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[WayneFleekHoosier]

Mangas has a skill set and size that is far more closely described as comparable to Parker Stewart, albeit at a much lower level.
Zeisloft averaged 16.3 ppg HIS SENIOR YEAR OF HIGH SCHOOL and Zeisloft’s highest collegiate ppg was 6.6.  But yes, in my opinion he is being compared to Nick Zeisloft and Duncan Robinson primarily (entirely) because of his ethnicity.
 

I made the comparison. Race isn’t a factor. Not sure why that is even in the conversation at all.

BtownQ explained the comparison well.

Most people like player comps, and I think Ziesloft is a close enough one to project impact.


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[NashvilleHoosier]

1 minute ago, btownqb said:

Did you see NZ's #s his first two years? NZ found a fit at IU. I think Mangas will have that fit here and MORE. 

Thinking he CAN have that impact or even more is fine. I don’t disagree with that. My issue is saying that is his floor. Unless we are saying that his floor is what he CAN do, but there is also a basement or even an underground bunker option to his possible production expectations. 

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Zeisloft is a 6'4/6'5.. a D1 athlete. He could hammer a basketball. 
The comparison is fairly simple to see: essentially the same height and build, they are both elite shooters, both rigleht handed, both a tick slow footed. The "same type of player" would be what we all think Mangas can be at the D1 level, which is a pretty much a guy you flat out cannot leave. Believe Mangas has more facets to his game though.. even if it's at the NAIA level. Zeisloft made a few nifty passes in his day, as well. The race of the two is completely irrelevant to me. 

Yes and thank you.


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[Hoosierfan2017]

Don't really see the Zeisloft comparison as the two play completely different games. However, if he could provide Zeisloft numbers - 7 ppg on 42+ percent from 3 in ~20 mpg - that'd be an excellent addition. 

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Zeisloft is a 6'4/6'5.. a D1 athlete. He could hammer a basketball. 
The comparison is fairly simple to see: essentially the same height and build, they are both elite shooters, both rigleht handed, both a tick slow footed. The "same type of player" would be what we all think Mangas can be at the D1 level, which is a pretty much a guy you flat out cannot leave. Believe Mangas has more facets to his game though.. even if it's at the NAIA level. Zeisloft made a few nifty passes in his day, as well. The race of the two is completely irrelevant to me. 

The other connection, is both would be transfers from a lower level of basketball.


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[WayneFleekHoosier]

Thinking he CAN have that impact or even more is fine. I don’t disagree with that. My issue is saying that is his floor. Unless we are saying that his floor is what he CAN do, but there is also a basement or even an underground bunker option to his possible production expectations. 

That’s all good. It’s my OPINION of his floor. I could be grossly wrong. But to me, it appears his skillset would translate like Zeislofts did. Same size. Similar speed. Maybe better handles. Can shoot it. Shooting translates. Again, hence the Zeisloft comp.


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[WayneFleekHoosier]

Hey—let’s suppose we’re adding a player who
1) plays with ball in his hands,
2) is a high volume scorer,
3)shoots it really well 
4) constantly gets to the rim against his current competition, and
5) turns it over quite a bit (avg 3/game)
6) is a great rebounder for his size
Who does that most describe? Zeisloft, Parker, maybe Vic? RoJo? Maybe DeVonte but a little taller?
And...I’m not underselling Zeisloft at all! Nick played in control at all times and was a great catch and shoot guy. That’s just not this guy’s game.

Would Zeisloft have done those things at Indiana Wesleyan where he would likely be their best player?

Will Mangas project to be our primary ballhandler and highest volume shooter?

Context is also important.


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[MikeRoberts]

13 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

Hey—let’s suppose we’re adding a player who

1) plays with ball in his hands,

2) is a high volume scorer,

3)shoots it really well 

4) constantly gets to the rim against his current competition, and

5) turns it over quite a bit (avg 3/game)

6) is a great rebounder for his size

Who does that most describe? Zeisloft, Parker, maybe Vic? RoJo? Maybe DeVonte but a little taller?

