IUBB vs Purdue - Tuesday, 01.16.24 @ 7:00

[Stuhoo 85,601]

5 hours ago, HoosierTrav said:

Where I’m at. We have so many gaps to fill. This staff has missed on so many more targets than they’ve hit on. Could it happen? Sure. Is it likely? I don’t think so.

What evidence do we have that Woody is being humbled? He just threw another one of his players under the bus in the presser today. My bet is that we’ll see pigs fly before we see Mike Woodson humbled enough to: 1. admit his way isn’t working, 2. take full responsibility, and 3. create immediately effective change.

Woody needs a ton of high end talent to win. He’s not getting enough of that talent. Liam, as good as he is, is not going to be enough next year. 

I agree that we cant let him go this year. I’d argue that we handcuffed ourselves from ever truly being able to let him go. It’s why it was an absolute blunder of a hire. He will go on his terms. I’m more angry with Dolson and the good ol boys club than I am of CMW. 
 

The people running this program refuse to win. There really are no more reasonable excuses why we are approaching nearly 22 years since our last final 4 appearances. We’ve only made 11 ncaa tournaments in the last 22 years!!! That’s an indictment on those in charge of hiring. 
 

 

 

The post game presser is mandatory.

There is practically nothing that can be said in the post game presser that is going to be well received after a game like that.

11/22 NCAA appearances is horrendous.

[Kentuckysucks 3,425]

5 hours ago, HoosierTrav said:

Where I’m at. We have so many gaps to fill. This staff has missed on so many more targets than they’ve hit on. Could it happen? Sure. Is it likely? I don’t think so.

What evidence do we have that Woody is being humbled? He just threw another one of his players under the bus in the presser today. My bet is that we’ll see pigs fly before we see Mike Woodson humbled enough to: 1. admit his way isn’t working, 2. take full responsibility, and 3. create immediately effective change.

Woody needs a ton of high end talent to win. He’s not getting enough of that talent. Liam, as good as he is, is not going to be enough next year. 

I agree that we cant let him go this year. I’d argue that we handcuffed ourselves from ever truly being able to let him go. It’s why it was an absolute blunder of a hire. He will go on his terms. I’m more angry with Dolson and the good ol boys club than I am of CMW. 
 

The people running this program refuse to win. There really are no more reasonable excuses why we are approaching nearly 22 years since our last final 4 appearances. We’ve only made 11 ncaa tournaments in the last 22 years!!! That’s an indictment on those in charge of hiring. 
 

 

 

They don't want to win.  I'm convinced at this point.  There have too many home run hires they've passed on over the years.  Nothing else makes any sense.  Unless they can get a Stevens, Donovan, Wright (someone squeaky clean and who they can control which is never happening) they don't want to win.  At least not if there's butts in the seats and money keeps flowing in.

[Golfman25 6,288]

8 hours ago, Ngw7183 said:

I understand everyone is mad. Me included. Little chance of rational thought.  

For all the questions on every front, we are just undermanned. We are relying on an under talented freshman. 2 more sophs and another freshman. Get it, Woody’s fault. Discussed hundreds of times.

Does this change things massively for next year soon? Can really see a few more having to stay now. More of these guys coming back gives you a lot of resources to go hard at portal guards. I could see more of that happening than before. Could be a very strong roster. Woody is also starting to be humbled some.  He is a competitor too and is going to hate feeling like he is failing. 

Very common in rebuilds to go year 3 setback and year 4 takes off.  Then you can transition it easier.

I know some don’t want to hear that and want it ripped up now.  Think that sets you back big (yes, even in portal era)

Just something maybe, maybe positive to think about.  I really do think a lot of this angst is the prospect of so many leaving again. 

Sorry to say, but our guys are legends in their own minds.  None of them are NBA ready.  Ware is being exposed against the men he’s playing.  Another year will do them all good.  

[Home Jersey 12,299]

9 hours ago, Ngw7183 said:

I understand everyone is mad. Me included. Little chance of rational thought.  

For all the questions on every front, we are just undermanned. We are relying on an under talented freshman. 2 more sophs and another freshman. Get it, Woody’s fault. Discussed hundreds of times.

