College Bball Thread

[Brass Cannon 25,176]

32 minutes ago, lillurk said:

Pittsburgh Post-Gazette has an interesting story about Sean and Archie Miller both getting back into coaching this cycle.

I have no ill will toward Arch, but, “I haven’t thought one second about my time there. It came and it’s gone,” is not what I’d want to here as an AD looking for a coach to have learned from his experiences. It’s not what I’d want to hear if I’d played for him. And it’s not what I’d want him to say if he wanted my child to play for him.

It’s Archie’s attitude though. His system was infallible and everybody else was stupid for not being able to see that.  
 

Which to be fair his system does sound rock solid. I just don’t think we ever saw a group of kids actually got prepared to play it. We saw kids that didn’t seem to be a fit for it being asked to play it and they seemed confused by it to boot.  
 

None of us will ever miss Archie because of that. If times get bad again we will look past him and dream of Crean and his Sweet Sixteens and Big Ten championships
 

If I was Archie I would find it hard to think of his time here either. He accomplished nothing. He didn’t appear to grow as a coach at all.  And he left a complete and abject failure and to boot he had to watch a first year coach taking primarily his roster to further heights than he ever knew. 
 

The fact he ain’t thinking about it certainly means he’s not learning from it. So he’s either convinced he’s the smartest guy in the room and doesn’t need to learn. Or really he’s just checked out on his growth and he will continue to struggle. 
 

Kind of the opposite of Mike Davis who still talks about what he learned here. And has kept his nose to the grindstone and has become a much better coach learning from past mistakes.  Which is why if Mike Davis ever returns to the building I will cheer for and hope for a good game. If Archie comes back I’ll ignore him and expect us to blow them out. 

[Brass Cannon 25,176]

14 minutes ago, BtownStrength said:

Not sure where this belongs, but apparently Juwan Howard's name is being thrown around for the Lakers job when they axe Vogel. 

Kind of hope it happens. Juwan is recruiting great right now and would love for him to jump. 

Agreed.  Besides the recruiting guy can definitely coach. Bad combo 

[RaceToTheTop 28,850]

7 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

It’s Archie’s attitude though. His system was infallible and everybody else was stupid for not being able to see that.  
 

Which to be fair his system does sound rock solid. I just don’t think we ever saw a group of kids actually got prepared to play it. We saw kids that didn’t seem to be a fit for it being asked to play it and they seemed confused by it to boot.  
 

None of us will ever miss Archie because of that. If times get bad again we will look past him and dream of Crean and his Sweet Sixteens and Big Ten championships
 

If I was Archie I would find it hard to think of his time here either. He accomplished nothing. He didn’t appear to grow as a coach at all.  And he left a complete and abject failure and to boot he had to watch a first year coach taking primarily his roster to further heights than he ever knew. 
 

The fact he ain’t thinking about it certainly means he’s not learning from it. So he’s either convinced he’s the smartest guy in the room and doesn’t need to learn. Or really he’s just checked out on his growth and he will continue to struggle. 
 

Kind of the opposite of Mike Davis who still talks about what he learned here. And has kept his nose to the grindstone and has become a much better coach learning from past mistakes.  Which is why if Mike Davis ever returns to the building I will cheer for and hope for a good game. If Archie comes back I’ll ignore him and expect us to blow them out. 

Mike Davis did return to the building when he coached at Texas Southern.  He received nice applause.

 

[Brass Cannon 25,176]

1 hour ago, brumdog45 said:

Mike Davis did return to the building when he coached at Texas Southern.  He received nice applause.

 

Poorly phrased. Should have included the phrase and “and I am in attendance” 

[Indiana muskie 205]

USPS will launch some deep threes for sure

[Uspshoosier 51,190]

7 minutes ago, Indiana muskie said:

USPS will launch some deep threes for sure

Just don’t expect any defense 

[Stuhoo 85,965]

11 minutes ago, Indiana muskie said:

USPS will launch some deep threes for sure

Usps is AD.

Demo is recruiting director.

Josh is head coach, in a crazy but effective Bruce Pearl style.

Old Fart is emeritus bench coach ala Phil Martelli.

Hova is hype man.

[Indiana muskie 205]

I'm good for one killer screen and one box out then il have to put my shoulder back in place .

[Hovadipo 59,808]

51 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

Usps is AD.

Demo is recruiting director.

Josh is head coach, in a crazy but effective Bruce Pearl style.

Old Fart is emeritus bench coach ala Phil Martelli.

