General Coach Candidate News

[TheWatShot 14,109]

48 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

How is stating we’d have to pay Archie’s buyout and a new coach’s salary fear-mongering?


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Because people make it sound like we'd have to pay everything up front. Like we need $10 to make Archie go away, another $3 million for the next coach, and another $3-4 million to buy out that coach from his current school...all at once. People wondering how we'd ever come up with that much money and saying there's no chance we could do it, it's too much. 

[rcbowla 7,136]

If Archie does indeed get next season and Rajon Rondo were to retire this year I'd be curious if he'd have interest in coaching college basketball. I believe he's hinted towards coaching after playing and the dude knows the game. He'd have the clout with recruits and I'd imagine his basketball IQ, which is up there with anyone, would make him pretty good at x's and o's. Just a thought I had

 

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[Trish 11,622]

Just now, Alford Bailey said:

Even if we hire another mediocre coach but he can recruit guards we would be well ahead of where we are currently.

I really don't like that argument as others have mentioned, we're just rearranging furniture in our living room. A home-run hire is a requirement. If we're going to make a lateral move then the Crean fire was a terrible mistake (which it wasn't). We need a final four guy. 

[Trish 11,622]

https://twitter.com/KrugerToIU

Which one of you guys runs this account? Knock it off! LOL

[rcbowla 7,136]

I really don't like that argument as others have mentioned, we're just rearranging furniture in our living room. A home-run hire is a requirement. If we're going to make a lateral move then the Crean fire was a terrible mistake (which it wasn't). We need a final four guy. 

I agree. A temporary fix will always lead to more disappointment. This is pretty much true in all facets of life. Get it right the first time or in this case the 5th time

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[8bucks 6,476]

8 minutes ago, Treesh said:

https://twitter.com/KrugerToIU

Which one of you guys runs this account? Knock it off! LOL

Kruger was who I had hoped we would get prior to Crean. Wasn’t there some rumor that the plane was headed to wherever he was at the time.  I remember thinking we got Kruger and being “ok” with it then suddenly word broke that we got Crean instead. 
 

kruger is in that Matta category to me. Better than what we have had and will probably have a consistent NCAA team but may not be able to build us to a top 5 program. 
 

if I could not get a top home run hire but had booster support to make a change I would look strongly at a Matta/Kruger type over an up and comer.  

[HoosierAloha 30,068]

4 minutes ago, TheWatShot said:

Because people make it sound like we'd have to pay everything up front. Like we need $10 to make Archie go away, another $3 million for the next coach, and another $3-4 million to buy out that coach from his current school...all at once. People wondering how we'd ever come up with that much money and saying there's no chance we could do it, it's too much. 

Fear-mongering?  They're ignorant but there are some facts in there.

1)  We would have to pay a new coach $3-4 mil a year, that's fixed with any coach

2)  If they come with a buyout we'd have to pay that, $X mil a year

3)  We'd have to pay the difference/year of Archie's buyout until

Say Archie goes to ESPN, like Crean, after this year and receives a $300k salary, we hire Oats from Alabama with a $3 mil buyout and pay him $3.5 mil a year.  For Oats, that is about $9 mil ($3.5 mil for Oats contract, $3 mil for his buyout, and $3 mil or whatever for the difference in Archie's salary) his first year. 

After the first year, the buyout for the new coach would would be dropped but Archie's compensation would be there until he finds another coaching gig that pays more than several hundred thousand dollars.

[HoosierAloha 30,068]

7 minutes ago, 8bucks said:

Kruger was who I had hoped we would get prior to Crean. Wasn’t there some rumor that the plane was headed to wherever he was at the time.  I remember thinking we got Kruger and being “ok” with it then suddenly word broke that we got Crean instead. 
 

kruger is in that Matta category to me. Better than what we have had and will probably have a consistent NCAA team but may not be able to build us to a top 5 program. 
 

if I could not get a top home run hire but had booster support to make a change I would look strongly at a Matta/Kruger type over an up and comer.  

If we got most of Matta's accomplishments from his time at O$U we would be a program in a much better place than we've been in a long time.

[Trish 11,622]

I'm calling John Belien before I'm even considering Lon Kruger. They are both approaching 70 but John has been far more impressive the past decade than Kruger.

 

[Stuhoo 81,387]

3 hours ago, Treesh said:

I really don't like that argument as others have mentioned, we're just rearranging furniture in our living room. A home-run hire is a requirement. If we're going to make a lateral move then the Crean fire was a terrible mistake (which it wasn't). We need a final four guy. 

You won't know if a hire is a "home run hire" until you see the results.

