They “Retired” Coach Woodson Thread

[HoosierTrav]

6 hours ago, KathywithaC said:

None of that would transpire the way you’ve sketched it out. And the only “hostile” fans aren’t really worth appeasing if building the program back up is the goal.

Your comment perfectly sums up how the fanbase is viewed by those in charge—dismissed, belittled, and written off as if we’re too dumb to see what’s happening. But deep down, you and the rest of the administration know the truth: you’ve been wrong, and the results prove it. If you all haven’t realized this then you’re arrogantly clueless. 

 

For decades, the decisions you defend have failed to deliver anything but mediocrity, and no amount of elitism or gaslighting changes that. The fanbase has been right more often than the administration, and the reality is clear: you’re ineffective at getting results. You can dismiss us all you want, but at the end of the day, you’ll have to live with the fact that your decisions have led IU basketball to this point—and you’ve shown no ability to fix it.

 

[yogisballin]

4 hours ago, Uspshoosier said:

Trust me bro 

So easy to say since he’s back for year 4 ugh

[BtownStrength]

1 hour ago, KathywithaC said:

Universities and university athletic departments don’t tend to work that way, perhaps because the environment is so unique.

 

1 hour ago, KathywithaC said:

That’s not how it works just about anywhere. We aren’t unique.

When you use the word "unique" here, are you using it based on the original Latin word unus, meaning "one"? Are you using it in the extended, more informal meaning as a synonym for "unusual"? If it is the former, quantifying with the preceding word "so" alters the original meaning of "unequaled" incorrectly. However, if it is the latter, I acknowledge this as a widespread case of lexical broadening via a shift toward casual prose. 

I await your forthcoming response with keen interest. 

[HoosierTrav]

I just finished listening to the latest Hoosier Hysterics podcast, and I have to say—it was pretty scathing.  I’ve never been a huge fan of their style. To me, it always felt a bit corny and over-the-top, so I never paid them much attention. But this episode was a complete departure from what I expected. It wasn’t just speculation; it was a detailed, scathing breakdown of rumors and allegations that have been floating around the state for years.

 

Here’s what really struck me: the immediate pushback from certain people trying to dismiss everything as conspiracy or conjecture. It reeks of damage control. How many times have we seen smoke only to find fire later? These aren’t new allegations, and the podcast gave them a clarity that’s hard to ignore.

 

Let’s talk about the elephant in the room—Mike Woodson. From Cathy’s own admission, Scott Dolson didn’t even want to hire him. Instead, Quinn Buckner, who happens to be the Chair of the Board of Trustees and one of Woodson’s closest friend’s, allegedly forced the hire. Are there legs to the rumor that Buckner is preventing Woodson’s removal despite his poor performance? Particularly last season. 

 

Doesn’t this scream conflict of interest? This is a state university—taxpayer-funded and bound by ethical guidelines. How is cronyism like this allowed? IU has specific policies about conflicts of interest and personal relationships interfering with objective decision-making. If true, this situation violates the spirit of those rules at the very least.

 

I’m genuinely curious—what are our options as fans, alumni, and taxpayers? Could this be investigated by the Indiana Attorney General or the State Board of Accounts? After all, these decisions involve public revenue, and the implications of cronyism at the top of a state-funded institution go beyond just bad optics.

 

At the very least, shouldn’t we be pushing for:

    1.    An independent investigation into these allegations, either internally or by an external body like the Attorney General?

    2.    More transparency in decision-making for IU leadership, especially in hires that impact the program’s future.

    3.    A governance overhaul to ensure that personal friendships don’t dictate the program’s direction.

 

I’d love to hear what others think about this. The Hoosier Hysterics podcast has clearly hit a nerve, and the timing of this damage control campaign only makes me more skeptical. Are we being gaslit into thinking this is just baseless speculation? Or is there a possibility for real accountability?

 

[Deserthoozier]

4 hours ago, MikeRoberts said:

This needs to be restated as Duke and UNC have had 10x the recent success that IU has. Seems there is a formula that works and it isn’t what IU is doing. Hiring by stakeholders/committee etc doesn’t work. We’re the poster child for that

 

100% same at Alabama. Greg Byrne has full authority. Sure, has to pre-inform major donors and stake holders and take them through a pre-announcement buy-in process, and sometimes money raising…but, he drives the bus and gets everyone else on board. His decision, live or die. IU sounds infinitely more bureaucratic and the results show! 

AuntiewithaK, please don’t shout ‘but Bill Orwig’, question how ‘new fans’ the people who post on here are, or split hairs over grammar…it shows your immaturity and pettiness, petulance aside! 

