunted Bob Knight, for the keyboard firing squad to make the call after two seasons. There’s potential there - give it time to grow.

We really have nothing left to lose at this point.


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[yogisballin]

On 3/27/2019 at 7:48 PM, HinnyHoosier said:

 

 

 

 

You all know they could have completely folded without him, but they didn't.

If you expected them to pound the competition and play seamless basketball at that point, after alllll the crap of this season, then I don't know what to tell you.


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Just was asking a fair question sir. No, I did not think for one second that we should have pounded the competition. But I do not think we played well either. 

[Brass Cannon]

5 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Fell off the cliff? IU won the Big Ten Championship in Crean's 2nd to last year. Some fans blame injuries for this year's disappointment. But had OG Anunoby not been lost for the rest of his sophomore year, Indiana's season would have been much different. Crean was not fired because the program "fell off the cliff." He was fired because a couple of Sweet 16s and a couple of Big Ten Championships were not enough for the fan base.

We missed the tourney the year after both. Missed the NIT the first time. 

[HinnyHoosier]

I’m not calling you a crybaby

No not you. Whoever posted before you.... I don't even remember haha.


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[Honkyman]

Before OG Anunoby was hurt, Indiana defeated future NCAA Champs North Carolina and Kansas--not struggling.

[Brass Cannon]

13 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Before OG Anunoby was hurt, Indiana defeated future NCAA Champs North Carolina and Kansas--not struggling.

And then missed the tourney because there was no depth behind him. Glossing over that fact

[Honkyman]

I find this obsession with bashing the former coach as a way to avoid addressing problems with the current program ridiculous. Tom Crean is not the reason IU lost 11 out of 12 games this year. Crean is not the reason IU lost to Ohio State in the Big 10 Tournament thereby losing a chance to make the NCAA Tournament. I know some people on this board really hated the guy and apparently still do. I'm glad he's no longer the coach, too. But he is not to blame for this year's disappointing season.

[IUc2016]

5 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Before OG Anunoby was hurt, Indiana defeated future NCAA Champs North Carolina and Kansas--not struggling.

yes but in typical Crean fashion they lost to IPFW in that same month. And then later lost a terrible Nebraska team at home followed by a home loss to a mediocre Wisconsin team. All before OG went down. 

If OG had not been injured that team probably squeaks into the tournament, but it still would not have mattered. The program was going nowhere. 

As for the current coach, those players on the end of the bench have a chance to develop unlike the end of Crean's bench because there was either no talent at all or they were creaned.

The jury is still out on whether that development happens, obviously. 

[Joe DeLow]

Before OG Anunoby was hurt, Indiana defeated future NCAA Champs North Carolina and Kansas--not struggling.

And lost to IPFW.


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[IUc2016]

13 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

I find this obsession with bashing the former coach as a way to avoid addressing problems with the current program ridiculous. Tom Crean is not the reason IU lost 11 out of 12 games this year. Crean is not the reason IU lost to Ohio State in the Big 10 Tournament thereby losing a chance to make the NCAA Tournament. I know some people on this board really hated the guy and apparently still do. I'm glad he's no longer the coach, too. But he is not to blame for this year's disappointing season.

I haven't seen anyone blame Crean for the losing streak this year. Most people in this thread have been critical of Archie. Some saying it is still a wait and see process while others being less optimistic. Each view is fine considering what happened this year. 

But the whole argument that it is okay to bring in guys like Priller, April, and Bawa among others is a stretch in my opinion. Especially since bringing in those guys has absolutely nothing to do with bringing in Oladipo and Aunonoby as those two were actually recruited by other high majors. 

You have to have players on your bench who have a chance to develop later on. A lot of the players Crean brought in had no shot to develop so they transferred. Thats not good for a program. 

Just look at the players on the end of Purdue's bench last year, Aaron Wheeler and Sasha Stefanovic. They sat out last year and developed and now are providing quality minutes to a team in the elite 8. To say the end of the bench does not matter is incorrect in my opinion. 

[Honkyman]

You say you're not obsessed and then continue on a rant about Crean recruits who haven't been at IU in years.  I really don't get this continued obsession in 2019 with Crean's recruiting habits, a coach who has been gone two years, and players he recruited some of whom haven't been around in a decade. Very weird. You all can obsess about Tom Crean's long gone players. I think I'll focus on the current squad.

[JSHoosier]

59 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Fell off the cliff? IU won the Big Ten Championship in Crean's 2nd to last year. Some fans blame injuries for this year's disappointment. But had OG Anunoby not been lost for the rest of his sophomore year, Indiana's season would have been much different. Crean was not fired because the program "fell off the cliff." He was fired because a couple of Sweet 16s and a couple of Big Ten Championships were not enough for the fan base.

If it was up to the fan base Crean probably would've been gone sooner, like he should have been.

[IUc2016]

4 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

You say you're not obsessed and then continue on a rant about Crean recruits who haven't been at IU in years.  I really don't get this continued obsession in 2019 with Crean's recruiting habits, a coach who has been gone two years, and players he recruited some of whom haven't been around in a decade. Very weird. You all can obsess about Tom Crean's long gone players. I think I'll focus on the current squad.

Thank you. Glad I have your permission to continue to obsess over Tommy Crean. 

[Hoosierfan2017]

54 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Before OG Anunoby was hurt, Indiana defeated future NCAA Champs North Carolina and Kansas--not struggling.

IU lost four of six before OG got hurt in the Penn State game. We were already on a downward slide and then his injury made it worse. 

[8bucks]

You say you're not obsessed and then continue on a rant about Crean recruits who haven't been at IU in years.  I really don't get this continued obsession in 2019 with Crean's recruiting habits, a coach who has been gone two years, and players he recruited some of whom haven't been around in a decade. Very weird. You all can obsess about Tom Crean's long gone players. I think I'll focus on the current squad.

Seems you are as obsessed defending Crean and each time you post (and mention Crean) someone responds and mentions Crean. You also mention a desire to focus on the current squad which has Crean recruited players but you act as if Crean’s influence has been gone 2 years.

I have no idea if Archie is the right fit or not but part of the hole we are in is that we are changing from a offensive based team to a defensive based team. There could be culture issues still from guys who started off playing for Crean and are now leaders in an Archie system. That could have an impact.

I put more of the struggle on the current squad and coach than Crean but his time here is still impacting the current squad to some extent.


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[Joe DeLow]

If it was up to the fan base Crean probably would've been gone sooner, like he should have been.

He would have been gone after the 10-11 season. Threw money at Brad Stevens and still gotten Cody Zeller.


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[southernindianahoosier2]

3 minutes ago, Joe DeLow said:

He would have been gone after the 10-11 season. Threw money at Brad Stevens and still gotten Cody Zeller.


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Absolutely. It even isn't like we are speaking about this saying, "Oh in hindsight, that was the right move"... Fans were screaming for this to happen back then. Makes me wonder what reality Fred Glass lives in.