Does this change things massively for next year soon? Can really see a few more having to stay now. More of these guys coming back gives you a lot of resources to go hard at portal guards. I could see more of that happening than before. Could be a very strong roster. Woody is also starting to be humbled some.  He is a competitor too and is going to hate feeling like he is failing. 

Very common in rebuilds to go year 3 setback and year 4 takes off.  Then you can transition it easier.

I know some don’t want to hear that and want it ripped up now.  Think that sets you back big (yes, even in portal era)

Just something maybe, maybe positive to think about.  I really do think a lot of this angst is the prospect of so many leaving again. 

Yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head with your last sentence. Someone else pointed out we've missed 11/22 NCAA appearances the last 22 years. That is awful, but missing the tournament is not a fireable offense at Indiana University right now and hasn't for a while. 

In other words, we can all - on some level - deal with a 16/17/18 win season where we miss the tournament (it will suck) but we can't deal with two of those years in a row with a coach who's on his way out of the profession soon. Right now looking at the roster, yes we are playing 2 freshmen and 2 sophomores heavy minutes but it feels like you're only likely to get 2 of those guys back (Cupps and Reneau) but nothing is guaranteed. Things look very bleak for next year too if you lose Mack and Ware (Ware almost guaranteed... I think?).

When the product on the court is soooo ugly and there's little reason for hope it will change soon, you're gonna get questions about what the right long-term move is. I understand pressers are mandatory and 95% of the time meaningless coach speak, but for Woody to call out Ware specifically yesterday is curious. He's been calling players out in the press (fine in itself), snippy with reporters asking questions about his rotations (I get it but there's better ways of handling those questions than being defensive)... 

Yesterday he said he "hates coaching that way" where he's looking back at what he should have done differently. He's shown he can put together a decent game plan last year sometimes but way too often it's the same set of problems not getting fixed. 

I'd like to believe year 3 is a minor set back so we take off in year 4, but there's a lot of blanks to fill in before I can even see a scenario where we are in position to do that. Since we just gave him a raise last offseason (among other factors) seems unlikely he leaves after this offseason. Not saying that's a good or bad thing but I do think at minimum that's time to get new blood on the staff in terms of his assistants at least. Holdovers from Archie's time are going to keep on getting you Archie results.... 

It just sucks to watch this team right now

[IUFAN1976 4,320]

9 hours ago, str8baller said:

By my quick count, if we miss the tourney  this year we’ll have essentially only made the tourney 50% of the seasons since Knight left.  
 

That is absolutely ridiculous for a 68 team tourney and a “top program.”

I agree.  We should at least be making the tournament no less than 75% of the time.  And should be higher than that with the transfer portal.  

[Golfman25 6,288]

42 minutes ago, Home Jersey said:

Yeah, I think you hit the nail on the head with your last sentence. Someone else pointed out we've missed 11/22 NCAA appearances the last 22 years. That is awful, but missing the tournament is not a fireable offense at Indiana University right now and hasn't for a while. 

In other words, we can all - on some level - deal with a 16/17/18 win season where we miss the tournament (it will suck) but we can't deal with two of those years in a row with a coach who's on his way out of the profession soon. Right now looking at the roster, yes we are playing 2 freshmen and 2 sophomores heavy minutes but it feels like you're only likely to get 2 of those guys back (Cupps and Reneau) but nothing is guaranteed. Things look very bleak for next year too if you lose Mack and Ware (Ware almost guaranteed... I think?).

When the product on the court is soooo ugly and there's little reason for hope it will change soon, you're gonna get questions about what the right long-term move is. I understand pressers are mandatory and 95% of the time meaningless coach speak, but for Woody to call out Ware specifically yesterday is curious. He's been calling players out in the press (fine in itself), snippy with reporters asking questions about his rotations (I get it but there's better ways of handling those questions than being defensive)... 

Yesterday he said he "hates coaching that way" where he's looking back at what he should have done differently. He's shown he can put together a decent game plan last year sometimes but way too often it's the same set of problems not getting fixed. 

I'd like to believe year 3 is a minor set back so we take off in year 4, but there's a lot of blanks to fill in before I can even see a scenario where we are in position to do that. Since we just gave him a raise last offseason (among other factors) seems unlikely he leaves after this offseason. Not saying that's a good or bad thing but I do think at minimum that's time to get new blood on the staff in terms of his assistants at least. Holdovers from Archie's time are going to keep on getting you Archie results.... 

