IU vs OSU 2/10/19

[Alford Bailey]

NOBODY could win with the guys we are forced to play.

[Ryno6284]

Unless RMK becomes the next coach to sit in at a practice and be offered an assistant job!

[ap2345]

Just now, Ryno6284 said:

Guys, IT DOESN'T MATTER!  THIS PROGRAM IS CURSED FOR ETERNITY!

False. Curses are made to be broken just ask Boston and Chicago. The only problem is the curse of Bobby Knight doesn't seem to be getting broken any time soon.

[Bowhunter]

Not once had I ever heard we went after Marshal or Mack.
I wasn’t as big in Marshall as some. Mack was my guy if Stevens, Donovan, and Bennet turned us down. I was on the fence at the time on Bennet because his teams played slow and got beat in the tournament. Now we play slow and can’t make the tournament!


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[Ryno6284]

1 minute ago, Alford Bailey said:

NOBODY could win with the guys we are forced to play.

I think a handful of coaches could.

[ap2345]

1 minute ago, Ryno6284 said:

Unless RMK becomes the next coach to sit in at a practice and be offered an assistant job!

RMK couldn't coach in today's world. He would be arrested in about 5 minutes. 

[Ryno6284]

1 minute ago, ap2345 said:

RMK couldn't coach in today's world. He would be arrested in about 5 minutes. 

That was tongue in cheek.

[Hoosierfan2017]

21 minutes ago, Old Friend said:

I know you don't agree so I'll just answer.  We can discuss or you can disagree....doesn't matter.  There's a "why" to all of this and I'll just explain my viewpoint of it.  You can respond however you'd like.

Morgan's game had a lot more to do with his having to guard a 6'9" 270 pound guy for 25-30 seconds on every defensive possession than anything.  Well, that and our early possessions not focusing on him.  He was clearly exhausted and being tired AND being doubled on the block by at least 1 player bigger than you are is a recipe for a game like that.  Davis should have been in the game WITH Morgan more than he was.   Especially because OSU was leaving Smith basically all alone to double Morgan or at least take the post away.  So I blame Morgan's bad game on those factors.   And I blame Archie for leaving Smith out there instead of Davis or even Fitzner.  Heck, Fitzner probably makes at least ONE more 3 if left as open as Smith was.  My point is there is a "why" to Morgan's bad game and it's not "Morgan was bad."

Green was credited for 2 TO's.  He was responsible for at least 4.  Bad passes not caught are Green's turnovers, not the receiver's....regardless of what official stats say.

He took at least 3 bad shots today; one an airball early in the shot clock and at least one more than led directly to points on the other end.

Green's problems are consistent.  For 3 seasons.  Nobody is putting "all" the blame on him; but how can YOU ignore his staring down Morgan, then throwing the ball at his feet (turnover) with the game tied at 47?   Did you not see the airball?  Are you ignoring the last possession when he didn't even try to get something better than what he threw up?

Phinisee's been off since his concussion.  I have no explanation.   But here's the thing....  His A:TO ratio is still better than 2:1.  Green's is still 1:1 after 3 seasons.   I also don't get why you blame Phinisee for "not being able to get the ball inbounds?"   Tell me who he missed.  Who was he supposed to throw it to?  You're questioning everyone else for blaming Green.  How can you then blame Phinisee for that??    

Durham's game baffles me too.  

Green and Smith get 16 shots between them in 48 minutes combined.  Morgan and Durham get 9 shots between them in 64 minutes combined.  That baffles me.  Idiotic if you ask me.  Because you're right.  Green is the backup point guard.  Which means he should NOT try to do more than he's being asked to do, but he DOES try almost every game and it hasn't exactly gone well.  That's why he gets blamed.  Not like this was the first time he's made boneheaded plays or taken horrible shots which have cost his team.

I don't disagree that Green made dumb mistakes. He had some bad ones. My stance on his play today is like my stance usually was on Ramsey, since you brought him up. Not great, but not terrible either. He had some good moments to cancel out the bad.

Plus/minus isn't my favorite stat, but he had the best on the team today. Even with his mistakes, the team was better with him on the court than off. On a day where the team was all around lousy, he was less lousy than most. But with all the posts on here you'd think he was our worst player today, when that isn't the case at all. 

[DChoosier]

2 minutes ago, Alford Bailey said:

NOBODY could win with the guys we are forced to play.

I think you might be kidding but a bushel of coaches could have won with this team at home, against OSU, today.