• In my opinion, Tom Allen has been without question a "home run hire." Did anyone have any idea at the time of his hire whether he would be a success? Nope--people were hopeful but had to wait and see.
• The last IUBB "home run hire" was Bobby Knight in 1971. Coach Knight was a 31 year old coming off of an 11-13 season at Army. He had four NIT appearances at Army in six seasons and a 102-50 record at that small school. He had ZERO NCAA appearances.
• While these are the two IU home run hires and admittedly anecdotal, the dynamic is real: Coach K, Brad Stevens, Jay Wright, Donovan at UF, Dean Smith,  Mark Few, Tom Izzo, and on and on. All examples of home run hires without a home run resume when they landed at their iconic location.

Sooooo, the trick is identifying the next and future home run hire.

 

[hper50 1,242]

28 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

You won't know if a hire is a "home run hire" until you see the results.

• In my opinion, Tom Allen was without question a "home run hire." Did anyone have any idea at the time of his hire whether he would be a success? Nope--people were hopeful but had to wait and see.
• The last IUBB "home run hire" was Bobby Knight in 1971. Coach Knight was a 31 year old coming off of an 11-13 season at Army. He had four NIT appearances at Army in six seasons and a 102-50 record at that small school. He had ZERO NCAA appearances.
• While these are the two IU home run hires and admittedly anecdotal, the dynamic is real: Coach K, Brad Stevens, Jay Wright, Donovan at UF, Dean Smith,  Mark Few, Tom Izzo, and on and on. All examples of home run hires without a home run resume when they landed at their iconic location.

Sooooo, the trick is identifying the next and future home run hire.

 

Ding ding ding ding ding ding

[Hardwood83 4,774]

1 hour ago, Treesh said:

https://twitter.com/KrugerToIU

Which one of you guys runs this account? Knock it off! LOL

I don't hate it....but 68? 

[Hardwood83 4,774]

1 hour ago, Treesh said:

I really don't like that argument as others have mentioned, we're just rearranging furniture in our living room. A home-run hire is a requirement. If we're going to make a lateral move then the Crean fire was a terrible mistake (which it wasn't). We need a final four guy. 

1 hour ago, rcs29 said:

I agree. A temporary fix will always lead to more disappointment. This is pretty much true in all facets of life. Get it right the first time or in this case the 5th time

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Mostly where I am. I didn't love Archie's hiring, BUT he was an up & comer with a record of success that appeared to be on the right trajectory. It wasn't an awful hire, just turns out his skills haven't translated to the big stage. 

Past results are no guarantee of future success......but they are all we have to go on beside a hunch or gut feeling. I don't think IU is in a position to take another flyer based on potential. The next guy won't have the luxury of 5-6 yrs to get it figured out. Identify the absolute best option and hire him- whoever that may be. No need to try to find the next hotness, get the established hotness, is my opinion. 

[Hardwood83 4,774]

44 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

You won't know if a hire is a "home run hire" until you see the results.

• In my opinion, Tom Allen was without question a "home run hire." Did anyone have any idea at the time of his hire whether he would be a success? Nope--people were hopeful but had to wait and see.
• The last IUBB "home run hire" was Bobby Knight in 1971. Coach Knight was a 31 year old coming off of an 11-13 season at Army. He had four NIT appearances at Army in six seasons and a 102-50 record at that small school. He had ZERO NCAA appearances.
• While these are the two IU home run hires and admittedly anecdotal, the dynamic is real: Coach K, Brad Stevens, Jay Wright, Donovan at UF, Dean Smith,  Mark Few, Tom Izzo, and on and on. All examples of home run hires without a home run resume when they landed at their iconic location.

Sooooo, the trick is identifying the next and future home run hire.

 

That is one approach. High risk/reward. I don't want that direction though. IU wants to return to Blue-blood status, right? What do they do? Look for bright young minds that are going to grow into the job? No, they hire established guys like Roy Williams, Bill Self and Calipari. Obviously those three are cheating d-bags, but the point remains. If IU wants to hire like a MAC school, we'll get similar results. 

[Trish 11,622]

48 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

You won't know if a hire is a "home run hire" until you see the results.

• In my opinion, Tom Allen was without question a "home run hire." Did anyone have any idea at the time of his hire whether he would be a success? Nope--people were hopeful but had to wait and see.
• The last IUBB "home run hire" was Bobby Knight in 1971. Coach Knight was a 31 year old coming off of an 11-13 season at Army. He had four NIT appearances at Army in six seasons and a 102-50 record at that small school. He had ZERO NCAA appearances.
• While these are the two IU home run hires and admittedly anecdotal, the dynamic is real: Coach K, Brad Stevens, Jay Wright, Donovan at UF, Dean Smith,  Mark Few, Tom Izzo, and on and on. All examples of home run hires without a home run resume when they landed at their iconic location.

