Player and Recruit Retention News/Discussion & Potential Transfers

[bigrod 2,904]

5 minutes ago, TheWatShot said:

He plagiarized a paper and got a zero, which brought his grade down to a C-. He then claimed IU saw this as a solution to the oversign situation and jumped on it. Maybe if he'd tried a little harder in high school it wouldn't have come down to that.

Well, if true, it obviously was a solution. Pretty hard to imagine Crean knew that was going to happen though.

[mdn82 25,546]

That still sounds like a Ron Patterson problem to me. If IU's standards were clear and he didn't meet them, then that's just how it goes, or how it worked itself out.

Absolutely. Crean and IU were clear what he had to do and gave him every bit of help during his probationary period. Crean wanted him to be a part of that class more than most of the movement. To insinuate he ran him off is asinine.


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[Bowhunter 2,707]

I hope we do over sign a little. Not to Crean's magnatude but I would like to see some of our 4 or 5 star kids make it to the NBA by year 2 or 3. This isn't Dayton and it's not Kentucky one and done. I just want consistent talent which will require an over sign here and there.

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[BGleas 7,917]

Oversigning because some guys are going to the NBA is one thing, oversigning because you don't want to grant Matt Roth or Colin Hartman a 5th year is another entirely to me. IMO, Crean fostered an atmosphere where guys felt they had to move on or graduate early, or that their spot wasn't safe. I think that's partly why recruiting began to fall off. 

For instance, I believe that Crean was still the coach that there is no way Hartman is coming back, and I think that's a mistake. Same thing with Roth in 12-13. 

[Hovadipo 56,787]

That is true, but if we had a scholarship available, do you think he would have "fully qualified?" I personally think it would have been a non-issue.
My whole thing with Crean was his whole approach to recruiting. He would offer 15 kids for 2 scholarships. He didn't seem to recruit based on need, and didn't seem to have any real plan. Every year he over recruited because it seemed he couldn't stand the thought of a single scholarship going unclaimed. It was almost like an addiction.

I agree with the Crean thing. The shotgun approach was crazy and dumb and put us in bad situations nearly every year. There's a difference between a strategic oversign and what Crean did. And then you have the problem with situational offers and "we're offering but don't accept until we tell you to". I don't like that at all and am certain that happened every year and there were some kids that probably got screwed by it. I have no evidence, just ideas from very closely watching our recruiting for 4-5 years.

[Uspshoosier 46,329]

Oversigning because some guys are going to the NBA is one thing, oversigning because you don't want to grant Matt Roth or Colin Hartman a 5th year is another entirely to me. IMO, Crean fostered an atmosphere where guys felt they had to move on or graduate early, or that their spot wasn't safe. I think that's partly why recruiting began to fall off. 
For instance, I believe that Crean was still the coach that there is no way Hartman is coming back, and I think that's a mistake. Same thing with Roth in 12-13. 

Crean did say in a press conference Hartman could come back if he wanted to. Roth got a raw deal in his situation ( yes I know he got a grad degree) but still he should of been able to play his last year


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[HoosierAloha 30,077]

I understand oversigning players but I don't like it. I also think there are advantages to not oversigning. Like mentioned above, you're not sending a message that you need to be gone after 4 years. If there is a scholarship available then reward a walkon.

We lacked senior leaders for most of Crean's tenure due to NBA departures, transfers, or not having a scholly available. Fourth and fifth year seniors can provide valuable leadership that a new frosh can't.

We might be losing only one scholarship player to the NBA yet Crean was still recruiting '17. Who would have gone? Hartman seemed to be one of them (fifth year senior leadership).

Have a solid 8-9 man rotation with players 10-12 willing to either work and wait their time or just bust their butt preparing the rotation players. Bag a scholly for a grad transfer or a high level spring commit. We need roster balance and upperclassmen to provide real leadership.

[DChoosier 8,728]

Just looked at today's NBADRAFT.NET  update.

At 28th OG is barely hanging on to the first round.  TB,JBJ and Rojo are not listed in the first or second round.  Hopefully they will stay but who knows, they might look at undrafted Troy and Yogi and think "that could be me".  

FWIW 8 of the projected top 20 picks are from just three schools (Duke, UCLA, UK).....none of which made the FF.

Edit: meant to say 8 of the top 20 picks are from 2 schools and Kentucky.

[VO5 8,272]

5 minutes ago, DChoosier said:

Just looked at today's NBADRAFT.NET  update.

At 28th OG is barely hanging on to the first round.  TB,JBJ and Rojo are not listed in the first or second round.  Hopefully they will stay but who knows, they might look at undrafted Troy and Yogi and think "that could be me".  

FWIW 8 of the projected top 20 picks are from just three schools (Duke, UCLA, UK).....none of which made the FF.

Draftexpress is the site you need to be looking at. OG is 15 and TB is 41. With all due respect, nbadraft.net is garbage.

[DChoosier 8,728]

1 minute ago, VO5 said:

Draftexpress is the site you need to be looking at. OG is 15 and TB is 41. With all due respect, nbadraft.net is garbage.

Thanks.

i have no idea who does a better job predicting the draft.

[VO5 8,272]

Just now, DChoosier said:

Thanks.

i have no idea who does a better job predicting the draft.

No prob. The guy running draftexpress (Jonathan Givony) really does his homework.

[LIHoosier 26,545]

6 hours ago, bigrod said:

You seem very angry, Tom. Is everything alright?

 

5 hours ago, Josh said:

I'm not Tom, and I'm great! Thanks for asking.

What am I missing from your Ron Patterson scenario?

Should've kept your 'signature' signature. ;)

[Josh 12,711]

Should've kept your 'signature' signature. ;)

Yeah, I think some of these cats think I'm a Crean fan lol!

[323SGrant 1,176]

43 minutes ago, VO5 said:

No prob. The guy running draftexpress (Jonathan Givony) really does his homework.

I also prefer Draft Express.

[Hoosier Guy 7,560]

Oversigning needs to burn in a pit of fire. All it does is alienate players, coaches and recruits

[bigrod 2,904]

Yeah, I think some of these cats think I'm a Crean fan lol!

I was just trying to be funny. Seemed like everything was taken too seriously. Most of the time I'm just joking around and trying to have fun on here. This site is my escape from the serious world out there.


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[JSHoosier 20,439]

3 minutes ago, Hoosier Guy said:

Oversigning needs to burn in a pit of fire. All it does is alienate players, coaches and recruits

I would dance a jig the B1G banned oversigning.  Won't happen, but I wish it would.

[bigrod 2,904]

Absolutely. Crean and IU were clear what he had to do and gave him every bit of help during his probationary period. Crean wanted him to be a part of that class more than most of the movement. To insinuate he ran him off is asinine.


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Okay, in your eyes that was asinine. Summer classes were done and fall semester was starting and we still had too many players. Tell me, where was the scholarship coming from if someone wasn't ran off?


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[Brass Cannon 24,913]

3 minutes ago, JSHoosier said:

I would dance a jig the B1G banned oversigning.  Won't happen, but I wish it would.

Players would just get creaned sooner 

[Hoosier Guy 7,560]

6 minutes ago, JSHoosier said:

I would dance a jig the B1G banned oversigning.  Won't happen, but I wish it would.

Yeah it's just the B1G that has it if I'm not mistaken. It's a terrible rule