2022-2023 IUBB Roster Projection

[RaceToTheTop]

2 hours ago, HoosierFan1994 said:

Sounds like combine invites went out over the weekend. Sounds like they have a few days to accept. If I read it right they invite 60 players for the NBA draft combine and 40 from the G League. If Trayce got one (which I think he will) his decision probably won't be made for another 3 weeks. 

If it was a G league invite, I think he would be back for sure.

[incrediboy]

21 hours ago, ap2345 said:

Kopp fills a current role on the team and isn't going anywhere. Partially because the guy that makes the decisions likes Kopp. 

Say what you will about Kopp being dead weight. I like having a fifth-year guy who can knock down 3s and who plays solid defense coming off the bench and being a steadying force in practice as well. I've always thought a 3-point shooter coming off the bench is a huge asset...to the point I would not have started either Kopp or Stewart last season just to have such a situation.

[go iu bb]

22 minutes ago, incrediboy said:

Say what you will about Kopp being dead weight. I like having a fifth-year guy who can knock down 3s and who plays solid defense coming off the bench and being a steadying force in practice as well. I've always thought a 3-point shooter coming off the bench is a huge asset...to the point I would not have started either Kopp or Stewart last season just to have such a situation.

If that ends up being his role, great. I have a feeling he'll continue to start get a lot of PT.

[incrediboy]

6 minutes ago, go iu bb said:

If that ends up being his role, great. I have a feeling he'll continue to start get a lot of PT.

I don't see Kopp starting at all. The word I have been hearing is that Geronimo is going to spend the summer learning to handle the ball so that he can assume the starting role at "the 3." And if JG can't get to that point, I think we go with Bates, JHS and X in a 3-guard offense with Race and Trayce.

[Honkyman]

5 minutes ago, incrediboy said:

Geronimo is going to spend the summer learning to handle the ball so that he can assume the starting role at "the 3." And if JG can't get to that point, I think we go with Bates, JHS and X in a 3-guard offense with Race and Trayce.

Perhaps. Becoming a good 3-point shooter and ball handler over a couple of months is easier said than done. I remember some predicting that TJD would develop an outside shot last summer. Obviously, players improve over time with consistent hard work. But good shooters usually arrive at college as good shooters and become better shooters. Same is true with ball handling. Bates would seem to start out with a better chance of playing the role of a shooter than Geronimo who demonstrated more aptitude for rebounding and putting back missed shots. Unless one of Bates, Galloway, Leal, or Geronimo suddenly become great shooters, the fact remains that Kopp is easily the best outside shooter on the team to play the 3. In any event, competition for the 3 spot should make the entire team better.

[DChoosier]

13 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Perhaps. Becoming a good 3-point shooter and ball handler over a couple of months is easier said than done. I remember some predicting that TJD would develop an outside shot last summer. Obviously, players improve over time with consistent hard work. But good shooters usually arrive at college as good shooters and become better shooters. Same is true with ball handling. Bates would seem to start out with a better chance of playing the role of a shooter than Geronimo who demonstrated more aptitude for rebounding and putting back missed shots. Unless one of Bates, Galloway, Leal, or Geronimo suddenly become great shooters, the fact remains that Kopp is easily the best outside shooter on the team to play the 3. In any event, competition for the 3 spot should make the entire team better.

I agree.

In regards to Bates, Galloway and JG….It would be huge if one of them could develop into a reliable perimeter threat as all three of them are decent taking it to the rim. As you stated, players can develop but becoming a good shooter is easier said than done. If none of them become a perimeter threat we will have a very deep roster but probably still lack, like last year, a multi-dimensional “go to” perimeter threat. A Davis, Ivy, Murray type of guy would raise our ceiling and give us an end of game option rather than just trying to get the ball into TJD (which every team in the BT expected/defended last year). I think/hope Bates could be that guy but who knows.

[Stuhoo]

 

There are two things that Geronimo needs to do to be an effective option at the three:

1. Be a reliable three point shooter
2. Improve his defensive awareness

I didn't mention improving his handle... We will have two really good pick and roll guards (and maybe Gallo as a third). JG won't have the handle of TB, but he already has the handle of MK, and he does other things really well that MK and TB will never do as well. 