[Home Jersey]

5 hours ago, DChoosier said:

Perhaps I have poor reading comprehension but I don’t think she  defends Woody’s performance or claims that things are going well.
Her posts give a perspective of how the “powers that be” operate but that doesn’t mean that she agrees with their viewpoints or the direction of the program.

I just don’t see any insights or interesting perspective. Just condescension and damage control, with a clear agenda. Yawn. Nice troll job by him / her / they, though.

[johnsoniu]

5 hours ago, BtownStrength said:

 

When you use the word "unique" here, are you using it based on the original Latin word unus, meaning "one"? Are you using it in the extended, more informal meaning as a synonym for "unusual"? If it is the former, quantifying with the preceding word "so" alters the original meaning of "unequaled" incorrectly. However, if it is the latter, I acknowledge this as a widespread case of lexical broadening via a shift toward casual prose. 

I await your forthcoming response with keen interest. 

Yeah, what he said ^^^

I have no idea what he said, but it sounds smart as hell

[AZ Hoosier]

7 hours ago, KathywithaC said:

You think most of those people know more about basketball than Quinn?  Uh, no. Not even close. Most of them hadn’t even been ADs before we hired them.

Whose fault is that? Hiring people with no prior experience (Woodson and company) is exactly why we're here and why this thread exists. There's plenty of incompetence to go around... but God forbid the fans want change because of it.

[LamarCheeks]

Not sure exactly what position K with C holds at IU, but I actually thought she shared some interesting observations. 

What I took exception with was she seemed to imply that this calling for Woody to be ousted was born from the crap show in the Bahamas -- that it were some sort of impulsive reaction from a bunch of whiny know-nothing fusspots over two early season losses.

That clearly is not the case. This recent upheaval goes much deeper. Obviously, there are myriad reasons (outdated style of play, a half-dozen or so blowouts last year, recruiting misses, and on and on and on) -- but she continually seem to insinuate that we're just silly, impatient fan boys and fan girls on a fan board who hadn't thought this through. 

I don't know that anybody said they wanted Woody ousted right this minute -- though maybe some have. I don't see what purpose it would serve, particularly when it doesn't seem as if there's anybody capable of running the team in the interim. But I do want him gone after the season -- even though we've played only seven games. I wanted him gone after last season. I've seen enough to know that the program is not on a good trajectory, and won't be as long as Woody's at the helm. 

She referred to Crean and Miller being misses and bad hires. That did turn out to be the case, but I look at it this way. When Crean was hired away from Marquette, he had been considered for bigger, better jobs. When Archie was hired away from Dayton, he had been considered for bigger, better jobs. When we hired Woody -- there was NOT one other school or program that would've hired him as a HC. To me -- that's pretty much all you need to know. 

[AZ Hoosier]

6 hours ago, HoosierTrav said:

I’d love to hear what others think about this. The Hoosier Hysterics podcast has clearly hit a nerve, and the timing of this damage control campaign only makes me more skeptical. Are we being gaslit into thinking this is just baseless speculation? Or is there a possibility for real accountability?

Pretty much what I said earlier. KwithaC shows up after a 5-6 month absence trying to spin the situation at the same time the scathing HH podcast drops... meanwhile (it's been reported here) that the twitter-verse minions are spinning and defending (I cannot verify, as I am not on that platform)... the whole thing seems oddly coincidental... and remember what Leroy Jethro Gibbs' rule #39 says about coincidences.

[Golfman25]

7 hours ago, KathywithaC said:

You think most of those people know more about basketball than Quinn?  Uh, no. Not even close. Most of them hadn’t even been ADs before we hired them.

Based on Quinn’s record as a coach he knows almost nothing about that part of the game.  Probably could find 10 guys at the Hyper who know more.  

[IU Prof]

8 hours ago, KathywithaC said:

That’s not how it works just about anywhere. We aren’t unique.

I'm not sure how you can claim to both be a long-time IU Insider and also an expert on the interworkings of other major universities. IU is an unusually insular and incompetently run institution, based on my experience at a variety of universities, in ways that most IU lifers fail to appreciate or understand. So if you have the longitudinal perspective of IU decision-making processes that you've suggested, then I don't think you are in a particularly strong position to discuss how similar or dissimilar IU's processes are to other, more competently run institutions.

[Golfman25]

7 minutes ago, AZ Hoosier said:

Pretty much what I said earlier. KwithaC shows up after a 5-6 month absence trying to spin the situation at the same time the scathing HH podcast drops... meanwhile (it's been reported here) that the twitter-verse minions are spinning and defending (I cannot verify, as I am not on that platform)... the whole thing seems oddly coincidental... and remember what Leroy Jethro Gibbs' rule #39 says about coincidences.