Hova is hype man.

Dirty Josh and the boys. 

[RaceToTheTop 28,850]

I call waterboy.  Y’all are over 21, right?

[Hovadipo 59,808]

16 hours ago, lillurk said:

Pittsburgh Post-Gazette has an interesting story about Sean and Archie Miller both getting back into coaching this cycle.

I have no ill will toward Arch, but, “I haven’t thought one second about my time there. It came and it’s gone,” is not what I’d want to here as an AD looking for a coach to have learned from his experiences. It’s not what I’d want to hear if I’d played for him. And it’s not what I’d want him to say if he wanted my child to play for him.

It's also almost certainly a flat out lie. You got fired from one of the best jobs in America and haven't thought about one second of it? Lol okay, man. Very cool, very edgy!

[IUc2016 7,121]

6 minutes ago, Hovadipo said:

It's also almost certainly a flat out lie. You got fired from one of the best jobs in America and haven't thought about one second of it? Lol okay, man. Very cool, very edgy!

yeah if only we didn't have to think one second of it either

[BtownStrength 1,450]

8 minutes ago, Hovadipo said:

It's also almost certainly a flat out lie. You got fired from one of the best jobs in America and haven't thought about one second of it? Lol okay, man. Very cool, very edgy!

Yeah, and I never think about my crazy hot ex that dumped my @$$ because I was a schlub *drinks*

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 9,062]

Watching the 2016 Indiana-Notre Dame game... Who is cheering the bench? A young Race Thompson. 

[Hardwood83 4,854]

16 hours ago, JimmerNoe said:

He’s been fairly positive regarding IU over the last year but there’s always been a sour grapes vibe. And his brother blames IU for him not succeeding.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not surprising his slimy brother gives him plenty of slack.....but would love to hear the explanation how IU failed him. Call me skeptical. I suspect Archie continues to regret the day he left Dayton- although probably made more $$, I doubt he ever catches that lightening in a bottle again.  

[Class of '66 Old Fart 87,924]

1 hour ago, Hovadipo said:

It's also almost certainly a flat out lie. You got fired from one of the best jobs in America and haven't thought about one second of it? Lol okay, man. Very cool, very edgy!

And if not a lie, it clearly means he really didn't care about IU basketball and it was all about collecting a paycheck.

[Dave from Dayton 3,925]

1 hour ago, Hovadipo said:

It's also almost certainly a flat out lie. You got fired from one of the best jobs in America and haven't thought about one second of it? Lol okay, man. Very cool, very edgy!

I'm thinking that his wording might be sloppy and dismissive.  Maybe he meant that he doesn't dwell on that episode in his coaching career.  Maybe he doesn't have a lot positive to say about his take on the IU administration's hobbling his recruiting and not allowing him to cut negative players from the team. Maybe he determined that his method of disciplining players had been skewered by the administration.   So, he doesn't discuss it so that writers and fans don't go ballistic when he says something that doesn't match what we want to hear.  And it really would be bad form to throw one's previous employer or players under the bus.  

Maybe being dismissive and cutting off the discussion is a better tactic than talking about it.

Maybe.  I'm probably right.  Usually am.  

That is all I have to say about that./s

 

[Dave from Dayton 3,925]

42 minutes ago, LamarCheeks said:

 

I'd lean more to the lie. I wouldn't necessarily call it a flat-out lie -- but I think he's just trying to give the perception that he wasn't bothered by it. He's trying to play it down, so to speak. You get dumped by a gorgeous woman and you say, "Meh -- no big deal." But c'mon -- it is. He was very successful at Dayton, but an abject failure at IU -- how can that not bother you? 

At his URI presser, he talked about his time at Dayton, then referred to his "next stop" -- or something like that. Seems to me he's bothered by the fact that he failed at IU, but just doesn't want to admit it. He just never seemed to connect with IU.

I do think he cared about IU hoops and wasn't here just to collect a paycheck. He just wasn't the right fit. The weird thing? I still think to this day, had we night hired him, Ohio State would have once they parted with Matta. I really wonder how that would've worked out. Was coaching in the B1G too much for him, or was it just the fishbowl that is IU that he couldn't handle? 

Clearly Archie Miller was the wrong guy to coach Indiana at that time.  But I do believe that he was hampered by the IU administration in a lot he could do.

  First, IU made it clear that the PG he had recruited for Dayton could not be given a scholarship at IU. 

