(2016) SG Grant Gelon commits to IU

[Brass Cannon 24,394]

Are those my only options? How about the top 2 or 3 Indiana kids and a top 10 from elsewhere. You want another banner then recruit like the Dukes of the world. IU must get top 10-15 talent and keep the best Hoosiers at home. That will do. I'm not sure this staff can do that.

This program can't do that. We aren't Duke or Kentucky. We haven't been to s final four in over a decade and it's been almost 3 decades since we won.

We literally haven't won jack these kids entire lives.

[trailrunner 49]

This program can't do that. We aren't Duke or Kentucky. We haven't been to s final four in over a decade and it's been almost 3 decades since we won.

We literally haven't won jack these kids entire lives.

Before coach K Duke was average. It depends on who is teaching and recruiting

[JSHoosier 19,961]

This program can't do that. We aren't Duke or Kentucky. We haven't been to s final four in over a decade and it's been almost 3 decades since we won.

We literally haven't won jack these kids entire lives.

We have everything it takes, well with one glaring expection anyway.

[Brass Cannon 24,394]

Before coach K Duke was average. It depends on who is teaching and recruiting

 

Yeah you think he was getting the cream of the crop every year right after he started.  No he had to build a respectable program with solid kids at first then once he had consistent success he was able to turn Duke into a powerhouse recruiter. 

 

No matter who we get they aren't going to be nabbing 3 or 4 five star kids every year.  Whoever we get is going to have to be able to build a program.  As much as I don't like Crean I do feel he is trying to build a program the correct way for our team. 

 

Now if we had won a National title either of Zellers years I would be singing a different tune. 

[JSHoosier 19,961]

Yeah you think he was getting the cream of the crop every year right after he started.  No he had to build a respectable program with solid kids at first then once he had consistent success he was able to turn Duke into a powerhouse recruiter. 

 

No matter who we get they aren't going to be nabbing 3 or 4 five star kids every year.  Whoever we get is going to have to be able to build a program.  As much as I don't like Crean I do feel he is trying to build a program the correct way for our team. 

 

Now if we had won a National title either of Zellers years I would be singing a different tune. 

I'll try to make one post about this because this really isn't the place for this discussion.

 

Crean has already shown he can't build a program to do that.  If you give him a few years he can build a good team or two, but when those players leave he falls of a cliff.  He can't build a program for consistent success, and it's not just here it was the exact same way at Marquette.  That's one of the issues with Crean, it's to the point he's being asked to do something he's shown he can't do.

[Brass Cannon 24,394]

I'll try to make one post about this because this really isn't the place for this discussion.

 

Crean has already shown he can't build a program to do that.  If you give him a few years he can build a good team or two, but when those players leave he falls of a cliff.  He can't build a program for consistent success, and it's not just here it was the exact same way at Marquette.  That's one of the issues with Crean, it's to the point he's being asked to do something he's shown he can't do.

 

Very true, so this will be my only rebuttal.  I believe crean has had the players to have consistent success since his 4th year.  The problems are in his coaching and his chasing players away.  Our problems have not been his recruiting is what I am trying to say, we have had the horses just not the jockey. 

[trailrunner 49]

Yeah you think he was getting the cream of the crop every year right after he started. No he had to build a respectable program with solid kids at first then once he had consistent success he was able to turn Duke into a powerhouse recruiter.

No matter who we get they aren't going to be nabbing 3 or 4 five star kids every year. Whoever we get is going to have to be able to build a program. As much as I don't like Crean I do feel he is trying to build a program the correct way for our team.

Now if we had won a National title either of Zellers years I would be singing a different tune.

So then you agree IU can recruit top 10 and homegrown talent with the right staff in a short period of time? IU can recruit top players and has a major advantage with the instate pipeline. I think we could win titles with just homegrown kids.

[JSHoosier 19,961]

Very true, so this will be my only rebuttal.  I believe crean has had the players to have consistent success since his 4th year.  The problems are in his coaching and his chasing players away.  Our problems have not been his recruiting is what I am trying to say, we have had the horses just not the jockey. 

I could just as easily counter with the last couple teams have been very poorly constructed and that falls on how he recruited, and 2012 outside of one player was a total bust which has to at least in part reflect on his recruiting.  There is more to recruiting then just getting good players to sign and factoring everything in I think some overrate how good of a recruiter he is; I'd say he's good not great.

 

Now if he was able to adjust his coaching he could've adjusted his system to fit his personnel, but he either can't or doesn't so the onus is on him to always get the players that fit and he hasn't exactly been great at that.

