General Coach Candidate News

[Chris007 42,447]

10 minutes ago, Ngw7183 said:

Is it that or more that he is too focused on immediate need. Maybe same thing I guess but feels like he is focused on still wrapping 2024 and then the portal. Kind of, I will get to 2025 later. 
 

Issue for sure but not sure I would equate that to him not planning to be around. Maybe not understanding you have to walk and chew gum at same time.

I just think a change this fast is going to set us back close to Crean early years. Some will say portal fixes that but then you better get a GREAT recruiter. Not sure that is a guy like Dusty or Shrews (at current timing). 
 

let me ask you this, without naming names (unless you want to) - do you feel we retain the key pieces for next year if Woody is here? Do you feel those key pieces are moving on somehow, no matter what? I don’t, but maybe you know or feel differently. 

I think Cupps, Trey, Reneau, Sparks are back. I think Ware is gone, don’t know about MM, Banks or Gunn even though I’m leaning to him leaving. 
 

I do think that Dolson is going to sit down with Woodson this offseason and tell him he needs to make wholesale changes. The offense has to change, recruiting has to pick up. He doesn’t go to high school games, misses AAU tournaments. He will be given next year to make changes. Kind of like Cal has gone to playing through the post, to know being guard oriented.

[Bankshot 528]

As a taxpayer and Indiana Alum, I'd like to know how and why we think hiring two straight athletic directors with no previous experience as division 1 (or even D2) ADs is wise, good management, good stewardship, or defensible when other, more qualified candidates were available.

And, in my opinion, this kind of thinking/failure is a root cause issue for IU's now multi-decade athletic mis-management problems, and plays a direct part in our problems and failures when ADs routinely make or are involved in multi-million dollar decisions that spend or waste at least some public funds.

IU has a long standing history of making blunder after blunder in the hiring and firing portion of athletics.

I would also like to know exactly how we ended up hiring Mike Woodson in this last hiring approach. (Note: I like Woodson, he's a beloved former player and IU legend. I just don't understand at all how we ended up hiring him out of what should have been a pursuit to find the best possible candidate. I.e., another in a long string of terrible hiring mistakes , IMO.)

IMO, if you want to know why IU is still lost and struggling after so long, it's because we have made many, many terrible hiring/firing decisions...bad AD hires, bad coach hires, keeping coaches too long, and possibly a few bad president hires too. (Many of these mistakes were made by inexperienced or unqualified people who themselves should never have been hired).

We need PROVEN competence and experience from the president down. If you hire unproven amateurs you're likely to get sub-par results. Successful organization simply do not operate like this.

Sorry, meant for this to be in the ‘Complain’ thread.

[Hornsby 1,637]

I think Cupps, Trey, Reneau, Sparks are back. I think Ware is gone, don’t know about MM, Banks or Gunn even though I’m leaning to him leaving. 

 

I do think that Dolson is going to sit down with Woodson this offseason and tell him he needs to make wholesale changes. The offense has to change, recruiting has to pick up. He doesn’t go to high school games, misses AAU tournaments. He will be given next year to make changes. Kind of like Cal has gone to playing through the post, to know being guard oriented.

40 years in the NBA I don't have much hope he can change. He seems to like the idea of the iu job but doesn't seem committed to putting in the hard work needed imo. Yes he will get another year but anything less than 20 plus wins and a sweet sixeteen in year four should be the end of the line for him. Maybe he will just tell dolson he is not willing to put in the hard work and he quits. One can dream I guess

 

 

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[Class of '66 Old Fart 81,741]

10 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

 

I do think that Dolson is going to sit down with Woodson this offseason and tell him he needs to make wholesale changes. The offense has to change, recruiting has to pick up. He doesn’t go to high school games, misses AAU tournaments. He will be given next year to make changes. Kind of like Cal has gone to playing through the post, to know being guard oriented.

And my fear is Woody will nod in agreement but very little will change.  Almost has that RMK mindset that I'm bigger than IU and I'll do what I damn well please.

[str8baller 4,841]

1 hour ago, Chris007 said:

CC has a spot on the staff as long as he wants one. No matter the coach.

