They “Retired” Coach Woodson Thread

[str8baller]

45 minutes ago, DChoosier said:

• Posted Sportsline odds in regards to Holtmans replacement at OSU.
   
• Lamont Paris +250
• Sean Miller +400
• Dusty May +500
• Chris Mack +700
• Buzz Williams +800
• Wes Miller +900
• Greg McDermott +1000

That strikes me as fairly accurate. For all the love McDermott gets, he did flame out at a P5 spot already. If you’re OSU you have to wonder if maybe he’s like Alford where he excels best at midmajor spots. I would think his age might be a negative, too. 

[CSP]

36 minutes ago, IU22 said:

If IU is May's dream job do you really think that he would jump to O$U knowing that in a year or hopefully sooner the IU job would be open.

Does Dusty make a back channel call before he talks to O$U?

No, I don't. 

[southernindianahoosier2]

9 minutes ago, str8baller said:

That strikes me as fairly accurate. For all the love McDermott gets, he did flame out at a P5 spot already. If you’re OSU you have to wonder if maybe he’s like Alford where he excels best at midmajor spots. I would think his age might be a negative, too. 

My only worry is that if OSU is in contact with Dusty. Is that a big enough distraction that would cause his team to flame out in the tournament?  And would that scare some people away? 
 

Dusty is very different from Archie Woodson and Crean. I think you have to get him. That K state team he beat was unbelievably hot, and was 3 seconds away from making a national championship game. 

[str8baller]

16 minutes ago, JF87 said:

That could be risky to wait on IU.  Dusty may never again be the hot commodity that he is right now. I know people said that Dusty isn't money driven, but a contract from another major university could be 15-18 million dollars guaranteed. Who knows what happens at IU.  Maybe you wait on the IU job and Woodson makes the tournament in 2024-2025 and then pushes for one or two more years. Hypothetically, it's possible that Dolson may be gone in a few years.  These are unknowns, so passing on a huge payday may not be in his family's best interest even if IU is his dream job.  

Nobody in their right mind would pass on jump like that to wait for “maybe” at their more preferred spot. If he stays at FAU another year it’ll be more about what he has there.  
 

The reverse is true too. When people were clamoring to ditch Crean for a young Stevens there were lots of people saying that IU was his dream job, he’s young, we can always get him later if Crean doesn’t work out.   Timing is huge in life and the older I get the more I appreciate that. 

[Chris007]

38 minutes ago, IU22 said:

If IU is May's dream job do you really think that he would jump to O$U knowing that in a year or hopefully sooner the IU job would be open.

Does Dusty make a back channel call before he talks to O$U?

Well, the way I look at it is if OSU or UL offers 7 years 30 million. That is a lot of money and can change your life and provide generational wealth for your family. What if he holds off for IU and Woodson kills it in the portal, makes a deep NCAA run next year, and stays for a few years? Might not want to risk never getting the chance at a P5 job. A lot of moving parts that everyone has to take into consideration. 

[Chris007]

30 minutes ago, JF87 said:

That could be risky to wait on IU.  Dusty may never again be the hot commodity that he is right now. I know people said that Dusty isn't money driven, but a contract from another major university could be 15-18 million dollars guaranteed. Who knows what happens at IU.  Maybe you wait on the IU job and Woodson makes the tournament in 2024-2025 and then pushes for one or two more years. Hypothetically, it's possible that Dolson may be gone in a few years.  These are unknowns, so passing on a huge payday may not be in his family's best interest even if IU is his dream job.  

Great minds think alike. 

[Stuhoo]

4 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

Well, the way I look at it is if OSU or UL offers 7 years 30 million. That is a lot of money and can change your life and provide generational wealth for your family. What if he holds off for IU and Woodson kills it in the portal, makes a deep NCAA run next year, and stays for a few years? Might not want to risk never getting the chance at a P5 job. A lot of moving parts that everyone has to take into consideration. 

100%.

And both of those schools are pretty close to family too.

So many things could happen to the IU job; if he's looking to move up there's no way he's turning down seven years at a top 40 job close to home when the IU job is still a "what if."

I would strongly suspect that Dusty May and Dolson have a relationship. If he's that geared toward hoping for the IU job, he would likely give Dolson a head's up before moving forward with finalized contract negotiations somewhere else.