 

Okay, this really doesn't belong in this thread.  Sorry mods.

[HoosierReb01 7,511]

:scratchhead:

[Brass Cannon 24,394]

So then you agree IU can recruit top 10 and homegrown talent with the right staff in a short period of time? IU can recruit top players and has a major advantage with the instate pipeline. I think we could win titles with just homegrown kids.

 

I very seriously doubt IU could ever win a title with just homegrown kids.  And no I never said anything of the sort.  To recruit top 10 consistently you have to have a track record of success or cheat.  We don't have one and better not be doing the other. 

 

We have to construct a team with the occasional 5 star, and then solid Sophomore and Junior 4 stars.  With the occasional specialist type player like Gelon to shore up particular weaknesses.  And this is how we have been attempting to construct our team as of late.  Its the right strategy just poorly implemented. 

[swatford 1,235]

Since we're on the topic of being off-topic, hows the weather in Bloomington today? :)

[Bobman1 2,909]

Before coach K Duke was average. It depends on who is teaching and recruiting

Its not that easy to just find another Coach K.

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,096]

Another way of looking at this.

Purdue got Ryan Cline, a "sharpshooter" from Indiana who is higher ranked than Gelon. No one even batted an eye about this kid going to Purdue.

Crimson colored glasses are in effect here because if Purdue signed Gelon we'd be laughing at little brother for days on end for not being able to recruit top 10 Indiana HS players.

[Brass Cannon 24,394]

Another way of looking at this.

Purdue got Ryan Cline, a "sharpshooter" from Indiana who is higher ranked than Gelon. No one even batted an eye about this kid going to Purdue.

Crimson colored glasses are in effect here because if Purdue signed Gelon we'd be laughing at little brother for days on end for not being able to recruit top 10 Indiana HS players.

 

Yeah but I would imagine they are expecting more out of Cline than we are expecting out of Gelon.  Gelon is a project in a 6 member class.  Nothing more who won't be expected to contribute till his junior year at the earliest. 

 

I would also imagine they spent alot more time recruiting Cline than we did Gelon.  That time Crean saved on recruiting our 13th scholarship player was probably used focusing on Davis and Cujo the keys to the 2016 class. 

 

Yeah we could have made Cline a priority and tried to snag him from Purdue, but what if that cost us somebody we needed more?

[Uspshoosier 45,374]

Another way of looking at this.

Purdue got Ryan Cline, a "sharpshooter" from Indiana who is higher ranked than Gelon. No one even batted an eye about this kid going to Purdue.

Crimson colored glasses are in effect here because if Purdue signed Gelon we'd be laughing at little brother for days on end for not being able to recruit top 10 Indiana HS players.

just curious top 10 according to who? Some recruiting magazine on Twitter. How accurate was this recuiting publication in predictimg previous indiana classes. did we even recruit cline in 2015. gelon has a whole year to move up or down those rankings. At one point in time gordon was the highest ranked kid in 2016 well ahead of kids like Guy.
Guy got better over the years and didn't feel the love. Virginia made him feel like there number 1 option and iu and others made him feel like a second option according to an article I read when he committed.
Here's hopling the gelon works his tail off and gets better like other kids have shown and is a pleasant surprise signing

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,096]

just curious top 10 according to who? Some recruiting magazine on Twitter. How accurate was this recuiting publication in predictimg previous indiana classes. did we even recruit cline in 2015. gelon has a whole year to move up or down those rankings. At one point in time gordon was the highest ranked kid in 2016 well ahead of kids like Guy.
Guy got better over the years and didn't feel the love. Virginia made him feel like there number 1 option and iu and others made him feel like a second option according to an article I read when he committed.
Here's hopling the gelon works his tail off and gets better like other kids have shown and is a pleasant surprise signing

According to every ranking. Moreover, I am just pointing out the Crimson shaded glasses many are using. I'm HOPEFUL he turns into a player too just being realistic about the situation. He averaged 14 pts a game as a HS Junior and as a shooter. I will support this kid with my full fandom, I'm just questioning the decision making abilities of our leader/coach primarily.

If it weren't for Bryant our last recruits would read Hoetzel (0 star/IU bump to 3), Blackmon (5 star) Priller (0 star), April (0 star), Holt (0 star/IU bump to 3) Morgan (4/3 star), OG ( 0-3 star) Thomas Bryant (5 star) , Gelon (0 star)

[Old Friend 8,389]

Another way of looking at this.

Purdue got Ryan Cline, a "sharpshooter" from Indiana who is higher ranked than Gelon. No one even batted an eye about this kid going to Purdue.