Agreed. It is clear that “cathy” is tyme or someone affiliated with him.  She just pushes the woodson narrative.  Talking about other coaches, ADs etc is just deflection from the chitshow painted by HH.   The podcast was pretty much a detailed confirmation of what we already knew in the abstract. 

[Golfman25]

5 minutes ago, IU Prof said:

I'm not sure how you can claim to both be a long-time IU Insider and also an expert on the interworkings of other major universities. IU is an unusually insular and incompetently run institution, based on my experience at a variety of universities, in ways that most IU lifers fail to appreciate or understand. So if you have the longitudinal perspective of IU decision-making processes that you've suggested, then I don't think you are in a particularly strong position to discuss how similar or dissimilar IU's processes are to other, more competently run institutions.

Yeah, she’s just deflecting regarding the process IU goes thru.  Likes to conflate “consensus” with “decision” and authority.  All organizations prefer to develop a consensus on major decisions.  But that doesn’t mean the decision maker gives up that authority.   Consensus is required because you are evaluated on your decisions and if you constantly make decisions your boss wouldn’t make you won’t be around long.   Dolson is being pushed around by Buckner et al because he probably wants to keep his job and will be around longer than him.  Pam Whitten may be the wild card here.  She was out front on the Cig hire.  My guess is she tips the balance when Mediocre mike has to go.  

[Home Jersey]

Don’t know if it was already covered but also on the podcast they all said that it’s confirmed Woody does not report to Scott Dolson. Apparently Dolson has said as much to Evans. Evans felt it was important that everyone know this is “not Scott’s guy” and the HH dweebs said fans should all back up Scott if they want a change, which they then sort of softened on/backed off on because they probably realized they were setting things up to go full nuclear.

Screw Woodrow

[Pagoda]

26 minutes ago, Golfman25 said:

Agreed. It is clear that “cathy” is tyme or someone affiliated with him.  She just pushes the woodson narrative.  Talking about other coaches, ADs etc is just deflection from the chitshow painted by HH.   The podcast was pretty much a detailed confirmation of what we already knew in the abstract. 

Yea, there is the group of people who pretend they see some big picture and how it's all about to come together for Woody.  They see themselves as wise and the fans are dumb and reactionary.  This group will do anything to defend Woody, yet they will freely trash prior coaches without considering any context.  It's pathetic.  

Fortunately, we're at the point the wins/losses, game scores, and rankings are too much for them to spin.

[AZ Hoosier]

5 minutes ago, Home Jersey said:

Don’t know if it was already covered but also on the podcast they all said that it’s confirmed Woody does not report to Scott Dolson. Apparently Dolson has said as much to Evans. Evans felt it was important that everyone know this is “not Scott’s guy” and the HH dweebs said fans should all back up Scott if they want a change, which they then sort of softened on/backed off on because they probably realized they were setting things up to go full nuclear.

Screw Woodrow

Sometimes "nuclear" is the logical next step in the progression.

[IUHoosierJoe]

9 hours ago, KathywithaC said:

Terry Clapacs, Clarence Donniger, Michael McNeeley, Rick Greenspan, Fred Glass, Scott Dolson - who in this group brought the necessary experience to make consistently good hires?

I would argue that Dolson is most qualified on that list, perhaps by far.  No, he hasn’t been an AD for a long time, but he’s worked in the IU athletic departments for decades, has seen many coaches come and go, and has certainly learned a lot as to why some coaches have succeeded and others have failed.  And I think he used that knowledge to make an incredible football hire, something numerous other IU athletic directors have not been able to do.  Would you agree with that?

[schoosier]

20 hours ago, JSHoosier said:

Our pro coach didn't win in the pros either.

This is why Woody should have never been given the job in the first place. Even though he had internal pressures, the hire was on Dolson and the buck stops with him. As good as Coach Cig it, Woodson has been equally as bad. Indiana should never miss an NCAA tournament.

[schoosier]

1 hour ago, IU Prof said:

I'm not sure how you can claim to both be a long-time IU Insider and also an expert on the interworkings of other major universities. IU is an unusually insular and incompetently run institution, based on my experience at a variety of universities, in ways that most IU lifers fail to appreciate or understand. So if you have the longitudinal perspective of IU decision-making processes that you've suggested, then I don't think you are in a particularly strong position to discuss how similar or dissimilar IU's processes are to other, more competently run institutions.

Thanks for your insight. I would love to hear more about how IU is an incompetently run university from your experience. How does this affect men’s basketball? If Woody does not indeed report to Dolson, this may be an example of this.