Sooooo, the trick is identifying the next and future home run hire.

 

I personally thought the Tom Allen hire would be a great, but that's just me! ;)

 

Yes, the home run hire doesn't seem likely and we're more likely to fail than to succeed when hiring our next coach. Which brings me to another discussion topic that no one likes -- Indiana isn't a great job anymore. 

I'm very worried about our next coach. I have not a clue who we actually have a shot at. I agree a good coach can be found anywhere. Look at Nate Oats, coached forever in the high school ranks in Michigan, now he has a Top 15 men's team this year. Not that I'm saying Oats has a chance at coming here, but good coaches are indeed at any level. The pressure of finding the next great coach at Indiana is real.

Dolson's career fan perception is on the line here. 

[HoosierAloha 30,068]

There was some discussion that Donovan actually talked numbers with IU at some point but wanted more money for his assistants.  Why would he want more money for his assistants?  I have an idea but would like to hear others thoughts.  If IU could have hired Donovan and didn't over maybe a million a year in increased assistant's salaries that tells you what the admin is thinking.

[Feathery 4,005]

27 minutes ago, Treesh said:

I personally thought the Tom Allen hire would be a great, but that's just me! ;)

 

Yes, the home run hire doesn't seem likely and we're more likely to fail than to succeed when hiring our next coach. Which brings me to another discussion topic that no one likes -- Indiana isn't a great job anymore. 

I'm very worried about our next coach. I have not a clue who we actually have a shot at. I agree a good coach can be found anywhere. Look at Nate Oats, coached forever in the high school ranks in Michigan, now he has a Top 15 men's team this year. Not that I'm saying Oats has a chance at coming here, but good coaches are indeed at any level. The pressure of finding the next great coach at Indiana is real.

Dolson's career fan perception is on the line here. 

Talk to coaches and they will tell you IU is a desirable job. Everyone knows that the infrastructure is there to be dominant. Just need the right coach to take it on. 

[Stuhoo 81,387]

1 hour ago, Treesh said:

Which brings me to another discussion topic that no one likes -- Indiana isn't a great job anymore. 

 

46 minutes ago, Feathery said:

Talk to coaches and they will tell you IU is a desirable job. Everyone knows that the infrastructure is there to be dominant. Just need the right coach to take it on. 

 

I'm with Feathery on this one.

What makes a job attractive?

• Media Visibility?  Check
• Big paycheck?  Check
• Primary program at that school? (sorry Coach Allen) BIG Check, especially in light of relatively low competition from pro sports.
• Major Conference?  Check
• Top shelf facilities? Check
• Historic relevance?  Check
• Fan interest?  Check
• Recruiting base?  Check

Yes, the IU job has a few built in cons: overbearing alums and fans, unrealistic expectations, impatience, unwillingness to pay under the table. But, the pros are significant and real, and are only comparable at about ten or twenty programs nationally. In fact, I defy y'all to name more than about 15 programs that can compare with IUBB's attractiveness given these criteria. 

By the way Treesh... if you're buying into my logic here remember; this still IN NO WAY means that Brad Stevens has or will ever have any interest in ever coaching college basketball again.

 

[Hoosierfan2017 21,575]

50 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

There was some discussion that Donovan actually talked numbers with IU at some point but wanted more money for his assistants.  Why would he want more money for his assistants?  I have an idea but would like to hear others thoughts.  If IU could have hired Donovan and didn't over maybe a million a year in increased assistant's salaries that tells you what the admin is thinking.

For the sake of my fandom, I hope that's not true. I'd have a hard time staying invested in the program knowing that the administration isn't invested enough. 

[HoosierHoopster 7,111]

3 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

 

 

I'm with Feathery on this one.

What makes a job attractive?

• Media Visibility?  Check
• Big paycheck?  Check
• Primary program at that school? (sorry Coach Allen) BIG Check, especially in light of relatively low competition from pro sports.
• Major Conference?  Check
• Top shelf facilities? Check
• Historic relevance?  Check
• Fan interest?  Check
• Recruiting base?  Check

Yes, the IU job has a few built in cons: overbearing alums and fans, unrealistic expectations, impatience, unwillingness to pay under the table. But, the pros are significant and real, and are only comparable at about ten or twenty programs nationally. In fact, I defy y'all to name more than about 15 programs that can compare with IUBB's attractiveness given these criteria. 

By the way Treesh... if you're buying into my logic here remember; this still IN NO WAY means that Brad Stevens has or will ever have any interest in ever coaching college basketball again.

 

And ...