[Brass Cannon]

3 minutes ago, Alford Bailey said:

NOBODY could win with the guys we are forced to play.

We did 2 months ago

[ap2345]

Just now, Bowhunter said:

Not once had I ever heard we went after Marshal or Mack.
I wasn’t as big in Marshall as some. Mack was my guy if Stevens, Donovan, and Bennet turned us down. I was on the fence at the time on Bennet because his teams played slow and got beat in the tournament. Now we play slow and can’t make the tournament!


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I know a lot of people put him in their second or third tier but I personally would have loved Holtman. I watch a lot of Butler games because I grew up with one of their players and the guy just knows how to win and the players like him. Not to mention he has always been pretty good at drawing up plays in big moments like we saw today. 

[ap2345]

1 minute ago, Ryno6284 said:

That was tongue in cheek.

I figured it was

[Alford Bailey]

2 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

We did 2 months ago

Barely, all the signs were there.

[Bailey7878]

Guys, IT DOESN'T MATTER!  THIS PROGRAM IS CURSED FOR ETERNITY!

I agree. Wont matter who we hire.

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[JSHoosier]

5 minutes ago, ap2345 said:

I know a lot of people put him in their second or third tier but I personally would have loved Holtman. I watch a lot of Butler games because I grew up with one of their players and the guy just knows how to win and the players like him. Not to mention he has always been pretty good at drawing up plays in big moments like we saw today. 

I wanted him more than Miller, though I really wanted to see more out of both.

[Alford Bailey]

Archie brought in three guys (Hunter, Romeo,Rob) in his first class that are players to rebuild around. The rest of these guys are junk. Including Morgan. Leftover Crean JUNK.

[Ryno6284]

3 minutes ago, Alford Bailey said:

Archie brought in three guys (Hunter, Romeo,Rob) in his first class that are players to rebuild around. The rest of these guys are junk. Including Morgan. Leftover Crean JUNK.

Coincidence we won at MSU without him? Just asking!

[Hillsdale87]

Not once had I ever heard we went after Marshal or Mack.
I wasn’t as big in Marshall as some. Mack was my guy if Stevens, Donovan, and Bennet turned us down. I was on the fence at the time on Bennet because his teams played slow and got beat in the tournament. Now we play slow and can’t make the tournament!

Mack to me is the biggest "what if". He's doing a great job at Louisville. But he also has better players. Louisville has a pretty good roster, and he is getting everything out of them. It's too soon to judge who was the better hire IMO, but we will know in a couple years. It's pretty clear that Mack was at least a good hire as he also has a great class coming in next year. Hopefully Archie turns the corner soon too

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[Old Friend]

6 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

I don't disagree that Green made dumb mistakes. He had some bad ones. My stance on his play today is like my stance usually was on Ramsey, since you brought him up. Not great, but not terrible either. He had some good moments to cancel out the bad.

Plus/minus isn't my favorite stat, but he had the best on the team today. Even with his mistakes, the team was better with him on the court than off. On a day where the team was all around lousy, he was less lousy than most. But with all the posts on here you'd think he was our worst player today, when that isn't the case at all. 

I guess I look at it this way.  We can lose with Green.  We've proven it.    Over the course of 3 seasons, he's made a whole lot of bad plays.  Costly bad plays.  He's a selfish player and plays dumb on a consistent basis.  I've seen what I need to see.  Like every player, not all of his plays are bad.  But....what he does frequently plays against the team concept, which is a pretty damaging thing long term.   He's almost never the worst player.  That goes to Fitzner, Moore, Forrester, McBob, and sometimes even Smith.  But he makes more mistakes than they do.  Costs more possessions.  And it's consistent.  To me...it's terrible.  I've coached for a long time with the belief that turnovers are very costly and bad shots are turnovers.  Even when bad shots go in, it's not a net positive.  Green costs Indiana 4-8 points every game with mistakes and bad decisions...many of them selfish.

My issue with Ramsey is limited to his inability to throw the ball downfield consistently and his sometimes poor reads on the RPO.  I have a much larger problem with Green, and I don't think either of those two players help Indiana win.

 

[Bowhunter]

Archie brought in three guys (Hunter, Romeo,Rob) in his first class that are players to rebuild around. The rest of these guys are junk. Including Morgan. Leftover Crean JUNK.

Man I’m usually with ya on this seasons dissatisfaction but Morgan is playing as an undersized center with a small forward height. I’m not blaming him. He does have his off nights, this whole team does.


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Free Jake!!