Second, he must recruit inside of Indiana, so he did.  Does anyone think that recruiting outside of the state suffered?  Maybe this was because the IU Administration wanted more control over recruiting.  Remember Crean would extend an offer to any potential recruit that made eye contact.

Third, he could not remove players that caused problems because of the NCAA grade issue that he inherited.  Remember the locker room stuff? And the players that stopped moving on court? And the other issues about well, never mind.

Fourth, take a second and reflect on the difference in support that Woody has.  Matta as IU Assistant AD for Administration. Recruiting expertise both inside and outside of the state...check the assistants.  Woody can use the transfer portal because it didn't exist for Archie.    And Woody's ability to let a player go may be more flexible now...we just have not had time to gain that perspective.

Fifth, the cupboard was not in as bad a shape when Woody came in as it was for Archie.  Archie never really got the right players for his scheme.  At Dayton they were smart, shared the ball, did what was necessary to get the loose ball, they knew how to win.  At IU it was the opposite.  Why?  Well, could it be because of the culture, the players, the IU administration, and the coach couldn't break through all of that?

I'm really glad that Archie Miller is gone from IU.  I wish him the best.  I do believe that he got the short end of the draw from IU.

I'm really glad that the administration is seeming to support coach Woody.  Good for them.

Maybe there is some light at the end of the tunnel for the IU basketball future.  BDT     (aBout Darn Time)

[Honkyman 1,670]

2 hours ago, Dave from Dayton said:

he must recruit inside of Indiana

This is totally wrong and misleading. Nobody instructed Archie to recruit Indiana to the exclusion or detriment of national recruits. What IU fans were frustrated during the Crean era by was missing out on top Indiana high school players, e.g.,  Gary Harris (Michigan State), Zak Irvin (Michigan), Kyle Guy (Virginia), Kris Wilkes (UCLA). Miller came in and recruited three successive Indiana Mr. Basketballs. But he also recruited out-of-state, e.g., top 100 player Race Thompson and top 50 player Jerome Hunter.  Recruiting suffered over time under Archie because the team was underperforming on the court, not because Archie wasn't trying to recruit in both in-state and out-of-state. In fact, we lost out on several top 100 out-of-state players. Out-of-state players are interested in playing for teams that play in the NCAA tournament.  Miller inherited some good players, like Juwan Morgan who is still in the NBA and then recruited top ten player Romeo Langford (also still in the NBA) and then Indiana Mr. Basketball Trayce Jackson Davis. Unfortunately, the one year when it looked like IU would make the tournament was the year it was cancelled because of COVID. But the fact is, Archie's offensive schemes were terrible and his pack line defense didn't work against team that could shoot the 3-point shot. 

[RaceToTheTop 28,850]

On 4/11/2022 at 12:25 PM, Dave from Dayton said:

Clearly Archie Miller was the wrong guy to coach Indiana at that time.  But I do believe that he was hampered by the IU administration in a lot he could do.

  First, IU made it clear that the PG he had recruited for Dayton could not be given a scholarship at IU. 

Second, he must recruit inside of Indiana, so he did.  Does anyone think that recruiting outside of the state suffered?  Maybe this was because the IU Administration wanted more control over recruiting.  Remember Crean would extend an offer to any potential recruit that made eye contact.

Third, he could not remove players that caused problems because of the NCAA grade issue that he inherited.  Remember the locker room stuff? And the players that stopped moving on court? And the other issues about well, never mind.

Fourth, take a second and reflect on the difference in support that Woody has.  Matta as IU Assistant AD for Administration. Recruiting expertise both inside and outside of the state...check the assistants.  Woody can use the transfer portal because it didn't exist for Archie.    And Woody's ability to let a player go may be more flexible now...we just have not had time to gain that perspective.

Fifth, the cupboard was not in as bad a shape when Woody came in as it was for Archie.  Archie never really got the right players for his scheme.  At Dayton they were smart, shared the ball, did what was necessary to get the loose ball, they knew how to win.  At IU it was the opposite.  Why?  Well, could it be because of the culture, the players, the IU administration, and the coach couldn't break through all of that?

I'm really glad that Archie Miller is gone from IU.  I wish him the best.  I do believe that he got the short end of the draw from IU.

I'm really glad that the administration is seeming to support coach Woody.  Good for them.

Maybe there is some light at the end of the tunnel for the IU basketball future.  BDT     (aBout Darn Time)

Then again….Archie went 12-15 with as much talent as Woodson went to the tourney with.