Crimson colored glasses are in effect here because if Purdue signed Gelon we'd be laughing at little brother for days on end for not being able to recruit top 10 Indiana HS players.

I think plenty of people questioned why we weren't more of a player for Cline, and I don't understand why we weren't.    I've questioned Crean's recruiting practices to the point of whipping a dead horse.  Not recruiting Cline was a mistake, because he's the kind of player who can succeed in Crean's system.

 

Grant is a similar player who's playing in different circumstances, in a different system, with a different coach, and very much out of the limelight compared to Carmel.  Whether we would laugh at Purdue 12 months before a kid hits campus or not, this has to play out before anything can be reasonably questioned.

 

I've been very hard on Crean because I think he has no idea how to build a team.  I think he knows how to get a few kids to say yes, and I think he uses a very "shotgun" approach to recruiting; but building a consistently successful roster seems beyond his capability.   I also don't think he's a very good game coach, and I hate his half court offense because I think it lacks movement and is very inefficient.  And I've been saying those things for 5 years, so we agree that he's not the right fit.  I don't like that he hasn't seemed to focus his primary recruiting effort locally.    Michigan State does, and they spent 1/3rd what Indiana did on recruiting last year.   Wisconsin does, and they spent 10% what Indiana did (according to the Indianapolis Star).  Culture is important everywhere, but especially at a program like Indiana.  Understanding that culture along with the expectations that come with it are important.   More important than many credit or realize.   Crean's not done a good job in that area, but this kid sends a message that maybe he's starting to get the picture.

 

In Grant, whether he's highly ranked or not....and I have no idea on what basis he's not; we have a 6'5" kid who can shoot it (43% from the 3-point line is stout, and I don't care who he's playing or where.   That's terrific in game conditions.), who understands angles, spacing, and how to use screens (you can see that in his youtube video), and has a knack for being around the ball defensively.

 

Kids like that don't necessarily need to be spectacular athletes, and I'll use the Brian Evans example again.  He was an unknown beanpole from Terre Haute who was seen at the time as not much more than a 6'7" shooter who shot the ball from his waist.   He turned out to be the Big Ten POY as a senior,   Certainly not going to make that prediction for this kid, but the point is the precedent, not the achievement.  Smart basketball players who can shoot?  Sounds like the Indiana culture to me.   Now, he may end up nothing more than a HPER all star.  Or, he may end up a very solid player at Indiana. We won't know for at least 2 1/2 years, so I don't care if Purdue laughs or not, and it doesn't matter to me if he signs first or last.  You see this as a sign of poor judgement by our coach and I see it as a sign he may be changing the way he recruits in a way which will benefit the program in the long term.   As long as this kid has the ability to succeed in the Big Ten, we can't have enough kids like this.  We need athletes, size, speed, and ball handlers too....but 6'5" shooters who understand the game pretty well?   Sign me up.

[recker222000 1,010]

Another way of looking at this.

Purdue got Ryan Cline, a "sharpshooter" from Indiana who is higher ranked than Gelon. No one even batted an eye about this kid going to Purdue.

Crimson colored glasses are in effect here because if Purdue signed Gelon we'd be laughing at little brother for days on end for not being able to recruit top 10 Indiana HS players.

Not really. Gelon is lights out.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

[Dennis 58]

Just for some numbers on his accuracy, I watched the video posted at the beginning of this thread and tried to count the number of his 3 pointers that hit the rim versus swishing.  To the best I could tell, of 17 shots, 14 were swishers.  He also shot 4 of 4 freethrows that did not touch the rim.

 

I believe that we will see this kid go up up up in the rankings this year in his senior year.  Hope someone keeps up watching this guy and those that get to see him in a game keep those of us out of state fans informed.

[HoosierAloha 30,044]

Just for some numbers on his accuracy, I watched the video posted at the beginning of this thread and tried to count the number of his 3 pointers that hit the rim versus swishing. To the best I could tell, of 17 shots, 14 were swishers. He also shot 4 of 4 freethrows that did not touch the rim.

I believe that we will see this kid go up up up in the rankings this year in his senior year. Hope someone keeps up watching this guy and those that get to see him in a game keep those of us out of state fans informed.

Was that a highlight video...?

It very much matters whether he is shooting 43% against good vs. okay competition. If he shoots 43% in the B1G then we can talk.

I wish nothing but the best for this kid. I hope he gets to IU and sets the B1G on fire. However, I'm not sure he'll even be around for his junior year to see if someone is right or wrong.