Weak Indiana HS Senior Class

[mdn82 25,767]

I would be pissed if we were continually in Chicago. Talent? Absolutely. Dirtier than normal? Absolutely. We don't have the type of coach who could play that game. One of the few things I am happy with.

[FindEndNow 198]

I would be pissed if we were continually in Chicago. Talent? Absolutely. Dirtier than normal? Absolutely. We don't have the type of coach who could play that game. One of the few things I am happy with.

So Coach K and Bill Self are dirty? Cali, Texas, Illinois, Indiana and Georgia are the most talent rich states. But we decide for no reason to not go to Chicago even though it is just a few hours away. If we were in Chicago no one would be calling it dirty. Fact is we don't have a staff that could pull in that talent.

[mdn82 25,767]

So Coach K and Bill Self are dirty? Cali, Texas, Illinois, Indiana and Georgia are the most talent rich states. But we decide for no reason to not go to Chicago even though it is just a few hours away. If we were in Chicago no one would be calling it dirty. Fact is we don't have a staff that could pull in that talent.

Lol @ "no reason not to go". There is an obvious reason. You just ignore it. Coach K has done a great job at getting players who have been clean and leaned Duke from the outset. Both of those players. Glad we don't have a staff that goes after the typical Chicago player. I understand you are too young to remember or fully understand what going after that type of player did to our program. It's not always just about talent. Actually it very rarely is. Can't believe you actually brought up Self to enhance your argument after what Alexander did to their team last year.

[mdn82 25,767]

Talent is not our issue. It's what we do with it that is.

[FindEndNow 198]

Lol @ "no reason not to go". There is an obvious reason. You just ignore it. Coach K has done a great job at getting players who have been clean and leaned Duke from the outset. Both of those players. Glad we don't have a staff that goes after the typical Chicago player. I understand you are too young to remember or fully understand what going after that type of player did to our program. It's not always just about talent. Actually it very rarely is. Can't believe you actually brought up Self to enhance your argument after what Alexander did to their team last year.

Alexander is one player and that was his parents.

[KingPG21 6,587]

So Coach K and Bill Self are dirty? Cali, Texas, Illinois, Indiana and Georgia are the most talent rich states. But we decide for no reason to not go to Chicago even though it is just a few hours away. If we were in Chicago no one would be calling it dirty. Fact is we don't have a staff that could pull in that talent.

..... Yep. Not really much question that Self is dirty, look at all the players in recent years that have been ruled ineligible, or have had giant question marks but luckily left early (Wiggins). Every coach is dirty, coach K is no different.

 

Also, I second MDN, it is hilarious that you said there is no reason to not go to Chicago. There have been a number of kids from that area that have had questionable recruitments

[FindEndNow 198]

..... Yep. Not really much question that Self is dirty, look at all the players in recent years that have been ruled ineligible, or have had giant question marks but luckily left early (Wiggins). Every coach is dirty, coach K is no different.

Also, I second MDN, it is hilarious that you said there is no reason to not go to Chicago. There have been a number of kids from that area that have had questionable recruitments

I don't remember Wiggins having any questions. I would have loved to have a talent like Wiggins.

[FindEndNow 198]

..... Yep. Not really much question that Self is dirty, look at all the players in recent years that have been ruled ineligible, or have had giant question marks but luckily left early (Wiggins). Every coach is dirty, coach K is no different.

Also, I second MDN, it is hilarious that you said there is no reason to not go to Chicago. There have been a number of kids from that area that have had questionable recruitments

There can be questionable recruitments anywhere you go. Trey Lyles, Caleb Swanigan and Eric Gordon. Guess we should stop recruiting Indiana.

[KingPG21 6,587]

There can be questionable recruitments anywhere you go. Trey Lyles, Caleb Swanigan and Eric Gordon. Guess we should stop recruiting Indiana.

Yep. Point flew over you're head apparently. Point was Chicago is considered much worse than the majority of the country.

 

So do you just come here to argue with everyone........ because that is what it seems like

[Stuhoo 85,198]

I don't remember Wiggins having any questions. I would have loved to have a talent like Wiggins.

 

I'll tell you what my question is for players like Wiggins: Do they have any interest whatsoever in working toward a college degree and investing themselves in Indiana University?

 

If they don't...no thanks for me. Because of this quirk in my fandom, I ended up not being a huge fan of Noah V. I'll take Juwan Morgan over him.

 

Give me the four stars that will work toward a degree, dammit!

[mdn82 25,767]

There can be questionable recruitments anywhere you go. Trey Lyles, Caleb Swanigan and Eric Gordon. Guess we should stop recruiting Indiana.

You hand picked 3 of the 4 dirtiest recruitments in this state in the last 25 years. I guess an outlier makes it so huh? Ask anyone outside of Indiana the dirtiest city in AAU or just recruiting and let us know if you come up with any single city beyond Chicago as #1 young blood. Been that way for over 20 years. Glad to see they are putting out players beyond Rose or Richmond.

[mdn82 25,767]

Alexander is one player and that was his parents.

Its always someone else. That's the problem with Chicago!!!!

[FindEndNow 198]

You hand picked 3 of the 4 dirtiest recruitments in this state in the last 25 years. I guess an outlier makes it so huh? Ask anyone outside of Indiana the dirtiest city in AAU or just recruiting and let us know if you come up with any single city beyond Chicago as #1 young blood. Been that way for over 20 years. Glad to see they are putting out players beyond Rose or Richmond.

Well it doesn't seem to be hurting either of those 3 with winning by recruiting the way they do. I don't see Indiana doing anything special.