[Hoosierfan2017]

7 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

Well, the way I look at it is if OSU or UL offers 7 years 30 million. That is a lot of money and can change your life and provide generational wealth for your family. What if he holds off for IU and Woodson kills it in the portal, makes a deep NCAA run next year, and stays for a few years? Might not want to risk never getting the chance at a P5 job. A lot of moving parts that everyone has to take into consideration. 

Sounds like a reason to fire Mike Woodson. 

[HoosierFan1994]

Here is my stance...If IU has an epic collapse to end the season much like in 2021 (lost 6 in a row/7 of 8 to end the season) or in 2017 (went from #3 to missing the NCAA tournament) then a change has to happen. This isn't a perfect roster. But enough talent to at least make the tournament. If this team fights the rest of the way and shows some promise, wins some games they shouldn't, then I'm all for Woodson getting one more year to figure this out. Unfortunatly I think it'll be somewhere in between. They'll go like 3-5 the rest of the way. 

My fear is this: Woodson lands two good portal guards to go with our frontcourt next year. IU has another good but not great year. Then, the university gives him an extension and we end up just like this season. 

I don't think Woodson is the worst coach in the world. I also don't think he is the guy to bring IU back to where we all want it to be. Right now at this moment, I don't even think he should be fired. That can change though. 

I don't want to go down that rabbit hole again, but I still believe Dolson thought he had his guy in 2021 and obviously that didn't happen. It caused him to hired Woodson, who quite frankly would not have been even top 5 in a good, thorough coaching search. I'd like to see what Dolson could do this time around. May, Shrewberry, Pearl, etc...

[Chris007]

5 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Sounds like a reason to fire Mike Woodson. 

I applied to be the AD last time the job was open but I think I finished 4th before Dolson, Pat Kraft, and Chris Reynolds. But I know what decision I would make. 

[Hoosierfan2017]

43 minutes ago, ISP said:

For the past few weeks, I've thought that there is maybe a 1% chance that Woody is let go and a 5% chance that he is talked into moving into the head of basketball operations / GM role. Primary reason I had it so low was that he got us to the tourney the last 2 seasons. Granted in some ways I think we overrate how good those 2 seasons actually were. Regardless, I just didn't feel there was a precedent to fire him after the last 2 years. 

However, there really is a precedent. Crean took IU to the tourney the 2 years prior to his firing. He went to the sweet 16 and won conference the year prior. He had 3 Sweet 16s in the prior 5 years. And this season we are twice as bad (100 in KenPom compared to 50 in Crean's last year) to the tipping point for Crean. If all that was not good enough for a 52 year old coach then why would it be good enough for a 66 year old coach?

Maybe I am just willing it into existence at this point, but I'm going to move that % up. I'd say, there is maybe a 25-30% chance that Dolson tactfully probes or is already probing with Woody his likeliness of moving into the GM role that Matta had. 

You don’t need precedent. You just need the buyout money. 

Going to back to back tournaments is only talked about as a positive because Archie was so bad. Woodson being slightly better than possibly the worst coach in IU history doesn’t mean he deserves to keep his job. And Archie only missed the tournament in 2020 because it was canceled by a once in a century pandemic. Archie didn’t cause covid. IU was going to be in the field. The tournament drought would have been one year when Woodson took over but for covid. 

Woodson’s first year he goes 21-14 and loses by 29 points in the round of 64. His second year he goes 23-12 and loses by 16 in the round of 32. His third year he almost certainly will miss the tournament altogether. Numerous blowout losses. He has one recruit in the 2024 class. Gaping holes in the roster. 

We know for a fact that Woodson isn’t the answer long term because he’s too old. He has failed to show that he’s the short-term answer. So, fire him. He hasn’t lived up to what should be the expectation for IU basketball. 

[IUrocker]

I wonder if new President Whitten, knowing she’s really into sports and their success, would lean more towards making sure we tie up or next guy sooner than later if Dolson hints towards anything relating to making a move and not risking losing out on guys to other openings? I’d like to think she’s plugged into things such as Ohio State making the move, etc. Would she be someone more on Buckner side of things who wants to keep his buddy, or can having her now kind of give people who want the change more confidence that it could happen? 

[Kentuckysucks]

 

 

[southernindianahoosier2]

Woody is so bad that beating Holtmann gets Holtmann fired, thus leading to his own firing. 

