IU vs Uof6 Game Thread

[Cookie 0]

I think a red shirt is very likely for Jerome.

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[Southside 1,914]

11 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

And 3 years no matter what to judge a coach doesn’t lack context?

3 years is a common sense metric which most would agree is a reasonable time to install a completely new system, recruit players for that system, and develop leadership.

I provided data points showing the names you listed were not good comparative examples. Please feel free to provide examples of coaches coming from a lower division/team (like Dayton), who install a completely new style, who inherited a team low on talent, and was sub .500 in their conference the year before... and then experienced early success like the names you mentioned. I'm sure there are a few, but I'd bet there aren't many.... which would put them as the exception, not a common sense metric or expectation. 

[theriverpilot 5,593]

I’m happy with the hard fought win, but on to a more important note... What did everyone think of Fox using the John Tesh NBA on NBC music? It felt a little weird with college basketball, but I’ll be damned if that’s not the best TV sports theme music of all time.


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I’ll agree it was a little weird hearing that theme too but I’ll have to vote the MNF theme as the best sports theme of all time


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[Brass Cannon 24,502]

3 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

3 years is a common sense metric which most would agree is a reasonable time to install a completely new system, recruit players for that system, and develop leadership.

I provided data points showing the names you listed were not good comparative examples. Please feel free to provide examples of coaches coming from a lower division/team (like Dayton), who install a completely new style, who inherited a team low on talent, and was sub .500 in their conference the year before... and then experienced early success like the names you mentioned. I'm sure there are a few, but I'd bet there aren't many.... which would put them as the exception, not a common sense metric or expectation. 

Common sense so no actual evidence? 

Of course people being successful in year 2 is the exception. Successful coaches are the exception in general. 

[MoyeNeeded 3,073]

2 hours ago, Brass Cannon said:

Quad 1 win today if University 6 can stay where they are at 

I think they may. Already looking like a good win with UofL victories over Mich St and Seton Hall on the road.

[Bailey7878 2,506]

Assuming Romeo leaves, I see no reason to believe next year’s team will be much better, even with Brooks. They’ll be very young again, and I’m pretty much writing off Hunter, Anderson, Forrester, and Thompson getting any real chance to develop on the court this year, especially as conference play picks up. 
I think year four is when both his system and players should be implemented to the point he can reasonably be expected to compete for a deep tourney run. 

The crean rule is you cannot be judged til year 4.

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[Southside 1,914]

6 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Common sense so no actual evidence? 

Of course people being successful in year 2 is the exception. Successful coaches are the exception in general. 

Now you're just being obtuse. 

if you believe people being successful in year 2 is the exception, then why this:

 

Quote

 

Ok seriously I have heard this since Crean and have never accepted it as a solid rule  yes you should see something by year 3  but there are tons of reasons why it shouldn’t take that long

Didnt apply to Pitino, Cal, Sean Miller, Pitino again, Holtmann,  Mack 

 

if there are tons of reasons why it shouldn't take 3 years, what are the reasons? And how do you believe that, while also believing success in two years is the exception. you're not making a whole lot of sense.

[Hardwood83 4,763]

7 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

3 years is a common sense metric which most would agree is a reasonable time to install a completely new system, recruit players for that system, and develop leadership.

I provided data points showing the names you listed were not good comparative examples. Please feel free to provide examples of coaches coming from a lower division/team (like Dayton), who install a completely new style, who inherited a team low on talent, and was sub .500 in their conference the year before... and then experienced early success like the names you mentioned. I'm sure there are a few, but I'd bet there aren't many.... which would put them as the exception, not a common sense metric or expectation. 

You make some fair points. I'm certainly not calling for Miller's job and agree some time is needed to fully evaluate him.....but it's not unreasonable to expect noticeable progress either. Last season's team was definitely flawed, but improved as the year went on with Freddie McSwain as the starting center....... This year's team is more talented and, with exception of Marquette, hasn't played like it. There have been injuries for sure, so let's hope as that improves so does IU's on court product. I really hope Archie doesn't excel as the under-dog but struggles with high expectations. Not saying that is the case, but man I hate that. I want consistency at a high level, as it should be at IU. 

