Purdue at Indiana Game Thread - 7:00pm ESPN2

[HoosierAloha]

NCAA tourney is a guard game. The best Michigan teams have good guards that peak at the right time and take over. IU had sorely been missing that Trey Burke, Derrick Walton and Matthews. With a solid complementary great big McGary and Wagner  In college I truly believe you have to have a star point guard to excel. We don’t have one of those. Phinisee may become that guy in the future. I still think if Senior Yogi was on that team in 2012-2013 IU wins it all. 

I completely agree with the tourney being about guards. However, you don’t see the trash basketball that is the Big Ten basketball. You won’t see Edwards being able to grab a player with both hands to stop him from cutting. You won’t see Haarms grabbing or bumping cutters without a foul. What the Big Ten allows and what is allowed in the tourney are night and day.

I applaud the Big Ten for not having as many programs caught up in the scandal (that won’t result in much) but they get a big fat F in the style of basketball.

I love IU and college basketball but if I’m a top player that could go anywhere I’d find it tough to play in the Big Ten. It’s just not a modern day version of basketball.

I would love for IU to have the reputation of a Michigan, Wiscy, MSU, or pu where the refs just stop calling fouls. It happens almost every game. pu had 5 fouls in the first five minutes and then they just suddenly stopped fouling even though zromeo was still being held, Morgan was being bodied, and our other guards were getting hacked.

Their big hit Romeo’s arm and body before getting the ball. That’s a foul almost every time in a different league. In the Big Ten, that’s a big moving his feet so well and getting a hand on the ball.

Freedom of movement isn’t allowed in the Big Ten and it’s a detriment to the league.


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[cchuntsman]

1 minute ago, A.j. Nigh said:

Working hard on defense made Rob start shooting falling to the side?  Archie backed a struggling player with a positive comment on another part of his game.  Seriously some of the “rationale” on here is beyond belief.

I think we can all agree Rob’s shooting motion changed drastically between his junior and senior seasons.  Who made those changes?  Archie?  Rob?  Someone else in Rob’s ear?  We’ll never know unless someone asks Rob.  Either way, he only had one good shooting year from three prior to the change.  

[cappymo14]

So listen, looking ahead a bit, MSU is without Langford and just lost Ward. That team as it sits, I would not say is better than the Purdue team we just held under 50. Could we see a strong finish?


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[Bailey7878]

I’m sorry but I don’t think Archie has what it takes.
Hats off to Romeo for playing a tough game . Being sick is so hard.
 
 
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The defense was good but i dont see the shooters coming in next year to improve this pathetic offense much.

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[cbp4iu]

2 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

I completely agree with the tourney being about guards. However, you don’t see the trash basketball that is the Big Ten basketball. You won’t see Edwards being able to grab a player with both hands to stop him from cutting. You won’t see Haarms grabbing or bumping cutters without a foul. What the Big Ten allows and what is allowed in the tourney are night and day.

I applaud the Big Ten for not having as many programs caught up in the scandal (that won’t result in much) but they get a big fat F in the style of basketball.

I love IU and college basketball but if I’m a top player that could go anywhere I’d find it tough to play in the Big Ten. It’s just not a modern day version of basketball.

I would love for IU to have the reputation of a Michigan, Wiscy, MSU, or pu where the refs just stop calling fouls. It happens almost every game. pu had 5 fouls in the first five minutes and then they just suddenly stopped fouling even though zromeo was still being held, Morgan was being bodied, and our other guards were getting hacked.

Their big hit Romeo’s arm and body before getting the ball. That’s a foul almost every time in a different league. In the Big Ten, that’s a big moving his feet so well and getting a hand on the ball.

Freedom of movement isn’t allowed in the Big Ten and it’s a detriment to the league.


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I do think the bump and grinding of the Big Ten drains teams in the tourney. Also if the Big Ten Tourney was at the normal time last season Michigan wouldn’t have done as well. I think the Big Ten tourney and season grind is so brutal. 

[MikeRoberts]

Hard fought loss. Our offense is still pitiful but loved the fight and effort.


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[schoosier]

4 minutes ago, cchuntsman said:

I didn’t see any mention of clock management and a foul to give in your post. You must have said that in a previous one.  I only noticed this...