And...I’m not underselling Zeisloft at all! Nick played in control at all times and was a great catch and shoot guy. That’s just not this guy’s game.

A poor mans damon Bailey perhaps

[CSP]

2 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Would Zeisloft have done those things at Indiana Wesleyan where he would likely be their best player?

Will Mangas project to be our primary ballhandler and highest volume shooter?

Context is also important.


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Context is essential 

[RaceToTheTop]

18 minutes ago, Hovadipo said:

Plus...other than them both being white, where is the Zeisloft comparison coming from? Could Zeisloft even dunk? They aren’t the same type of player at all. 

I've seen the highlight videos.  I don't see D1 footspeed.  Has nothing to do with his color.  I see a player getting to the hoop due to good body control and looks like a decent leaper.  But I didn't see a guy who is going to beat D1 defenders off the dribble.  But I do see an ability to shoot plus a quick release and an ability to shoot when guarded plus an ability to create his own perimeter shot.  So his most translatable skill is being a 6'3" guard who can shoot.

Check Duncan Robinson's stats from his year at Williams College (D3).  The thing that translated from D3 to D1 was his perimeter shot.  He was a guy who was a shot blocker at the D3 level and he went became a player at the D1 (he had more blocks in 27 games at Wiliams college than he did in 115 at Michigan) level who was getting 70% of points off of threes.  At Williams College it was 40%.  

[Stuhoo]

5 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Would Zeisloft have done those things at Indiana Wesleyan where he would likely be their best player?

Will Mangas project to be our primary ballhandler and highest volume shooter?

Context is also important.


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Zeisloft never averaged 17 points a game in high school, so I doubt he would’ve been a high volume scorer in NAIA ball.

[Stuhoo]

Also, I’m not trying to infer in anyway that people are making some kind of racial judgment!

I completely agree that Zeisloft and Mangas look like each other!

It’s just that their games aren’t necessarily all that similar.

[ap2345]

At the end of the day Mangas would likely be somewhere between a Zeisloft type of player and a Stewart type of player. He wouldn't be the same kind of player at IU that he is at IWU. His role would have to change just like it will when he starts his professional career. It's the same way that Duncan Robinson's game had to change. Either way Mangas would be a great option imo if the staff really decides that they want him at IU.  

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Also, I’m not trying to infer in anyway that people are making some kind of racial judgment!
I completely agree that Zeisloft and Mangas look like each other!
It’s just that their games aren’t necessarily all that similar.

My original comment said Floor Zeisloft. I didn’t say they were the same player. I think the size, speed, shooting translates. The things Mangas does more/better may or may not translate. That was all. Then it became a race thing for absolutely no reason.


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[Bowhunter]

I see a poor mans Duncan Robinson


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[CSP]

6 minutes ago, Bowhunter said:

I see a poor mans Duncan Robinson


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Mangas worst year in college trumps Duncan's year in D3 by A LOT. 

[IU Scott]

All I have to say is if Magnas was averaging this in high school at Warsaw and had this same tape we would be all for signing him.  Over at HSN there is a huge thread about Luke Brown and there were plenty of people wanting him to go to IU.  At 6'4 and with his shooting ability I would take him any day of the week.

[8bucks]

If say we had a chance a 2 players with proven D1 success against better competition then get them instead. But Mangas presents an interesting option with little risk. 
 

At IU he probably won’t score half what he does now but he could do some damage especially since he likely won’t attract the other teams top defenders. Not to pick on our bench but I could have seen him scoring a lot against them.  
 

He seems like an upgrade over Galloway, Leal and could push Hunter for minutes. That sounds like someone we should consider unless we have a definitive starter option in someone else. 

[Stuhoo]

My best case scenario choices are Tamar Bates and Kopp.

That's realistic and would give us one hell of a deep roster.

[68Hoosier]

I don't understand the criticism of Galloway.  I loved his energy and what he brought to the team.  He is the kind of teammate I would want on my every day of the week.  I thought he was one of the brightest spots on the team last year.