Fire Coach Woodson Thread

[AH1971 1,890]

Just now, TheWatShot said:

Davis: 6 years

Sampson: 2 years (not fired for results)

Crean: 9 years

Miller: 4 years

Woodson: 4 years

 

 

The issue is we not only hire bad coaches, we keep them around too long. 

When you bail on a coach after two seasons (like you just admitted with Archie) it becomes next to impossible to survive here.

So you either:

a) win and win big out of the gate

b) have the stones to block out the noise

That's why hiring somebody who has never managed expectations like the ones that have been set here rarely work out.

[Certified Sunshine Pumper 9,581]

8 minutes ago, AH1971 said:

Never going to build or sustain anything firing coaches every 2 years. And I think that's painfully obvious given the trajectory this program has taken dating back nearly 30 years. 

Which hasn't happened, factually speaking. 

[realTomCrean 1,715]

31 minutes ago, str8baller said:

I used to read comics as a kid, And even then I always thought Lucy pulling the football was the dumbest trope. 
 

Now I get it…

Some say they won't believe it until they see it. I'm the opposite - Brad Stevens IUBB HC, Brady Stevens a 3-year player, and Papa Stevens a proud parent/grandparent. Eat it Charlie Brown

[IUFAN1976 3,971]

24 minutes ago, Pagoda said:

I get there are concerns about the optics of firing Woody after three years.

But, what about the optics of this season as a result of keeping him?  The 20+ point blowouts, ranked in the 60’s after huge NIL spend, empty AH, and significant national media criticism.  And we whiffed on another high school recruiting class, including top Indiana kids, which starts to compromise next year.  These optics are a lot worse than firing a bad coach after three years.

We have to quit thinking about the optics unless you look at the optics in the other direction.  It is clear the university only looked their direction and had no clue this was going to happen.  So which optic looks worse now, firing Woodson last year or what happened at the Illinois game?  I say the Illinois game was much worse!

[DoctorP 1,318]

Just now, Demo said:

I don’t get your point here at all. “players quit on their coach” is an indictment of the coach and not the players, and  “a program with this kind of noise” is like talking about Everest and “a mountain with this kind of snow.” It’s just a factually accurate statement of conditions that need to be dealt with as part of the climb. I don’t see any shift of onus in any way. 

I’ll answer this and then be done responding to him or questions on his posts.
 

The first one might be me reading too much into it. But when you consider the source, “players quit on their coach” was taken by me to continue to shift blame away from CMW. Not to be pedantic, but the words literally are putting the active verbiage of quitting on the players. 
 

I take issue with the repeated highlighting of IUBB “noise”. I find it insulting to what’s been a consistently patient and knowledgeable fanbase. We’ve given every previous coach ample time to get it going. We haven’t been to an E8 since 2002. We aren’t asking for much given the resources a coach has at their disposal here. We want effort, a team that understands the fundamentals and a foundation for somewhat consistent success.
He repeatedly keeps bringing up “noise” as a reason coaches would/should either be turned off or wouldn’t be able to handle the job when the “noise” is the only thing this damn program has left for it.
 

In any way blaming the noise or fans in general for current or future issues continues to be the laziest take. Any program thats endured what we have this century and with fan interest, desire to win, and $$$ like this would have as much if not more noise. 

[str8baller 5,877]

1 minute ago, Chris007 said:

So we had met with the Stevens family multiple times at this point discussing numbers. So we knew where we needed to be. They made it seem to us if we met that number it would be a done deal. I don't think they felt we would and they have not talked it over as a family. So when Tracy met in Florida with our people we made our offer thinking it was a done deal. Then when our old boy system didn't like a strong woman in the room and made her mad, they went home talked it over as a family, and had the vote. Both kids were in school and didn't want to move back to Indiana. 

I’ve never put this on the board before, but I have my own source who basically confirmed, in real time, that lots of the IU inner circle (ie high level donors, trustees, etc…) earnestly believed IU was getting Stevens. It became the worst kept secret in Indy for a day or so. This person is not an IU fan, is not a message board person and is not prone to silly gossip or hysteria. So I believe IU thought they had it in the bag.  
 

I don’t believe Stevens was anywhere close. 
 

And the fact that IU was so bamboozeled just makes me think IU is that incompetent, not that Stevens was all that interested.

 

 Just my 2 cents, that’s probably worse less than that. 

[MikeRoberts 7,353]

19 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

Got out voted by his family 3-1. Not sure how long you have been here but I have documented the whole thing many times. Actually, live posting the whole thing as it was happening during the last search. Tracy left Boca Raton last time with the contract in hand for Brad to sign, IU people celebrating that they had a verbal deal, them somehow making her mad, everything changing mid-flight, then him doing the interview he was a masshole. 

What I think has been missing from this story that I cannot fathom how it doesn’t get included when telling the story because it is the most important part is “what exactly pissed her off?”

[WayneFleekHoosier 49,053]

Zero chance a working individual can keep up with this pace.  Geez.

[TheWatShot 14,424]

5 minutes ago, AH1971 said:

When you bail on a coach after two seasons (like you just admitted with Archie) it becomes next to impossible to survive here.

So you either:

a) win and win big out of the gate

b) have the stones to block out the noise

That's why hiring somebody who has never managed expectations like the ones that have been set here rarely work out.