 

”We shoot like s—t from 3 and everyone beats us knowing that. They double team our bigs, Romeo gets picked up by every other defender on the court while usually being fouled. This game is much different in that the scenario to win was still there against Purdue. I believe a top level coach wins it in those scenarios.“

Keep looking back it’s there. This post was mentioned to show how teams normally go about beating us without last minute coaching to save us a win. We bought fools gold with close wins like Butler. But even looking back on that one, Rob bailed us out of a horrible play call where the ball had been in Greens hands. Others in my estimation would be Iowa and Ohio St games where a better coach gets it done. Of course just my opinion and I like Archie. I just don’t like his coaching this year.

[cchuntsman]

1 minute ago, schoosier said:

Keep looking back it’s there. This post was mentioned to show how teams normally go about beating us without last minute coaching to save us a win. We bought fools gold with close wins like Butler. But even looking back on that one, Rob bailed us out of a horrible play call where the ball had been in Greens hands. Others in my estimation would be Iowa and Ohio St games where a better coach gets it done. Of course just my opinion and I like Archie. I just don’t like his coaching this year.

Gotcha.  It’s definitely not been Archie’s best year.  I still love his potential.  It’ll be interesting to see what he does to overhaul the roster this offseason.  

[mdn82]

I think we can all agree Rob’s shooting motion changed drastically between his junior and senior seasons.  Who made those changes?  Archie?  Rob?  Someone else in Rob’s ear?  We’ll never know unless someone asks Rob.  Either way, he only had one good shooting year from three prior to the change.  

He didn’t do it during warmups. That much I can tell you. I highly doubt any coach will tell you to fall away on a jump shot.

 

 

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[schoosier]

3 minutes ago, mdn82 said:

He didn’t do it during warmups. That much I can tell you. I highly doubt any coach will tell you to fall away on a jump shot.

 

 

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Unless you play for Purdue lol.

[Old Friend]

6 hours ago, Str8Hoosiers said:

I get wanting to change it up, but that lineup scares me... there is 1 ball handler, nobody to initiate offense.

In my opinion you have to have Green or Durham in there for either Thompson or Davis.. (or Langford).

I would like to see Morgan, Davis, Green, Durham, & Thompson even... or go 3 guards with Phinisee starting over Race, not sure Race is ready to be a starter yet.

 

Who is killing Archie? What are the saying? Same things we and others have been saying or something new?

I chose that lineup thinking Romeo was the second ball handler.  I'm done with Green.  Durham as the ball handler on the bench, and I completely agree he needs major minutes.  Thompson solely because of the effort he showed Saturday.  He's not ready, but we lost 10 of 11 without him starting, and "major changes" were suggested and needed.   That was my thinking.

The point was made by both Kent Sterling and JMV that IU is not getting the most from its players.  They (and Dakich )hate the athlete bill of rights because it gives athletes a cushion and no real accountability.  Sterling (whose son played AAU locally and in college somewhere) said - and I agree with this - Archie basically runs a screen and roll offense like many teams, but with no shooters to space the floor, that offense is a horrible fit for this team.   He said IU's players have either not bought in to his system or he isn't communicating well with them.  He said he has so far seen Archie recruit a collection of talent, but not yet build a team that can play within his system....or his system is so flawed, there's no chance for success (I'm paraphrasing).   He said someone on a national show said Archie needs to feel his way into the job; and he called BS.  Archie is being paid over $3 million to KNOW the job.  Nobody is paid that kind of money to learn on the job; and if he can't do the job; pack his bags. 

JMV said he thinks Archie is the one who's soft and that IU looks like a junior high team offensively.    

I'm in the car a lot.

[cchuntsman]

7 minutes ago, mdn82 said:

He didn’t do it during warmups. That much I can tell you. I highly doubt any coach will tell you to fall away on a jump shot.

 

 

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Agreed.  That’s why I’d love to know why the change occurred and who thought it was a good idea.  

[DChoosier]

“JMV said he thinks Archie is the one who's soft and that IU looks like a junior high team offensively.”

 

Pretty classless for JMV to insult junior high school teams like that.  

[Old Friend]

I'm not going to get into this game other than to mention Indiana has given up 55 and 48 points on its home floor...and lost both games.

I love defense as much as the next guy, but it's ugly and if you try to win with defense, you leave no margin for error.    We just made 15 FG's in a college basketball game; and in that same game....we had 17 turnovers.  How in the holy hell do you have in ANY game more TO's than FG's???    That's coaching on some level.  