Any coach that wanted CC out would throw up a major red flag.  He’s a non recruiting position. He’s an IU legend. He has a solid background. I’ve never met him, but he comes off as a likable, intelligent and low key guy. I would think most new coaches would jump to inherit a guy like that. 

[Hornsby 1,637]

And my fear is Woody will nod in agreement but very little will change.  Almost has that RMK mindset that I'm bigger than IU and I'll do what I damn well please.

100% he seems very arrogant to me and I don't think he will change a thing. I think his attitude is I know best.

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[Henryville Hoosier 963]

14 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

I think Cupps, Trey, Reneau, Sparks are back. I think Ware is gone, don’t know about MM, Banks or Gunn even though I’m leaning to him leaving. 
 

I do think that Dolson is going to sit down with Woodson this offseason and tell him he needs to make wholesale changes. The offense has to change, recruiting has to pick up. He doesn’t go to high school games, misses AAU tournaments. He will be given next year to make changes. Kind of like Cal has gone to playing through the post, to know being guard oriented.

Needs to talk to him now, and makes some changes before it’s too late. 

[Chris007 42,447]

9 minutes ago, Class of '66 Old Fart said:

And my fear is Woody will nod in agreement but very little will change.  Almost has that RMK mindset that I'm bigger than IU and I'll do what I damn well please.

That’s very possible, then he would be fired at the end of the 25 season.

[Demo 17,989]

1 hour ago, str8baller said:
 

So how do you sniff out the Bo Ryan’s, Brad Underwoods, Thad Mattas, etc.. from the Archie Millers of the world? I think it is as much of an art as a science. Having an AD who knows how to practice that art is key, imo. 

100% agree. Certain jobs are just different. Your boxing analogy is a really good one. Tyson said everybody’s got a plan until they get hit. The IUBB HC is gonna get hit. Guys think they understand what they’re getting into until they realize too late that they didn’t. That is absolutely what happened to Archie. And, yeah, there is definitely art to picking the right guy. It is so much more than resume. Imo, the secret sauce with the right guy for a job like this has 2 elements: 1) a single minded relentlessness that simply never, ever dims. You self-identify as the Indiana University basketball HC and that’s the list and you do nothing that doesn’t bump that. Probably not the most mentally healthy way to live, but it’s a non-negotiable. I think this is where Woody fails. Maybe 10 years ago he would have been that guy. though I sort of doubt it. I don’t think he’s that guy now.  2) a level of self-belief that is simply impenetrable and yet with the capacity to adjust your core philosophies when necessary. Underwood is a great example of that. Dude was the ultimate spread offense coach. He figures out year 1 that the way the B1G is officiated is killing his actions. Instead of just bitching about it he goes out and recruits Cockburn and completely makes over his offense. That is awesome coaching. Very few guys do that. I know a lot of people like to bang on that guy because he’s kind of odd. No, that guy’s really good. Long way of saying, I don’t know who the right guy is here, but I think I’d know him if saw him. 

[Class of '66 Old Fart 81,741]

1 minute ago, Demo said:

 2 elements: 1) a single minded relentlessness that simply never, ever dims. You self-identify as the Indiana University basketball HC and that’s the list and you do nothing that doesn’t bump that. Probably not the most mentally healthy way to live, but it’s a non-negotiable.

 2) a level of self-belief that is simply impenetrable and yet with the capacity to adjust your core philosophies when necessary. 

Are you describing traits for an IU basketball coach or are you describing Coach Cig because at least initially that's what I'm seeing in him.

[Demo 17,989]

3 minutes ago, Class of '66 Old Fart said:

Are you describing traits for an IU basketball coach or are you describing Coach Cig because at least initially that's what I'm seeing in him.

Cig definitely projects that way. We’ll see how it goes when he gets hit. But he’s also the beneficiary of the crazy low IUFB bar. He goes 8-3 next year and we’re building him a freaking statue. IUBB starts ‘24 8-3 and that dude gets a thread like this one. 

[TTT 793]

Josh schertz…want to win or just want a big name?

FYI:  John Wooden coached at Indiana State 

[Hornsby 1,637]

Every coach is confident and arrogant. It takes results to humble them. Like your Cal example. Most arrogant guy there is was humbled.
if you try hard enough, you can see it happening with Woody. He is questioning himself a lot. You can pick up the glimpses. But arrogant and strong minded people won’t just come out and say “I was wrong” - you just have to watch and see 
I work with lots of arrogant executives daily. My experience at least. 