It was clear after 2 years Archie had failed on both counts. So what did we accomplish by giving him 2 more years? 

[Chris007 47,801]

2 minutes ago, str8baller said:

I’ve never put this on the board before, but I have my own source who basically confirmed, in real time, that lots of the IU inner circle (ie high level donors, trustees, etc…) earnestly believed IU was getting Stevens. It became the worst kept secret in Indy for a day or so. This person is not an IU fan, is not a message board person and is not prone to silly gossip or hysteria. So I believe IU thought they had it in the bag.  
 

I don’t believe Stevens was anywhere close. 
 

And the fact that IU was so bamboozeled just makes me think IU is that incompetent, not that Stevens was all that interested.

 

 Just my 2 cents, that’s probably worse less than that. 

I somewhat agree, maybe he was playing us to get the raise out of Boston, But to say he was never interested I don't necessarily believe that.

My stepson's dad a Butler guy, sat beside him on a plane to Boston and he told him that he would retire as the IU coach someday. 

There are numerous stories of him saying these things to people. So he has always had the IU job on his mind. 

[AH1971 1,890]

3 minutes ago, DoctorP said:

I take issue with the repeated highlighting of IUBB “noise”. I find it insulting to what’s been a consistently patient and knowledgeable fanbase. We’ve given every previous coach ample time to get it going. We haven’t been to an E8 since 2002. We aren’t asking for much given the resources a coach has at their disposal here. We want effort, a team that understands the fundamentals and a foundation for somewhat consistent success.
He repeatedly keeps bringing up “noise” as a reason coaches would/should either be turned off or wouldn’t be able to handle the job when the “noise” is the only thing this damn program has left for it.

If you don't understand the demands and expectations for this job, then I can't help you. Sometimes those demands aren't met in in the first couple of years. It isn't for everybody, clearly. We're on what, coach 6 this century?

[str8baller 5,877]

6 minutes ago, realTomCrean said:

Some say they won't believe it until they see it. I'm the opposite - Brad Stevens IUBB HC, Brady Stevens a 3-year player, and Papa Stevens a proud parent/grandparent. Eat it Charlie Brown

Lol…

 

If my post wasn’t clear, it wasn’t a shot at you. Reading those snippets make me want to believe too, even though I know better.

[DoctorP 1,318]

Some fans here will have you believe this job becomes undesirable to some because of the supposed noise. Because of the desire to win and a remarkable fanbase in terms of energy, knowledge, and scope. 

Any coach worth their salt (and whose family approves, etc) wants this gig because winning here makes you a King. 
No coach worth having is turned off by the supposed noise, rather they are motivated by it, they embrace it—like Pope at UK. 

[spe317 614]

11 minutes ago, maharkn said:

Clearly not married, everyone knows the wife's vote counts for two or three

Wait you guys are getting votes?

[Certified Sunshine Pumper 9,581]

Doesn't Mike Woodson get paid 4+million dollars a year to not care about noise? Holy S*** 

I won't even go into what the players make to suck. Wowza 

[TheWatShot 14,424]

4 minutes ago, IUFAN1976 said:

We have to quit thinking about the optics unless you look at the optics in the other direction.  It is clear the university only looked their direction and had no clue this was going to happen.  So which optic looks worse now, firing Woodson last year or what happened at the Illinois game?  I say the Illinois game was much worse!

Anybody who thinks we made the right choice by giving Woodson another year is either related to him, receiving money from him or smoking something illegal (or maybe some combination of the three?). The longer we keep him around, the worse it will get. More blowouts, more booing, more chants, possible off-court problems, social media meltdowns...our imaginations are the only limits here. 

[Chris007 47,801]

4 minutes ago, MikeRoberts said:

What I think has been missing from this story that I cannot fathom how it doesn’t get included when telling the story because it is the most important part is “what exactly pissed her off?”

As I said I have never heard exactly but something about what one or more of the old men in the room were acting.

She's a woman so who really knows? Sometimes my wife is in a great mood, I go to the bathroom and come back she's is spitting fire. 

[Golfman25 5,917]

1 hour ago, Uspshoosier said:

I hear you however IU has lost the seat at the upper tier table.   IU just needs to work on getting a good coach that gets them in the conversation of competing for the top of the B1G and making second weekend tournament runs.    Worrying about finding a coach that is going win it all quickly or within the first couple of years isn’t likely to happen.  Find a great college basketball lifer that brings back pride and gives fans a chance to watch their team in the second week of the tourney and compete for B1G titles then worry about getting the seat back at the table with the true contenders later.   IU has to grind now just like any other program fighting to get to the top 

Yep, it's a numbers game.  You have to get in it to win it.  

[realTomCrean 1,715]

2 minutes ago, str8baller said:

Lol…

 

If my post wasn’t clear, it wasn’t a shot at you. Reading those snippets make me want to believe too, even though I know better.

All good, no offense taken. Actually made me Lol. We walk by faith not by sight

[Artie86 2,360]

3 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

I somewhat agree, maybe he was playing us to get the raise out of Boston, But to say he was never interested I don't necessarily believe that.

My stepson's dad a Butler guy, sat beside him on a plane to Boston and he told him that he would retire as the IU coach someday. 

There are numerous stories of him saying these things to people. So he has always had the IU job on his mind. 

lol!!!