I would like to see at least 2 changes in the assistant coach chairs for next season; and if I were Archie, I'd study the best offenses in the last 2 decades; the best secondary breaks; and I would go get at least 2 shooters regardless of how I had to get them.  And I would punt Green to the curb as fast as I could.

[Old Friend]

27 minutes ago, cchuntsman said:

I think we can all agree Rob’s shooting motion changed drastically between his junior and senior seasons.  Who made those changes?  Archie?  Rob?  Someone else in Rob’s ear?  We’ll never know unless someone asks Rob.  Either way, he only had one good shooting year from three prior to the change.  

37% from there isn't bad.  It's over 1 point per shot, which has become the acceptable standard.   His sophomore year, he got a ton of great looks he didn't get last season; but he made ~ 3 per game.   How much would that help us now?  Hell, even the threat of it would help.

[Magnanimous]

4 minutes ago, Iugradman said:

It is clear most of the trustees and academic higher-ups at IU don’t care about athletics but losing 8 of 9 in basketball and two straight Bucket games to Purdue has to create some grumbling, right? Is there any school pride?

Why do you expect sweeping changes to occur in the middle of the season?

[ElectricBoogaloo]

53 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

I mean, if you’re a lottery pick would you want to play in the Big Ten? Romeo just spent a few hours having Eastern draped all over him getting called for a foul once for every 5 committed. You don’t get that in other conferences like this.

How do you go to cut and get two hands pulling on you from the defender but nothing gets called? That’s good, hard Big Ten defense. I’m sick of this horseshit conference and what they consider basketball. How does Romeo get an elbow to the face on a non basketball play and they don’t even think about looking at it?!


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The Big Ten has been godawful to watch this year. Too many sub-60 point final scores due to “tough” defense. 

[MikeRoberts]

I'm not going to get into this game other than to mention Indiana has given up 55 and 48 points on its home floor...and lost both games.
I love defense as much as the next guy, but it's ugly and if you try to win with defense, you leave no margin for error.    We just made 15 FG's in a college basketball game; and in that same game....we had 17 turnovers.  How in the holy hell do you have in ANY game more TO's than FG's???    That's coaching on some level.  
I would like to see at least 2 changes in the assistant coach chairs for next season; and if I were Archie, I'd study the best offenses in the last 2 decades; the best secondary breaks; and I would go get at least 2 shooters regardless of how I had to get them.  And I would punt Green to the curb as fast as I could.

I almost want to like this sans the last comment. I really don’t think Green is our problem. I want guys that are confident, cocky, want the ball in their hands at key times. There aren’t many on this team


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[Old Friend]

1 minute ago, MikeRoberts said:

I almost want to like this sans the last comment. I really don’t think Green is our problem. I want guys that are confident, cocky, want the ball in their hands at key times. There aren’t many on this team


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I don't expect anyone to agree with me about him.  I'm venting, really,  I just hate the way he plays.  1-7 from the floor tonight w 3 turnovers; and it's not as though that's an uncommon stat line for him.  He's is - to me - un-necessarily cocky.  His shot selection is awful; I think he's careless and fundamentally bad.   

I'm just done with him.   I've seen 3 year's worth of him.  He is not "our problem" as I see it, but I think he is "a problem," and he doesn't help us win.   Cocky is one thing.  Dumb and situationally unaware is another.  The best team mates don't try to do things they can't do.  He tries to "make plays" all the time, and he's just not that great at it.

My dislike for him as a player is a me thing.  I just didn't see anything tonight that changed my mind and I thought he took - again - some ill advised shots for him.    

[MikeRoberts]

I don't expect anyone to agree with me about him.  I'm venting, really,  I just hate the way he plays.  1-7 from the floor tonight w 3 turnovers; and it's not as though that's an uncommon stat line for him.  He's is - to me - un-necessarily cocky.  His shot selection is awful; I think he's careless and fundamentally bad.   
I'm just done with him.   I've seen 3 year's worth of him.  He is not "our problem" as I see it, but I think he is "a problem," and he doesn't help us win.   Cocky is one thing.  Dumb and situationally unaware is another.  The best team mates don't try to do things they can't do.  He tries to "make plays" all the time, and he's just not that great at it.
My dislike for him as a player is a me thing.  I just didn't see anything tonight that changed my mind and I thought he took - again - some ill advised shots for him.    

Green for you, Smith for me. I think more often than not Smith is slow, lazy, soft and lost. At some point potential and athleticism is pointless


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