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[RaceToTheTop 26,085]

57 minutes ago, HoosierHoops1 said:

With our putrid offense we had big leads in many games, but 1 player, by and large, we couldn't stop and that fueled the comeback.

Suppose we add a 40% shooter but he's a JBJ defense clone? We won't be better off.

Parker Stewart was a 40% shooter from deep last year.  We would have been a much better team with JBJ than Stewart.

[MikeRoberts 7,049]

1 minute ago, RaceToTheTop said:

Re: three point shooting

high volume shooters hitting 36% are pretty darn good.  A big part of Carson Edwards ability was that he had the ability to hit guarded threes…..the ability to get quick shots cuts down on turnovers.  There isn’t a comparison between Scott and Davis from three.

That said, Davis won’t put up the numbers in a power 5 that he put in the Horizon.

Thank you. 50% on 1/2 is not the same as 50% on 5/10.

not sure why that was even a debate but appreciated others confirmation 

[Hoosierfan2017 21,551]

7 minutes ago, RaceToTheTop said:

Well, the flamethrower Armaan Franklin was a cigarette lighter at Virginia last year.

Armaan was never a flamethrower. He’s just the only player we’ve had since firing Crean who has shot better from 3 individually than the 2016 did as a team. Crean’s teams were never great defensively, but the 2016 team only gave up 0.7 ppg more than last years team during conference play while scoring 11 more ppg. Doubling down on the defensive focus isn’t going to take us to the next level. You need to be great on both ends. 

[RaceToTheTop 26,085]

2 hours ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Armaan was never a flamethrower. He’s just the only player we’ve had since firing Crean who has shot better from 3 individually than the 2016 did as a team. Crean’s teams were never great defensively, but the 2016 team only gave up 0.7 ppg more than last years team during conference play while scoring 11 more ppg. Doubling down on the defensive focus isn’t going to take us to the next level. You need to be great on both ends. 

The point was that three point shooting is rarely consistent.  The best way to make it consistent for a team isn’t to shuffle in guys each year from the portal….it’s to make the players you have have and keep good mechanics.

[JSHoosier 20,312]

6 hours ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Hell idk, but if we’re going for one dimensional players I’d rather add a great shooter/bad defender than vice versa. Defense is much more reliant on all 5 players on the court than offense is. You can hide a bad defender. Our defense was great last year despite starting two negative defenders. A guy who can rain down threes would be much more helpful to this team. 

I was about to mention the defensive part, one can be hidden.  Part of why I hated that we kept starting Stewart and Kopp, neither can stay in front of a chair.

[Dillion 347]

Thank you. 50% on 1/2 is not the same as 50% on 5/10.
not sure why that was even a debate but appreciated others confirmation 

But that’s not what we are talking about. It’s more like 1.3/3 and 3.6/10. Plus that’s in a weaker conference against far inferior athletes. I’m willing to bet the extra 3-4 3’a he might hit on volume 3-4 other shots might as well be a tour over because they are bad shots. Then our defense goes way down when he is on the court so give the other team some more points. I would love for him to be 5/10 then we are in a whole different conversation but he isn’t.


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[MikeRoberts 7,049]

1 hour ago, Dillion said:

But that’s not what we are talking about. It’s more like 1.3/3 and 3.6/10. Plus that’s in a weaker conference against far inferior athletes. I’m willing to bet the extra 3-4 3’a he might hit on volume 3-4 other shots might as well be a tour over because they are bad shots. Then our defense goes way down when he is on the court so give the other team some more points. I would love for him to be 5/10 then we are in a whole different conversation but he isn’t.


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There were several points being discussed but the one I addressed is the one about 34% vs 36% from 3 only being 2 percent difference. While true, someone’s 3 point percentage holds a lot more weight when they can do it in volume

[Hoosierfan2017 21,551]

26 minutes ago, MikeRoberts said:

There were several points being discussed but the one I addressed is the one about 34% vs 36% from 3 only being 2 percent difference. While true, someone’s 3 point percentage holds a lot more weight when they can do it in volume

He’s clinging to the 34% vs. 36% because it makes his argument sound a lot better than it really is. It lets him say “oh that’s only a two percent difference! They're not that different as shooters!" 

The reality is one guy is a career 34% from 3 but has shot under 34% in three of his four college seasons. The other guy is a career 36% from 3 but has shot above 36% in three of his four career seasons. Davis had one down year where he shot 32%. He's been above 37% the other three years on 10+ shots per season. Dennis had one good year, his freshman year, where he shot 40%. It looks like an outlier that he hasn’t been able to replicate since. The past two seasons, Davis has shot 521 3s at a 37.6% clip. That’s an outstanding percentage for that volume. 

Damian Lillard is a career 37% 3 point shooter. Using his logic, Dame isn’t a “shooter” and is barely better than Dexter Dennis from 3. 

[NashvilleHoosier 3,719]

1 hour ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

He’s clinging to the 34% vs. 36% because it makes his argument sound a lot better than it really is. It lets him say “oh that’s only a two percent difference! They're not that different as shooters!" 

The reality is one guy is a career 34% from 3 but has shot under 34% in three of his four college seasons. The other guy is a career 36% from 3 but has shot above 36% in three of his four career seasons. Davis had one down year where he shot 32%. He's been above 37% the other three years on 10+ shots per season. Dennis had one good year, his freshman year, where he shot 40%. It looks like an outlier that he hasn’t been able to replicate since. The past two seasons, Davis has shot 521 3s at a 37.6% clip. That’s an outstanding percentage for that volume. 

