TOM CREAN FIRED

[pumpfake]

3 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

.....The bar has been lowered......  And I find that so incredibly sad.   

No further proof than listening to Crean on the post game radio show - on and on about being proud of how hard we "battled".  The only phrase I could think of was "loser's lament" - top drawer coaches and teams aren't proud after a loss unless it's under some extreme circumstance.  IMO, we should thank Tom Crean for reviving the program and running a clean program and move on to the next phase of rebuilding the program with someone who can actually take us there.  Nine years has been a long time and more than enough to have fully restored the luster, but it just has not been achieved.

[WayneFleekHoosier]

I hate to admit it. I'm not sure you can be clean and elite.

Just the nature of 1 n done era.

We're doomed.


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[brandct]

We are 8-0 against the RPI 150+ and 3-6 against the RPI Top 150

 

Just looking at this is that an NCAA Tournament Resume  *Note they have not added in the Maryland Loss here but they did in the rest so from RPI Top 50 and down add 1 loss

[HoosierAloha]

We are 8-0 against the RPI 150+ and 3-6 against the RPI Top 150

 

Just looking at this is that an NCAA Tournament Resume  *Note they have not added in the Maryland Loss here but they did in the rest so from RPI Top 50 and down add 1 loss

The KU and UNC wins still boost us as a tourney team but things are going south quickly. If the trend continues we're looking at an NIT invite, at best.

[Trish]

NIT invite could be the be the best thing to happen, if you know what I mean ;)


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[KB0]

7 hours ago, pumpfake said:

No further proof than listening to Crean on the post game radio show - on and on about being proud of how hard we "battled".  The only phrase I could think of was "loser's lament" - top drawer coaches and teams aren't proud after a loss unless it's under some extreme circumstance.  IMO, we should thank Tom Crean for reviving the program and running a clean program and move on to the next phase of rebuilding the program with someone who can actually take us there.  Nine years has been a long time and more than enough to have fully restored the luster, but it just has not been achieved.

I don't like Crean as much as the next guy, but this simply isn't true. You hear coaches talk all the time about how well their team played and lost. Maybe that's not what they tell the team privately, but you hear it in the media a good deal.

Last night's loss on it's own, isn't that bad. On the road against a pretty good Big Ten team with a veteran guard. Unfortunately, that result isn't an independent result. That's four losses in the last five games. I was a little more reserved on the expectations for this team than most, but it's been rough to watch this year. Not just the losing, but how the team is losing. I don't expect a change now or at the end of the season. Last year bought Tom some more time from Fred.

Hopefully things turn around before the end of the season, there's still time, but I'm not optimistic. Not optimistic about next year either, when you look at returning players and incoming recruits. 

Sigh.

[Alford Bailey]

6 hours ago, brandct said:

We are 8-0 against the RPI 150+ and 3-6 against the RPI Top 150

 

Just looking at this is that an NCAA Tournament Resume  *Note they have not added in the Maryland Loss here but they did in the rest so from RPI Top 50 and down add 1 loss

Looking at the schedule I see at least 5 more losses. Maybe more.

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Maryland is 15-2 and IU 11-6.

Similar talent. We might have more.


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[reconmkd]

25 minutes ago, KB0 said:

Hopefully things turn around before the end of the season, there's still time, but I'm not optimistic. Not optimistic about next year either, when you look at returning players and incoming recruits. 

Sigh.

At the current rate, I think we end up retaining some of the players that we expected to lose or they go undrafted like Yogi and Troy. Any NBA scout can clearly see that TB is more than just a "project" big man. He is showing some serious issues in his game this year! I kind of agree with an earlier post that Yogi was a big reason for TB's success last year. He was fed under the basket setting up little room for error. This year he gets the ball at the 3pt line or he is posting 10 feet away from the basket. WTH is up with that? When you are 6'9" or bigger, putting the ball on the floor that far out leaves WAY too much time for someone to get in their and take it away. But that seems to be Crean's MO, not really sure why but its obvious that it doesn't work and sets up whoever plays the post for failure. OG, I have no clue what's going on there. Someone needs to be in his ear, berating him to play like that last play for the whole game. At the Illinois game, OG would appear then disappear in a flash. My dad rarely watches games anymore, but went to the game with me, kept saying what's wrong with OG? I still believe he has the chance to go to the big leagues, but if he keeps the disappearing act up, his stock will continue to drop.

I'm still trying to figure out why this team seems like they are not getting the message. Is it because of Crean's good guy mentality, his lack of punishment for poor play, his coddling of the players,  his lack of X&O coaching in game, or something else? As emotional as some of the players can be, example: Rojo falling to the floor last night pounding the floor after that miss, how are they not improving? They have been playing ball for a majority of their lives, they know what works and what doesn't. Is there such a lack of leadership, that no one knows how to step up or are they afraid of stepping up?