[JSHoosier]

21 minutes ago, HoosierFan1994 said:

Here is my stance...If IU has an epic collapse to end the season much like in 2021 (lost 6 in a row/7 of 8 to end the season) or in 2017 (went from #3 to missing the NCAA tournament) then a change has to happen. This isn't a perfect roster. But enough talent to at least make the tournament. If this team fights the rest of the way and shows some promise, wins some games they shouldn't, then I'm all for Woodson getting one more year to figure this out. Unfortunatly I think it'll be somewhere in between. They'll go like 3-5 the rest of the way. 

My fear is this: Woodson lands two good portal guards to go with our frontcourt next year. IU has another good but not great year. Then, the university gives him an extension and we end up just like this season. 

I don't think Woodson is the worst coach in the world. I also don't think he is the guy to bring IU back to where we all want it to be. Right now at this moment, I don't even think he should be fired. That can change though. 

I don't want to go down that rabbit hole again, but I still believe Dolson thought he had his guy in 2021 and obviously that didn't happen. It caused him to hired Woodson, who quite frankly would not have been even top 5 in a good, thorough coaching search. I'd like to see what Dolson could do this time around. May, Shrewberry, Pearl, etc...

I kind of disagree on the bolded. In a good, thorough search he wouldn't have been a candidate at all, he wasn't a good option full stop.

Take away the name Mike Woodson. If IU went after a random 62 year old with no college experience and hadn't been a HC in almost a decade, would anyone be happy with it? If the answer is yes, I call bullcrap. Being a program legend is the only reason he was even considered let alone hired.

[Chris007]

13 minutes ago, IUrocker said:

I wonder if new President Whitten, knowing she’s really into sports and their success, would lean more towards making sure we tie up or next guy sooner than later if Dolson hints towards anything relating to making a move and not risking losing out on guys to other openings? I’d like to think she’s plugged into things such as Ohio State making the move, etc. Would she be someone more on Buckner side of things who wants to keep his buddy, or can having her now kind of give people who want the change more confidence that it could happen? 

I want to give her that much credit but I don't think she knows what's going on at other Big Ten universities basketball programs. She might be filled in on a weekly or bi-weekly meeting with Dolson

[AZ Hoosier]

3 hours ago, 8bucks said:

Being thinking we need to see how this plays out. We will have a lot more information by year end. 
How do we play down the stretch?

Which of our key players may opt to leave?

Will Liam choose to decommit?

Can we add some other key players via the portal or HS?

Anything else weird happens 

The best predictor of future outcome is relevant past outcome... stick a fork in him... Woodson is done.

[IUFAN1976]

8 minutes ago, Kentuckysucks said:

 

 

I found really odd that OSU didn’t wait until after the season to fire him, but this makes a ton of sense.  It’s kinda genius if you ask me.  They can lay some ground with their potential candidate and then immediately hire him as soon as the season is over or even before hand.  In the meantime, they can get out front with potential portal transfers and try and get commitments before the end of March, IMO

[Chris007]

17 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

You don’t need precedent. You just need the buyout money. 

Going to back to back tournaments is only talked about as a positive because Archie was so bad. Woodson being slightly better than possibly the worst coach in IU history doesn’t mean he deserves to keep his job. And Archie only missed the tournament in 2020 because it was canceled by a once in a century pandemic. Archie didn’t cause covid. IU was going to be in the field. The tournament drought would have been one year when Woodson took over but for covid. 

Woodson’s first year he goes 21-14 and loses by 29 points in the round of 64. His second year he goes 23-12 and loses by 16 in the round of 32. His third year he almost certainly will miss the tournament altogether. Numerous blowout losses. He has one recruit in the 2024 class. Gaping holes in the roster. 

We know for a fact that Woodson isn’t the answer long term because he’s too old. He has failed to show that he’s the short-term answer. So, fire him. He hasn’t lived up to what should be the expectation for IU basketball. 

I'm not sure if Quinn would be upset if you went to him & said were going to give your buddy 12 million to retire and then go hire Dusty May. I think Woody would be hurt at first but hopefully seeing that check clear would make him OK

[Hoosierfan2017]

3 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

I'm not sure if Quinn would be upset if you went to him & said we’re going to give your buddy 12 million to retire and then go hire Dusty May. I think Woody would be hurt at first but hopefully seeing that check clear would make him OK

Imo, based on the reports of his energy levels, he wouldn’t coach much longer than his current contract anyway. So, he’d be getting the same money he’d be getting anyway without having to do any work. Really a pretty good deal for him.