Woodson has been doing the same thing for 40 years. Getting him to change now is likely not going to happen. If he was 20 years younger maybe. You seem to think just getting a few players will make him successful next year. If his system is exactly the same I don't care how many portal guys he gets its not modern basketball.

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[IndyResident16 567]

56 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

I think Cupps, Trey, Reneau, Sparks are back. I think Ware is gone, don’t know about MM, Banks or Gunn even though I’m leaning to him leaving. 
 

I do think that Dolson is going to sit down with Woodson this offseason and tell him he needs to make wholesale changes. The offense has to change, recruiting has to pick up. He doesn’t go to high school games, misses AAU tournaments. He will be given next year to make changes. Kind of like Cal has gone to playing through the post, to know being guard oriented.

When you say wholesale changes, what does that include? Staff overhaul? Personnel overhaul? What exactly.

A complete overhaul to the support staff is needed, but who is actually executing the plan? Woodson? Dolson? Buckner or Whittman? I’ve seen nothing from Woodson that leads me to believe he’s capable of assessing and evaluating a staff at this level. I mean Fife was a forced hire who was run off within a year, Walsh and Hunter were already on staff under the previous regime, and Rosemond was a recommendation hire from his buddy Kenny Payne. I’m just not sure Woodson is capable of pulling off one competent assistant hire, let alone three. And even if he does, is he actually going to listen to them?

It’s just one big mess that is going to get bigger, especially if know Woodson is on borrowed time as is. 

[Scotty R 1,916]

1 hour ago, Hoosierfan1901 said:

Heard Donovan was house shopping in Bloomington 

If I were a coach I would look to rent 

[johnsoniu 6,077]

Next year will tell a lot about Shrewsbury. While Notre Dame isn’t devoid of talent, their top 7 guys are freshmen or sophomores.

they struggled early on but are improving and competitive in the ACC now. Continued improvement over the off season and some roster additions could see them as a top 25 team next year. 
 
Hard to judge his recruiting chops, Happy Valley and South Bend are hard sells to basketball recruits

[str8baller 4,841]

16 minutes ago, johnsoniu said:

Hard to judge his recruiting chops, Happy Valley and South Bend are hard sells to basketball recruits

If you look at his resume, he’s Indiana to the core. I bet he knows what every HS gym and coach’s office looks like in the state. I’d bet he could recruit the state here. Whether he could effectively stretch beyond that to the high profile AAU programs and whatnot, might be a different story. 

[Dillion 304]

I think the major problem for Woody right now is the 25 class. I’ve heard that 3 different families have complained about Woodson not coming to one of their kids games like other head coaches. Two of these kids should be slam dunks for IU. Maybe Woody knows he doesn’t want to do it anymore after this season. 

I also know a family well that isn’t too happy with Woodys lack of involvement like the other head coaches are that are recruiting him. It’s their main concern right now and they want to be shown love by the head coach.


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[Hornsby 1,637]

When you say wholesale changes, what does that include? Staff overhaul? Personnel overhaul? What exactly.
A complete overhaul to the support staff is needed, but who is actually executing the plan? Woodson? Dolson? Buckner or Whittman? I’ve seen nothing from Woodson that leads me to believe he’s capable of assessing and evaluating a staff at this level. I mean Fife was a forced hire who was run off within a year, Walsh and Hunter were already on staff under the previous regime, and Rosemond was a recommendation hire from his buddy Kenny Payne. I’m just not sure Woodson is capable of pulling off one competent assistant hire, let alone three. And even if he does, is he actually going to listen to them?
It’s just one big mess that is going to get bigger, especially if know Woodson is on borrowed time as is. 

100% correct. He may be back next year but I don't expect much of anything to change.

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[rcbowla 6,795]

I also know a family well that isn’t too happy with Woodys lack of involvement like the other head coaches are that are recruiting him. It’s their main concern right now and they want to be shown love by the head coach.


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This along with@Chris007 post along same lines are completely alarming and tell us all we need to know. He is not willing to put everything he has into this job. If that's the case then so long Woody. How can an AD be ok with this?

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