It just sucks to watch this team right now

The problem with the “bounce back next year” theory is there is a major lack of foundation to build from.  We have what, one kid signed for next year.  That’s just not going to work.  

[Home Jersey 12,299]

1 minute ago, Golfman25 said:

The problem with the “bounce back next year” theory is there is a major lack of foundation to build from.  We have what, one kid signed for next year.  That’s just not going to work.  

That's basically what I'm saying lol

[Hoosierfan2017 23,430]

9 minutes ago, Golfman25 said:

The problem with the “bounce back next year” theory is there is a major lack of foundation to build from.  We have what, one kid signed for next year.  That’s just not going to work.  

Yep. It’d be one thing if we had a loaded class coming in or if Woodson has shown that he’s a wizard in the portal. Instead, we’re a bad team with one recruit signed. A very good recruit, certainly, but he’s one guy. Woodson has largely flopped in the portal. There’s little reason to think next year will be better short of blind hope. 

[Class of '66 Old Fart 87,792]

12 hours ago, IUFAN1976 said:

Start of a 3 game losing streak

Could easily be more than that.  I just don't see any fix coming from our head coach and I'm really effing tired of hearing him say he's got to get them over the hump.  

[Artie86 2,846]

9 hours ago, realTomCrean said:

It’s just not fun to watch my favorite team play and prepare like losers and it makes me very angry

I definitely did not sleep well. I tossed and turned all night. I'm a HS teacher in southern Indiana and we got our second 2 hour delay in a row. You would think I could have used the extra hour or so, but I just could get that awful game out of my mind.

[Class of '66 Old Fart 87,792]

SIAP

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 9,055]

I didn't even watch the game last night. Didn't even care to. Felt like I knew what was going to happen. Apathy at it's peak. This program is just stuck in the mud. Worst time to suck is when the rest of the conference sucks.

[realTomCrean 2,028]

IU starts Fr PG, SF and SO PF, C. That's young and there's an outside chance that all 4 players return.

Ware and Reneau with a year of dedicated S&C will be the best front court in the B1G next year (given Edey finally leaves after a decade). Cupps will not be 175lb again next year and the experience he is getting now, in large part thanks to X, which will prove to be valuable. MgTaco is finding a groove and getting better defensively, more aggressive w/ drives offensively, and his shooting is really admirable. Finally, we have a shooter (one of the best HS shooters) coming in. I don't want to hypothetically add Queen, but if he's added then talented depth is there. 

So, what do we need in the portal? A grad PG, a notable SG. 

Grad PG, (insert) SG, Mgbako (So), Reneau (Jr), Ware (Jr) Bench: Mcneeley (5* Fr), Cupps (So), Gunn (Jr), Sparks (Sr), Newton (So)

I don't know about Trey's eligibility, but if he's back that's probably a great thing for IUBB. In that team, without knowing the 2 G transfers, we have potentially 4 future NBA guys. The #1 priority has to be landing 2 guards who can play, shoot above 35%, and have experience. 

Sometimes losing guys is as big of a net positive as gaining. Hate to say this about my (former) favorite player but IU is in a much better position without him. Losing Walker isn't impactful and looking for Banks to transfer is not a game changer either. 

I'm impatient as I'm sure all of you are but the chances for a Top 10 next year is very real. Unfortunately, anything short of S16 and a top 2 finish in the conference next year will end Woody's tenure at IU - or at least my support for him. 

So there's your sunshine, the only albeit to this is that Dusty May gets to another S16 - if so IU administration has to pull the trigger regardless of sentiment and allegiance toward Woodson. IU is 5 seasons of mediocrity away from losing all brand interest imo. 

Great news for Woodson, there is mid major guards who are phenomenal and would love to play for IU and it's $$. Could name 5 off get. 

 

[sirhoosierlot 3,213]

4 minutes ago, realTomCrean said:

IU starts Fr PG, SF and SO PF, C. That's young and there's an outside chance that all 4 players return.