 

[Brass Cannon 24,502]

3 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

Now you're just being obtuse. 

if you believe people being successful in year 2 is the exception, then why this:

 

if there are tons of reasons why it shouldn't take 3 years, what are the reasons? And how do you believe that, while also believing success in two years is the exception. you're not making a whole lot of sense.

We have 2 all big ten caliber players. That’s a great reason to be successful in year 2. 

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

We have 2 all big ten caliber players. That’s a great reason to be successful in year 2. 

Well, so far so good. Sit back, relax, and see you in March.


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[Southside 1,914]

8 minutes ago, Hardwood83 said:

You make some fair points. I'm certainly not calling for Miller's job and agree some time is needed to fully evaluate him.....but it's not unreasonable to expect noticeable progress either. Last season's team was definitely flawed, but improved as the year went on with Freddie McSwain as the starting center....... This year's team is more talented and, with exception of Marquette, hasn't played like it. There have been injuries for sure, so let's hope as that improves so does IU's on court product. I really hope Archie doesn't excel as the under-dog but struggles with high expectations. Not saying that is the case, but man I hate that. I want consistency at a high level, as it should be at IU. 

 

I agree with all of this. I'm definitely not sold on Archie yet by any means. Given the situation though with injuries and playing 2 frosh (especially Phin at PG), I can understand our current status. I really don't expect consistency though until mid season to be honest. 

[Brass Cannon 24,502]

1 minute ago, Walking Boot of Doom said:

Well, so far so good. Sit back, relax, and see you in March.


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Agreed.  But I think we all know we are going to have to play better to be truly successful in the Big Ten 

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

Agreed.  But I think we all know we are going to have to play better to be truly successful in the Big Ten 

Yes. Today was a nice step forward.


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[Brass Cannon 24,502]

Just now, Walking Boot of Doom said:

Yes. Today was a nice step forward.


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Yep no truly bad performances from any of the starters. Al could have shot better but was contributing other ways. 

We still need to work on shooting of all kinds. But great to see the turnovers down. 

[Southside 1,914]

19 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

We have 2 all big ten caliber players. That’s a great reason to be successful in year 2. 

lol... so no comment on your conflicting posts/logic. or examples of coaches like Archie taking over teams like IU and having comparable seasons to the names you listed?

for the record, we are successful so far. we're 2-0 in conf play, with 2 solid out of conference wins. our losses are to a top 3 team, and on the road and injured to a team that has lost two games by a total of 3 pts.

Edited December 9, 2018 by Irish YJ

[Brass Cannon 24,502]

3 minutes ago, Irish YJ said:

lol... so no comment on your conflicting posts/logic. or examples of coaches like Archie taking over teams like IU and having comparable seasons to the names you listed?

for the record, we are successful so far. we're 2-0 in conf play, with 2 solid out of conference wins. our losses are to a top 3 team, and on the road and injured to a team that has lost two games by a total of 3 pts.

You are the one that made a baseless claim that it’s not fair to judge till year 3. 

The fact you made a laundry list of excuses for why those coaches were successful in years 1 or 2 doesn’t prove a dang thing. 

Tons of coaches are able to step in and instill their system within a year. Crean has his system in place by year 2. It was a crap system but it was in place. 

[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,205]

Justin Smith was better but not as good as he needs to be.


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I agree. Hopefully he builds on it. We will see.

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[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,205]

What in the world is wrong with Race Thompson? Can’t possibly be concussion symptoms still, can it? Not having him and Jerome Hunter is killing this teams potential.

Concussion symptoms can last awhile. Many posts on this forum have explained this.

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[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,205]

you beat me to it
half the post on this board would make you think we're 2-8, not 8-2. 
IMO, the team is still gelling. And we're not close to the final product on O. 

It seems the only time some on here post in game threads is to highlight negative plays.

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[Alford Bailey 12,373]

3 hours ago, Schreckbagger said:

Smith 9 Pts, 9 Reb, 0 TO's.....

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And a helluva drive and dunk!