IU’s basketball culture is dead (and the case for why our next coach should be given 6+ seasons)

[AH1971]

3 hours ago, AZ Hoosier said:

Not to mention a legitimate shot at Dusty May.

Was never coming here 

[AZ Hoosier]

10 hours ago, AH1971 said:

Was never coming here 

You do not / cannot know that for sure. 

[jermhoosierfan]

11 minutes ago, AZ Hoosier said:

You do not / cannot know that for sure. 

Woody didn't leave then, and he just took the UM job.  Do you expect him to say that he would've taken the IU job over UM if both were open?  Unless both were open at the same time, there is only one person who could tell you which one would have gotten him, and he will not say it publicly.  Watching that UM - St. Louis game was fun but not fun at the same time as they were both coaches that I wanted in Bloomington in the last 2 years.

[Shooter]

2 hours ago, AZ Hoosier said:

You do not / cannot know that for sure. 

It's how he justifies his insistence on year 4 of Woodson.

[JSHoosier]

2 hours ago, AZ Hoosier said:

You do not / cannot know that for sure. 

Why would he want to come to IU and have to deal with a fan base that wants to make the tournament? Those expectations are insane, it's only a 68 team field.

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Mikel Browns dad going at it with Louisville fans on Twitter. He would have fit in great with Woody’s team.  Lol

Seriously though, these parents need classes on ignoring social media and to ignore all that crap. 

Im sure its hard, but he’s gonna be a lottery pick in months.  Why argue online with the likes of us/fans?

[str8baller]

20 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Why argue online with the likes of us/fans?

He’s just practicing up so he can argue with Haliburtons and Morants dad in real life. 

[Golfman25]

36 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Mikel Browns dad going at it with Louisville fans on Twitter. He would have fit in great with Woody’s team.  Lol

Seriously though, these parents need classes on ignoring social media and to ignore all that crap. 

Im sure its hard, but he’s gonna be a lottery pick in months.  Why argue online with the likes of us/fans?

No way that is true.  We are the only one with "toxic" fans.  

[Home Jersey]

37 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Mikel Browns dad going at it with Louisville fans on Twitter. He would have fit in great with Woody’s team.  Lol

Seriously though, these parents need classes on ignoring social media and to ignore all that crap. 

Im sure its hard, but he’s gonna be a lottery pick in months.  Why argue online with the likes of us/fans?

They definitely should be given guidance from programs to not respond to stuff on social media. Some may oblige, but a lot wouldn't. Nature of the beast in today's world IMO.

Flip side of your last line... "my son's about to be a freakin NBA lotto pick. These fools don't know what they're talking about."

It's just not productive for anyone even if it feels good for fans to complain and feels good for people associated with the program to tell them they don't have a clue. In the end it's just a bunch of people yelling at each other lol 

[WayneFleekHoosier]

13 minutes ago, Home Jersey said:

They definitely should be given guidance from programs to not respond to stuff on social media. Some may oblige, but a lot wouldn't. Nature of the beast in today's world IMO.

Flip side of your last line... "my son's about to be a freakin NBA lotto pick. These fools don't know what they're talking about."

It's just not productive for anyone even if it feels good for fans to complain and feels good for people associated with the program to tell them they don't have a clue. In the end it's just a bunch of people yelling at each other lol 

Exactly. The fans reactions are universally the same online across all teams. (Predictable stuff) Just a difference in quantity.  

[Home Jersey]

In summation this is a gawd awful idea unless you want to end up like Boston College basketball. Show us something to believe in by Y3 or it's up and outta here. No use for lame ducks

[Magnanimous]

9 hours ago, Home Jersey said:

In summation this is a gawd awful idea unless you want to end up like Boston College basketball. Show us something to believe in by Y3 or it's up and outta here. No use for lame ducks

End up like Boston College…? A school with no money, tradition, fans or history? What? Churning through coaches every three years is how you end up like Boston College (record wise and a place no decent coaching candidate will give any real consideration).

And how do you define “something to believe in”? Because the following coaches would have all been fired using your criteria:

Mike Krzyzewski - 34-47 in his first three seasons at Duke, no NCAAT appearances

Jay Wright - 52-46 in his first three seasons at Nova, no NCAAT appearances

Tony Bennett - 76-53 in his first four seasons at Virginia, one NCAAT appearance (no tournament wins)

John Beilein - 46-53 in his first three seasons at Michigan, one NCAAT appearance after finishing 7th in the B1G (one tournament win)

Scott Drew - 81-95 in his first six seasons at Baylor, one NCAAT appearance (no tournament wins)

Kelvin Sampson - 56-40 in his first three seasons at Houston, no NCAAT appearances

I am in no way saying we hire someone who very likely would struggle coaching at this level (e.g., Ben Jacobson). But again, we have made it past the SW16 ONCE in 32 years. This program needs some stability and a cultural enema. The coaching market isn’t what it used to be. We’ve found this out. Kentucky has found this out. UNC is about to find this out. Meanwhile Nebraska is finally killing it with a competent coach that took serval years to get going.

[Home Jersey]

1 minute ago, Magnanimous said:

End up like Boston College…? A school with no money, tradition, fans or history? What? Churning through coaches every three years is how you end up like Boston College (record wise and a place no decent coaching candidate will give any real consideration).