Ware and Reneau with a year of dedicated S&C will be the best front court in the B1G next year (given Edey finally leaves after a decade). Cupps will not be 175lb again next year and the experience he is getting now, in large part thanks to X, which will prove to be valuable. MgTaco is finding a groove and getting better defensively, more aggressive w/ drives offensively, and his shooting is really admirable. Finally, we have a shooter (one of the best HS shooters) coming in. I don't want to hypothetically add Queen, but if he's added then talented depth is there. 

So, what do we need in the portal? A grad PG, a notable SG. 

Grad PG, (insert) SG, Mgbako (So), Reneau (Jr), Ware (Jr) Bench: Mcneeley (5* Fr), Cupps (So), Gunn (Jr), Sparks (Sr)

I don't know about Trey's eligibility, but if he's back that's probably a great thing for IUBB. In that team, without knowing the 2 G transfers, we have potentially 4 future NBA guys. The #1 priority has to be landing 2 guards who can play, shoot above 35%, and have experience. 

Sometimes losing guys is as big of a net positive as gaining. Hate to say this about my (former) favorite player but IU is in a much better position without him. Losing Walker isn't impactful and looking for Banks to transfer is not a game changer either. 

I'm impatient as I'm sure all of you are but the chances for a Top 10 next year is very real. Unfortunately, anything short of S16 and a top 2 finish in the conference next year will end Woody's tenure at IU - or at least my support for him. 

So there's your sunshine, the only albeit to this is that Dusty May gets to another S16 - if so IU administration has to pull the trigger regardless of sentiment and allegiance toward Woodson. IU is 5 seasons of mediocrity away from losing all brand interest imo. 

Great news for Woodson, there is mid major guards who are phenomenal and would love to play for IU and it's $$. Could name 5 off get. 

 

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4683853/jalen-blackmon

[Redcamaro 276]

4 minutes ago, realTomCrean said:

IU starts Fr PG, SF and SO PF, C. That's young and there's an outside chance that all 4 players return.

Ware and Reneau with a year of dedicated S&C will be the best front court in the B1G next year (given Edey finally leaves after a decade). Cupps will not be 175lb again next year and the experience he is getting now, in large part thanks to X, which will prove to be valuable. MgTaco is finding a groove and getting better defensively, more aggressive w/ drives offensively, and his shooting is really admirable. Finally, we have a shooter (one of the best HS shooters) coming in. I don't want to hypothetically add Queen, but if he's added then talented depth is there. 

So, what do we need in the portal? A grad PG, a notable SG. 

Grad PG, (insert) SG, Mgbako (So), Reneau (Jr), Ware (Jr) Bench: Mcneeley (5* Fr), Cupps (So), Gunn (Jr), Sparks (Sr), Newton (So)

I don't know about Trey's eligibility, but if he's back that's probably a great thing for IUBB. In that team, without knowing the 2 G transfers, we have potentially 4 future NBA guys. The #1 priority has to be landing 2 guards who can play, shoot above 35%, and have experience. 

Sometimes losing guys is as big of a net positive as gaining. Hate to say this about my (former) favorite player but IU is in a much better position without him. Losing Walker isn't impactful and looking for Banks to transfer is not a game changer either. 

I'm impatient as I'm sure all of you are but the chances for a Top 10 next year is very real. Unfortunately, anything short of S16 and a top 2 finish in the conference next year will end Woody's tenure at IU - or at least my support for him. 

So there's your sunshine, the only albeit to this is that Dusty May gets to another S16 - if so IU administration has to pull the trigger regardless of sentiment and allegiance toward Woodson. IU is 5 seasons of mediocrity away from losing all brand interest imo. 

Great news for Woodson, there is mid major guards who are phenomenal and would love to play for IU and it's $$. Could name 5 off get. 

 

Name them please!

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 9,055]

7 minutes ago, realTomCrean said:

IU starts Fr PG, SF and SO PF, C. That's young and there's an outside chance that all 4 players return.

Ware and Reneau with a year of dedicated S&C will be the best front court in the B1G next year (given Edey finally leaves after a decade). Cupps will not be 175lb again next year and the experience he is getting now, in large part thanks to X, which will prove to be valuable. MgTaco is finding a groove and getting better defensively, more aggressive w/ drives offensively, and his shooting is really admirable. Finally, we have a shooter (one of the best HS shooters) coming in. I don't want to hypothetically add Queen, but if he's added then talented depth is there. 