[mdn82 25,767]

Well it doesn't seem to be hurting either of those 3 with winning by recruiting the way they do. I don't see Indiana doing anything special.

I guess if vacating wins, seasons, or games for players is ok then you are right. You will just happen to be in the minority on this one. Funny thing is the people arguing with you on this do not like Crean as a coach but sure you already knew that. Keep fighting the good fight.

[FindEndNow 198]

I guess if vacating wins, seasons, or games for players is ok then you are right. You will just happen to be in the minority on this one. Funny thing is the people arguing with you on this do not like Crean as a coach but sure you already knew that.

I don't like him as a coach. I don't think he's cut out to be a head coach period.

[BGleas 8,220]

I'm kind of in the middle on this topic, I think you need a mix, though I do think a little more focus could be put on Indiana/midwest. I wish IU had a recruiter on staff that had a specialty in recruiting the Midwest. Similar to Kenny Johnson in the DMV and now Chuck Martin in NY.

But, it's not like Crean hasn't recruited Indiana, he's just a lot of times mis-recruited Indiana. Hulls, Zeller and Yogi were no-brainers, but between Ethrington, Hollowell, Patterson and Devin Davis, we've really gotten several of the wrong guys.

We've not gotten guys like Gary Harris, Zak Irvin, McIntosh or Dunnham. I would take those four over the aforementioned four any day of the week. To GoColts point, who wouldn't take Zak Irvine over Stanford Robinson at this point? We needed a guard and Irvin was right there. Yes, Kenny Johnson's bread and butter was the DMV, where is our guy who's bread and butter is the Midwest?

I'm not saying abandon other parts of the country, I'll take Thomas Bryant every day of the week, but our Midwest recruiting needs to be way better. We're losing guys from this area to Louisville, MSU, OSU, Kentucky, Michigan, etc. and all those schools are beating us on the court too. It's not a coincidence.

[Old Friend 8,513]

Not giving a damn is not a trait endemic in East Coast kids.

Where was Hollowell from? Hanner?

And is Vonleh really the best example of not giving a damn? The kid was a double double machine and fought hard in the post. He gave up on the team at the very end of a disappointing season to protect his draft stock. I don't respect him for that, but he fought during the offseason (put on 25 pounds of muscle during the summer) and during the season.

Hanner was not from Indiana.  He's from Columbia and went to high school in North Carolina before transferring to La Lumiere his senior year.    If you're going to make an argument, don't use that example.  Vonleh quit on his team and "led" Indiana to a 17-15 season during which they missed the post season.   He quit.  He didn't fight that hard....he did most of what he did on talent alone.   He was all about Noah Vonleh and getting to the NBA.   He couldn't have cared less about Indiana, and all you need to know was what he did late in that season.  You're talking about a McD'd all american who played with an all-american point guard and two experienced seniors.   And missed the post season.   Vonleh's not a good example, either.  (He is a good one for my point, however.  You'll never sell me on his ever caring about Indiana University or understanding where he was.  He saw Zeller become the 4th pick and decided he'd like to do that, too.    And we laugh at Kentucky all the time because that's their M.O.)   I said before his freshman year that Hollowell was a lazy player who didn't work

hard.   I talked with his coaches, saw him play 10+ times, and he was another kid who did what he did based on physical ability for the most part.   He's not the kind of kid Indiana needs any more than Stanford Robinson was.

 

East coast kids don't understand the culture at Indiana any more than kids from here would understand the culture at St. John's.   You and anyone else can spin it however you'd like.   But....the fact remains that the formula of recruiting kids from all over the place while not placing the highest priority on local kids who understand the culture and the program has failed for 15+ years.     Look at Wisconsin.  Look at Michigan State.  Look at Ohio State.   Check out their rosters.  They are the barometer in the Big Ten right now and have been for many years.   Tell me what you see.   (Or I'll do it for you...80% - 90% or more of the kids on those rosters are from their schools' immediate area, meaning their states or surrounding.  Hell, even Arizona is stacked with California kids.  I think they have one kid from New Hampshire and another from a JUCO in North Carolina.  The rest?  Local.)    Duke and Kentucky are two examples I can agree with who are generally successful every year and recruit nationally.  But...they get the top kids.  We're getting Robinson, Jurkin, Priller, April, etc.   

 

There's a formula that's proven to be successful, and I will never understand why people keep defending Crean's trying to out-think the room when you see the results he's produced.   It ain't working.

[Alford Bailey 12,809]

Its a double whammy when we dont land the top local talent but our conference rivals do.

[iubirdman 98]

Look at our recent run of instate talent we have had commit (last 4 years)

 

Sr/would be Sr

    Yogi--Arrested as a sop

    Patterson--Never Qualified

    JH--Drug issues and left (on own or asked to leave but should not be here)

   Hanner--if you want to include, DUI, issue with DD and transferred

 

Jr/would be JR

    Hartman--very pleasant surprise, by all accounts represents university in right way

    DD--multiple drug and alcohol arrests

 

Soph/Would be soph

  Lyles--committed and withdrew commitment 3 years later

  JBJ--decommitted and then stayed, seems to be good representative of the university

 

There you go the last 8 kids from Indiana to commit to IU, and only 1 from the time of the initial commitment has been incident free and not bashed on here for a decommitment or off court issue.  

 

If these are the kids that are supposed to get what it means to play for the Hoosiers we are in trouble.  Obviously Jordy and Cody got it, but I would rather have out of state kids like Vic, Moye, potentially Bryant, and others that get it and take advantage of their opportunities

[chitown hoosier 743]

Let's not forget the guys who worked hard to bring IU back like watford and sheehey. Both out of state kids who represented IU well.