And how do you define “something to believe in”? Because the following coaches would have all been fired using your criteria:

Mike Krzyzewski - 34-47 in his first three seasons at Duke, no NCAAT appearances

Jay Wright - 52-46 in his first three seasons at Nova, no NCAAT appearances

Tony Bennett - 76-53 in his first four seasons at Virginia, one NCAAT appearance (no tournament wins)

John Beilein - 46-53 in his first three seasons at Michigan, one NCAAT appearance after finishing 7th in the B1G (one tournament win)

Scott Drew - 81-95 in his first six seasons at Baylor, one NCAAT appearance (no tournament wins)

Kelvin Sampson - 56-40 in his first three seasons at Houston, no NCAAT appearances

I am in no way saying we hire someone who very likely would struggle coaching at this level (e.g., Ben Jacobson). But again, we have made it past the SW16 ONCE in 32 years. This program needs some stability and a cultural enema. The coaching market isn’t what it used to be. We’ve found this out. Kentucky has found this out. UNC is about to find this out. Meanwhile Nebraska is finally killing it with a competent coach that took serval years to get going.

Ain't reading all that. BC has had 3 coaches since 2009, which is also when they made their last tournament. The answer isn't to keep guys who can't get the job done around while you hope and pray they figure it out. 

[Magnanimous]

7 minutes ago, Home Jersey said:

Ain't reading all that. BC has had 3 coaches since 2009, which is also when they made their last tournament. The answer isn't to keep guys who can't get the job done around while you hope and pray they figure it out. 

Outside of the Al Skinner era, BC has zero basketball history. Weird comparison. 

[Golfman25]

55 minutes ago, Magnanimous said:

End up like Boston College…? A school with no money, tradition, fans or history? What? Churning through coaches every three years is how you end up like Boston College (record wise and a place no decent coaching candidate will give any real consideration).

And how do you define “something to believe in”? Because the following coaches would have all been fired using your criteria:

Mike Krzyzewski - 34-47 in his first three seasons at Duke, no NCAAT appearances

Jay Wright - 52-46 in his first three seasons at Nova, no NCAAT appearances

Tony Bennett - 76-53 in his first four seasons at Virginia, one NCAAT appearance (no tournament wins)

John Beilein - 46-53 in his first three seasons at Michigan, one NCAAT appearance after finishing 7th in the B1G (one tournament win)

Scott Drew - 81-95 in his first six seasons at Baylor, one NCAAT appearance (no tournament wins)

Kelvin Sampson - 56-40 in his first three seasons at Houston, no NCAAT appearances

I am in no way saying we hire someone who very likely would struggle coaching at this level (e.g., Ben Jacobson). But again, we have made it past the SW16 ONCE in 32 years. This program needs some stability and a cultural enema. The coaching market isn’t what it used to be. We’ve found this out. Kentucky has found this out. UNC is about to find this out. Meanwhile Nebraska is finally killing it with a competent coach that took serval years to get going.

You can't really compare pre Portal and NIL with today.  Back then it did take years to get your recruiting classes thru the system.  And you usually started with a weak team, which is why the last guy was gone.  

But I'll raise you a Todd Golden and Dusty May -- guys who have done in today's era.  

[str8baller]

1 hour ago, Magnanimous said:

End up like Boston College…? A school with no money, tradition, fans or history? What? Churning through coaches every three years is how you end up like Boston College (record wise and a place no decent coaching candidate will give any real consideration).

And how do you define “something to believe in”? Because the following coaches would have all been fired using your criteria:

Mike Krzyzewski - 34-47 in his first three seasons at Duke, no NCAAT appearances

Jay Wright - 52-46 in his first three seasons at Nova, no NCAAT appearances

Tony Bennett - 76-53 in his first four seasons at Virginia, one NCAAT appearance (no tournament wins)

John Beilein - 46-53 in his first three seasons at Michigan, one NCAAT appearance after finishing 7th in the B1G (one tournament win)

Scott Drew - 81-95 in his first six seasons at Baylor, one NCAAT appearance (no tournament wins)

Kelvin Sampson - 56-40 in his first three seasons at Houston, no NCAAT appearances

I am in no way saying we hire someone who very likely would struggle coaching at this level (e.g., Ben Jacobson). But again, we have made it past the SW16 ONCE in 32 years. This program needs some stability and a cultural enema. The coaching market isn’t what it used to be. We’ve found this out. Kentucky has found this out. UNC is about to find this out. Meanwhile Nebraska is finally killing it with a competent coach that took serval years to get going.

Under your theory, how exactly does keeping a crappy coach help you? 
 

Im actually pretty curious about this one. Like if we kept Archie we’d be competing for a championship this year is your contention? 

[Hoosierfan2017]

Ben McCollum is taking Iowa to the Elite 8 in year 1 and we’re here debating how a coach needs years and years to build a foundation. 

[Jeff Flabjohns]

15 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Ben McCollum is taking Iowa to the Elite 8 in year 1 and we’re here debating how a coach needs years and years to build a foundation. 

Careful, they’ll say Iowa is an easier place to win because the fans aren’t toxic. Even with half the NIL of IU, it’s easier there because of our fans. 

[Mopladysman]

15 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Ben McCollum is taking Iowa to the Elite 8 in year 1 and we’re here debating how a coach needs years and years to build a foundation. 

We should do a new guy every year until we get it right. 

[Hoosierfan2017]

8 minutes ago, Mopladysman said:

We should do a new guy every year until we get it right. 

I’m indifferent on IU basketball this point and just view resources directed toward it as a waste of funds that could go to Coach Cig. 

But it seems like we have people preaching patience with every hire, we see other guys come in and win immediately, and then our guy never gets it going. Iowa is in the elite 8 while our guy couldn’t get his team to win 1 of 2 against a crappy northwestern team to make the tournament. Maybe he’ll get it going in year 2. Maybe our donors can buy a good enough team. But everything we’ve seen from Devries in his 12 months has been incredibly meh.