So his strengths in rim protection, keeping offensive possessions alive, switchability on defense (that's a big one) and finishing at the rim compensate for some weaknesses, but with Trayce never turning into an outside threat we will need JG, JHS, X, and Race to be respectable from outside -- not afraid to shoot when open and about 35% on open jumpers. That's not too much to expect; I think that JG's outside shot form translates well.

Defensive awareness? That will come from dedication to watching film and lots of minutes during cupcake season.

 

[HoosierHoopster]

35 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Perhaps. Becoming a good 3-point shooter and ball handler over a couple of months is easier said than done. I remember some predicting that TJD would develop an outside shot last summer. Obviously, players improve over time with consistent hard work. But good shooters usually arrive at college as good shooters and become better shooters. Same is true with ball handling. Bates would seem to start out with a better chance of playing the role of a shooter than Geronimo who demonstrated more aptitude for rebounding and putting back missed shots. Unless one of Bates, Galloway, Leal, or Geronimo suddenly become great shooters, the fact remains that Kopp is easily the best outside shooter on the team to play the 3. In any event, competition for the 3 spot should make the entire team better.

Kopp scored at the bottom of the team,  like 10th, and Geronimo repeatedly showed a pretty solid outside shot. His stroke is good. Kopp adds outside shooting, but he cannot create his own shot, he's a catch and shoot player. We will be much, much better, on both sides of the ball, if Geronimo continues to progress along the lines he's already shown. That progression is up to him, but man he's one thousand times better than having Kopp play extended starting minutes.

[Honkyman]

3 minutes ago, HoosierHoopster said:

We will be much, much better, on both sides of the ball, if Geronimo continues to progress along the lines he's already shown.

Woodson seems to like Kopp which obviously counts for a lot. Geronimo's play so far is more natural for the 4 spot. His ball handling and outside shooting need a lot of work but he seems to have a solid work ethic. I'm sure Woodson promised him the opportunity to play the 3 but he has to demonstrate he is truly up to it for long stretches rather than simply in relief. As mentioned, Bates would seem to have the best chance of beating out Kopp for the 3. We shall see.

[IUFAN1976]

37 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

 

There are two things that Geronimo needs to do to be an effective option at the three:

1. Be a reliable three point shooter
2. Improve his defensive awareness

I didn't mention improving his handle... We will have two really good pick and roll guards (and maybe Gallo as a third). JG won't have the handle of TB, but he already has the handle of MK, and he does other things really well that MK and TB will never do as well. 

So his strengths in rim protection, keeping offensive possessions alive, switchability on defense (that's a big one) and finishing at the rim compensate for some weaknesses, but with Trayce never turning into an outside threat we will need JG, JHS, X, and Race to be respectable from outside -- not afraid to shoot when open and about 35% on open jumpers. That's not too much to expect; I think that JG's outside shot form translates well.

Defensive awareness? That will come from dedication to watching film and lots of minutes during cupcake season.

 

I think Race will make a jump up in 3 point shooting %.  You may see it over the 35% mark!

[HoosierHoopster]

40 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Woodson seems to like Kopp which obviously counts for a lot. Geronimo's play so far is more natural for the 4 spot. His ball handling and outside shooting need a lot of work but he seems to have a solid work ethic. I'm sure Woodson promised him the opportunity to play the 3 but he has to demonstrate he is truly up to it for long stretches rather than simply in relief. As mentioned, Bates would seem to have the best chance of beating out Kopp for the 3. We shall see.

It's a we shall see for sure, but seriously Kopp did almost nothing for the team offensively, and you're glossing over Geronimo's significantly increased playing time by the last few games, and Kopp's reduction in playing time -- 

UM - Kopp 34 min, JG 19 min 

Wyoming - Kopp 21, JG 19 (JG 15 points, Kopp 0)

St Mary's - Kopp 22, JG 21 (JG 9 points Kopp 0)

The wing discussion has been beaten to death. JG needs to play a lot, he's going to be even better, Kopp is not going to be any better.