So, what do we need in the portal? A grad PG, a notable SG. 

Grad PG, (insert) SG, Mgbako (So), Reneau (Jr), Ware (Jr) Bench: Mcneeley (5* Fr), Cupps (So), Gunn (Jr), Sparks (Sr), Newton (So)

I don't know about Trey's eligibility, but if he's back that's probably a great thing for IUBB. In that team, without knowing the 2 G transfers, we have potentially 4 future NBA guys. The #1 priority has to be landing 2 guards who can play, shoot above 35%, and have experience. 

Sometimes losing guys is as big of a net positive as gaining. Hate to say this about my (former) favorite player but IU is in a much better position without him. Losing Walker isn't impactful and looking for Banks to transfer is not a game changer either. 

I'm impatient as I'm sure all of you are but the chances for a Top 10 next year is very real. Unfortunately, anything short of S16 and a top 2 finish in the conference next year will end Woody's tenure at IU - or at least my support for him. 

So there's your sunshine, the only albeit to this is that Dusty May gets to another S16 - if so IU administration has to pull the trigger regardless of sentiment and allegiance toward Woodson. IU is 5 seasons of mediocrity away from losing all brand interest imo. 

Great news for Woodson, there is mid major guards who are phenomenal and would love to play for IU and it's $$. Could name 5 off get. 

 

Sure.. and we would still have this staff so who cares?

[Hornsby 3,183]

I definitely did not sleep well. I tossed and turned all night. I'm a HS teacher in southern Indiana and we got our second 2 hour delay in a row. You would think I could have used the extra hour or so, but I just could get that awful game out of my mind.

It's not worth letting it bother you. I don't even let it upset me anymore cause I know we aren't any good and aren't making the tourney. Until we finally hire a real coach expect more of the same.

Sent from my SM-A146U using Tapatalk

[Hornsby 3,183]

IU starts Fr PG, SF and SO PF, C. That's young and there's an outside chance that all 4 players return. Ware and Reneau with a year of dedicated S&C will be the best front court in the B1G next year (given Edey finally leaves after a decade). Cupps will not be 175lb again next year and the experience he is getting now, in large part thanks to X, which will prove to be valuable. MgTaco is finding a groove and getting better defensively, more aggressive w/ drives offensively, and his shooting is really admirable. Finally, we have a shooter (one of the best HS shooters) coming in. I don't want to hypothetically add Queen, but if he's added then talented depth is there. 

So, what do we need in the portal? A grad PG, a notable SG. 

Grad PG, (insert) SG, Mgbako (So), Reneau (Jr), Ware (Jr) Bench: Mcneeley (5* Fr), Cupps (So), Gunn (Jr), Sparks (Sr), Newton (So)

I don't know about Trey's eligibility, but if he's back that's probably a great thing for IUBB. In that team, without knowing the 2 G transfers, we have potentially 4 future NBA guys. The #1 priority has to be landing 2 guards who can play, shoot above 35%, and have experience. 

Sometimes losing guys is as big of a net positive as gaining. Hate to say this about my (former) favorite player but IU is in a much better position without him. Losing Walker isn't impactful and looking for Banks to transfer is not a game changer either. 

I'm impatient as I'm sure all of you are but the chances for a Top 10 next year is very real. Unfortunately, anything short of S16 and a top 2 finish in the conference next year will end Woody's tenure at IU - or at least my support for him. 

So there's your sunshine, the only albeit to this is that Dusty May gets to another S16 - if so IU administration has to pull the trigger regardless of sentiment and allegiance toward Woodson. IU is 5 seasons of mediocrity away from losing all brand interest imo. 

Great news for Woodson, there is mid major guards who are phenomenal and would love to play for IU and it's $$. Could name 5 off get. 

 

 

Top 10 team seriously? Just like some claimed this years team was going to be better than last years team and would be very dangerous come March. Ware isn't coming back and your post sounds like the mid summer hype we read about every single year.

Sent from my SM-A146U using Tapatalk

 

 

 

 

 

[Stuhoo 85,601]

19 hours ago, Stuhoo said:

Doing the dry January thing.

Question: Do I allow for a taste of the good stuff when we win?

[realTomCrean 2,028]

8 minutes ago, sirhoosierlot said:

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4683853/jalen-blackmon

Bang