As a life long fan, they are making it harder and harder to watch. After last night, no more late games for me. It has become not worth fighting the sandman at work and drinking 2 pots of coffee.

[brandct]

7 hours ago, HoosierAloha said:

The KU and UNC wins still boost us as a tourney team but things are going south quickly. If the trend continues we're looking at an NIT invite, at best.

Those wins do boost our resume, but I think the more important thing that gets us in over some other schools is the crowd IU brings. You give that resume to any other program that does not travel like IU they are a bubble team with work to do.

[ziggyiu]

It's sad that some IU fans are talking about what could boost the team into the tourney. That should never be the goal or a relief or even part of the discussion. If IU barely makes it into the tourney again and gets bounced in their first or second game, that's not progress. That's not success. That's the sign of a stagnant program. 

P. S. I'm not calling those fans out in anyway. It's just my observation of the state of the program and what that lends fans to talk about. If IU were more successful we'd talk realistically about titles, for example. 

[JSHoosier]

9 hours ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

I hate to admit it. I'm not sure you can be clean and elite.

Just the nature of 1 n done era.

We're doomed.


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Eh, let's be real here; with recruiting the way it is, there really is no such thing as 'clean'.  Just varying degrees of dirty, some are a little dusty while others are completely covered in sewage (pUKe).

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Eh, let's be real here; with recruiting the way it is, there really is no such thing as 'clean'.  Just varying degrees of dirty, some are a little dusty while others are completely covered in sewage (pUKe).

Yeah. With Crean, I've always known we need to "out-talent" or "out-heart" teams.

Hence my recruiting worries for 3 or 4 years. Crean can field teams like we've seen, which is good to moderate success. Not able to recruit at a level to dominate consistently.


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[JSHoosier]

7 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Yeah. With Crean, I've always known we need to "out-talent" or "out-heart" teams.

Hence my recruiting worries for 3 or 4 years. Crean can field teams like we've seen, which is good to moderate success. Not able to recruit at a level to dominate consistently.


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It's why I think he's a better fit at a mid-major.  He can go after the kids he thinks are under the radar and develop them over 3-4 years, without the pressure to win at a high level consistently like there is (and should be) at an IU.

Or an average SEC school that would be happy as long as he doesn't crap the bed regularly.  Which he wouldn't do, he may look incompetent almost as often as he looks like a good coach but in general he's good enough to not suck year in and year out.

[WayneFleekHoosier]

It's why I think he's a better fit at a mid-major.  He can go after the kids he thinks are under the radar and develop them over 3-4 years, without the pressure to win at a high level consistently like there is (and should be) at an IU.

Or an average SEC school that would be happy as long as he doesn't crap the bed regularly.  Which he wouldn't do, he may look incompetent almost as often as he looks like a good coach but in general he's good enough to not suck year in and year out.

Agree. His recruiting knack would be perfect for a mid major program, or low major.


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[Dalton26]

Name the rosters that are on par with IU in the B1G...?

Wiscy, maybe pu?

Name the coaches that are better than Crean..?

.....

It's painfully obvious where the problem lies with the program.

Dakich even said something similar about our roster. Something along the lines of top 5 or 10 talent.

[lucel15]

I don't really criticize the hoosiers basketball team a lot, because I am not really a devoted basketball fan. However after watching most of the games this season..... Crean needs to have a fire lit now. Same goes for the kids.

Also is it me or did Pagano and Crean go to the same "rainbows and lollipop" convention this summer and last? Like say it how it is.... Stop with the im proud of these players and what they've done......


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[Brass Cannon]

9 minutes ago, lucel15 said:

I don't really criticize the hoosiers basketball team a lot, because I am not really a devoted basketball fan. However after watching most of the games this season..... Crean needs to have a fire lit now. Same goes for the kids.

Also is it me or did Pagano and Crean go to the same "rainbows and lollipop" convention this summer and last? Like say it how it is.... Stop with the im proud of these players and what they've done......


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I do not want a fire lit. I don't want some "miracle" sweet sixteen run saving his job. 

[HoosierAloha]

Dakich even said something similar about our roster. Something along the lines of top 5 or 10 talent.

It's baffling that we're underperforming that much. It feels like we're heading in the 2013-2014 direction again. That team had 3 McAA and missed the tourney. This one only has 2 and we could easily fall flat.

If I were to put Crean in a "tier" of B1G coaches it'd be near the bottom.

Leader - Izzo
Great - Matta, Beilein, Gard (need more time)
Solid - Painter, Turgeon, Miles, Collins, Crean, Chambers, Franimal
Turrble - Little Rick, Groce

[lucel15]

I do not want a fire lit. I don't want some "miracle" sweet sixteen run saving his job. 

Lol touché haha


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