I'm a Bates fan, he can also make a big jump

[PB1230]

4 minutes ago, HoosierHoopster said:

It's a we shall see for sure, but seriously Kopp did almost nothing for the team offensively, and you're glossing over Geronimo's significantly increased playing time by the last few games, and Kopp's reduction in playing time -- 

UM - Kopp 34 min, JG 19 min 

Wyoming - Kopp 21, JG 19 (JG 15 points, Kopp 0)

St Mary's - Kopp 22, JG 21 (JG 9 points Kopp 0)

The wing discussion has been beaten to death. JG needs to play a lot, he's going to be even better, Kopp is not going to be any better.

I'm a Bates fan, he can also make a big jump

But JG wasn't taking Kopps minutes, he was taking Race's minutes

[BGleas]

1 minute ago, PB1230 said:

But JG wasn't taking Kopps minutes, he was taking Race's minutes

Right. Kopp and Stewart losing minutes the last few games was because Galloway and Phinisee were back. Had nothing to do with Geronimo. 

[Honkyman]

14 minutes ago, HoosierHoopster said:

you're glossing over Geronimo's significantly increased playing time by the last few games,

Almost all of that time was at the 4. Hey, I hope Geronimo can improve enough to play the 3 regularly. I like him. He is arguably the team's most exciting player. But he needs to improve to warrant starting there.

[Banksyrules]

Sooooo any idea when TJD makes a decision? I’m so out of the loop lol

[HoosierHoopster]

57 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Almost all of that time was at the 4. Hey, I hope Geronimo can improve enough to play the 3 regularly. I like him. He is arguably the team's most exciting player. But he needs to improve to warrant starting there.

 

57 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

Almost all of that time was at the 4. Hey, I hope Geronimo can improve enough to play the 3 regularly. I like him. He is arguably the team's most exciting player. But he needs to improve to warrant starting there.

Of course, like I said the wing discussion is beaten to death, we've covered that ad nauseum. I don't really care where Geronimo plays so long as he's playing well into 20-plus minutes, and honestly I think that Kopp's minutes should be reduced should be clear. Have said it before, this is not to disparage Kopp, he adds value, but if we want to be competing towards the top of the B1G, that's off the bench in a role player role.

[HoosierHoopster]

1 hour ago, BGleas said:

Right. Kopp and Stewart losing minutes the last few games was because Galloway and Phinisee were back. Had nothing to do with Geronimo. 

broken record lol

[Stuhoo]

1 hour ago, BGleas said:

Right. Kopp and Stewart losing minutes the last few games was because Galloway and Phinisee were back. Had nothing to do with Geronimo. 

True, but this year with Reneau (and maybe Banks) IU has an excellent option at the 4/5 to spell Trayce/Race. 

So, if Jordan wants to keep getting starter-level minutes like he did at the end of the season he's gonna have to play some three.

[HoosierHoopster]

Just now, Stuhoo said:

True, but this year with Reneau (and maybe Banks) IU has an excellent option at the 4/5 to spell Trayce/Race. 

So, if Jordan wants to keep getting starter-level minutes like he did at the end of the season he's gonna have to play some three.

Said it above, and while I do think he has the potential to develop more handle to move into more of a wing role, just like OG did as he progressed in the pros, imo we're getting too caught up in the wing or else discussion. Kopp just isn't at the level the team needs to take the next step, he barely scored, he can't create his own shot, he can't defend slashers, he can't elevate well, he's a catch and shoot spot up shooter, which has real value, but it's not top of the conf competing play value. JG has all the tools, he already rebounds, defends, blocks and yes scores along with the top players on the team, and he will, I think clearly, continue to improve/develop, while Kopp is at his ceiling. 

Just look at Race after his red-shirt soph year and what he became as a junior and senior. That's what we should (imo) be looking for, not continuing to slot Kopp into the "3" or significant playing time just because he's been there.

[HoosierFan1994]

42 minutes ago, Banksyrules said:

Sooooo any idea when TJD makes a decision? I’m so out of the loop lol

If he got a combine invite it probably won't be until after it happens (May 22). If he didn't get an invite (which I think he would know by now) it could be anytime.