Damian Lillard is a career 37% 3 point shooter. Using his logic, Dame isn’t a “shooter” and is barely better than Dexter Dennis from 3. 

The answer is most likely somewhere in the middle of what you’re going back and forth on. Davis is a better shooter, sure. Dennis is a better and more versatile defender. We can’t possibly believe that Davis would come here and get close to the volume of shots he has been. I doubt he would even start. And he’d have far better and likely bigger defenders on him every game, which will make it difficult to maintain his percentage. The step up in competition isn’t nearly as drastic for Dennis. And he brings a lot to the table that Davis doesn’t. Either one could work out better than the other. 

[Hoosierfan2017 21,551]

2 minutes ago, NashvilleHoosier said:

The answer is most likely somewhere in the middle of what you’re going back and forth on. Davis is a better shooter, sure. Dennis is a better and more versatile defender. We can’t possibly believe that Davis would come here and get close to the volume of shots he has been. I doubt he would even start. And he’d have far better and likely bigger defenders on him every game, which will make it difficult to maintain his percentage. The step up in competition isn’t nearly as drastic for Dennis. And he brings a lot to the table that Davis doesn’t. Either one could work out better than the other. 

But we’re only going back and forth on the issue of their shooting. The poster said he didn’t know why one guy is considered a shooter but the other one isn’t. I didn’t opine that Davis is the better player or that he would be better here. Just that he’s clearly the better shooter.

Who knows what his percentages would be at a P5 school. It’s a step up in competition, but he’d also be playing with better teammates and wouldn’t get as much defensive focus. Zeisloft shot 6% better from three at IU than he did at Illinois State. 

[NashvilleHoosier 3,719]

37 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

But we’re only going back and forth on the issue of their shooting. The poster said he didn’t know why one guy is considered a shooter but the other one isn’t. I didn’t opine that Davis is the better player or that he would be better here. Just that he’s clearly the better shooter.

Who knows what his percentages would be at a P5 school. It’s a step up in competition, but he’d also be playing with better teammates and wouldn’t get as much defensive focus. Zeisloft shot 6% better from three at IU than he did at Illinois State. 

Fair enough. I’m probably projecting a bit across other parts of this thread. There’s some arguments being made that Dennis wouldn’t be a great addition b/c he doesn’t light it up from 3 but ignoring what else he brings. All while the supposed shooters we are involved with are typically around 35% to 38% shooters from 3. I’m not opposed to bringing in a high level shooter over Dennis. But the possibilities so far are not definitely a better add to this roster. 

[iu eyedoc 2,057]

13 hours ago, MikeRoberts said:

Had we had a JBJ last year I think we win 5 more games and are in contention for BigTen title. 

I

 

14 hours ago, MikeRoberts said:

We would absolutely be better in adding JBJ. JBJ would have arguably been our best player

 

14 hours ago, HoosierHoops1 said:

With our putrid offense we had big leads in many games, but 1 player, by and large, we couldn't stop and that fueled the comeback.

Suppose we add a 40% shooter but he's a JBJ defense clone? We won't be better off.

How did John Bon Jovi get into this discussion? And I am pretty sure he has kinda sucked in those celebrity type games, so doubt he could help IU. Am I missing something here?

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,474]

Emoni Bates to transfer from Memphis and I’m a hard pass.  Crazy.  2-3 years ago he was the next Lebron James. 

[maharkn 1,746]

Emoni Bates to transfer from Memphis and I’m a hard pass.  Crazy.  2-3 years ago he was the next Lebron James. 

Going to Memphis was his biggest mistake. Would have been better had he went to a program with a real coach

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[go iu bb 6,228]

1 hour ago, maharkn said:

Going to Memphis was his biggest mistake. Would have been better had he went to a program with a real coach

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I think he was originally committed to MSU.

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,474]

I think he was originally committed to MSU.

Him and MSU Jaden Akins, fellow MSU recruit, had a falling out in HS. He’s been drama everywhere he’s been.


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[Ryno6284 2,693]

16 hours ago, RaceToTheTop said:

The point was that three point shooting is rarely consistent.  The best way to make it consistent for a team isn’t to shuffle in guys each year from the portal….it’s to make the players you have have and keep good mechanics.

I think that CMW is trying to do that, but he is adding in a little seasoning salt with the portal.  I think he is doing the 4 year build, only trying to add a few pieces to make that transition a little faster.  He wants his guys (recruits) to be the backbone or long-term answer for this team, with a little flare from portal players here and there.  I think 3 or 4 years from now will look differently than they do know, once he has his recruiting in place.

[Ryno6284 2,693]

If we are choosing between the two, give me Dennis 8 days a week.  I'm not saying either would be the one we should get, but look how excited we all were to get Kopp last year?!  How did that turn out?  Most are hoping he doesn't start next season.  Give me athleticism and a defensive junkie!

[JSHoosier 20,312]

19 minutes ago, Ryno6284 said:

If we are choosing between the two, give me Dennis 8 days a week.  I'm not saying either would be the one we should get, but look how excited we all were to get Kopp last year?!  How did that turn out?  Most are hoping he doesn't start next season.  Give me athleticism and a defensive junkie!

I think some people just built up Kopp into something that he isn't, so then it seems like a down performance when in fact he performed like he always has.

[NashvilleHoosier 3,719]

1 hour ago, JSHoosier said:

I think some people just built up Kopp into something that he isn't, so then it seems like a down performance when in fact he performed like he always has.

Lol. Building him up into something he isn’t. So exactly what’s happening with every portal “shooter” we’re involved with now?