No Holt?

[jarrnoel 36]

This is one of my favorite IU teams to watch in recent memory. I'm looking forward to a great season.

[Myrmidon76 614]

Nobody is trying to diminish a win but guess what, thats what a coach will do...If I beat up a 3rd grader, I am not going to go around pretending I am Floyd Mayweather....perspective....I was simply trying to get an opinion on why the huge amount of positive info coming in about Holt before he committed and then nobody seems to be asking why he does not play in a game where obviously, if we believed the hype ( which I did), we could have used him...that's all....

 

Calling a Larry Brown coached team "nominal at best" certainly comes across as a diminishing statement. I do understand your concern, but I have no problem not allowing a freshman coming off a 4 game suspension come in and get minutes against experienced bigs that include a McDonalds All American....regardless of the hype surrounding him. To be honest, I didn't think Holt would get very many minutes just due to the fact he had logged zero minutes in the college game. Now if he doesn't log very many minutes over these next 2 games, I am right there with you in the concern department.

[CampHoosier 3,697]

So much negativity. WE WON THE GAME

 

What's negative about wondering why a guy didn't see any action. He's a Freshman just like Hoetzel but didn't see the floor against a team that was bigger down low. It's a good question as to why he didn't play. If he's behind Hoetzel in terms of defensive abilities, that's a huge issue for us down the road. 

[seanmm1971 1,437]

Chicken little...

[323SGrant 1,176]

IIRC, Hoetzel is a better outside shooter and ball handler, Holt is better inside and defensively with those long arms. Hope to see Holt in the next game.

[eljefe6 358]

I really think it was a combo of zero college experience, high pressure/expectation game and his head still being a little messed up over the accident. I'm sure we'll see him plenty in the next two.

[CampHoosier 3,697]

Now I understand the frustration behind not being able to ask a simple question on this site without getting jumped all over. Calm down guys

[Myrmidon76 614]

I will say, this actually is something worthy of discussion over emotional ramblings if we had lost! :biggrin:

[hoosierpap 14,300]

Maybe a combination of things here but I'd say, mainly, your expectations were too high.

 

I realize there was talk about him coming in and contributing "right away" (as in his first game ever I suppose you took that as) but he is a freshman who missed the summer, missed the Canada trip, missed the exhibitions, and missed the first two games. Crean was clearly not comfortable enough with Holt's experience level to place him in this level of a game. And looking at it from a "how could he have done worse" perspective isn't a perspective most CBB coaches subscribe to, imo.

 

You'll see him tomorrow and can make judgements on him then. 

[djsalway 4,161]

What's negative about wondering why a guy didn't see any action. He's a Freshman just like Hoetzel but didn't see the floor against a team that was bigger down low. It's a good question as to why he didn't play. If he's behind Hoetzel in terms of defensive abilities, that's a huge issue for us down the road. 

I meant that bk4life or whatever his name is seems to have something wrong with Hanner when he drew a couple charges and played decent defense. He's our biggest guy. Just because someone has zeroes in the box score doesn't mean they aren't deserving.

 

Nothing negative about Holt, just mainly me being concerned with the scrutiny of Hanner.

[Bk4life 190]

I meant that bk4life or whatever his name is seems to have something wrong with Hanner when he drew a couple charges and played decent defense. He's our biggest guy. Just because someone has zeroes in the box score doesn't mean they aren't deserving.

 

Nothing negative about Holt, just mainly me being concerned with the scrutiny of Hanner.

Oh, I apologize for actually scrutinizing one of our scholarship players...Excuse me for not being blind to reality...for the record, seems like a great kid who has improved over last year but also not a kid who would start on any other Big Ten team....thats just reality...Oh, I get it...this is the society we live in these days...God forbid someone is critical of someone else for any reason without being portrayed negatively....PERSPECTIVE 

[drewheck 749]

Lack of experience in a close game is my take on why he didn't get in he will get some time saturday

[Bk4life 190]

Lack of experience in a close game is my take on why he didn't get in he will get some time saturday

I agree that is probably the best explanation but when all we heard was how this kid would come in an IMMEDIATELY be able to contribute....seems like someones evaluation was a little off...that's all....I was excited to see this kid come in and wow us when we needed him and he never got off the bench...

[seanmm1971 1,437]

On a brighter note, to borrow a football term, last year's team most likely would have "fumbled" last night's game away. Very many positive things from last night; even though the #'s weren't all that impressive from HMP he played solid defensive without fouling. When it's crunch time we have many more options to get to offensively, so defensively opponents can't key on yogi. Guards rebounded, team chemistry is bounds better. PERSPECTIVE.

[djsalway 4,161]

Oh, I apologize for actually scrutinizing one of our scholarship players...Excuse me for not being blind to reality...for the record, seems like a great kid who has improved over last year but also not a kid who would start on any other Big Ten team....thats just reality...Oh, I get it...this is the society we live in these days...God forbid someone is critical of someone else for any reason without being portrayed negatively....PERSPECTIVE

You are allowed to be positive, ya know?

[KingPG21 6,582]

Wow, really low expectations for this team...I searched the box score for "deflections" and could not find that stat...so we are now counting deflections for worthiness to start...We will be killed in the Big Ten if we are starting kids inside due to their penchant for deflections... :stop:

Seriously? Are you seriously saying that deflections s a meaningless stat because it isn't being kept track of in the stat box? Wow, just wow is all I can say. Go talk to any coach not named Mike D'Antoni and there is a 99.99% chance they keep track of deflections because it is an important stat

[Crimson and Cream 5,776]

#1CreanApologist nailed it, it really wasn't a good first game to play him in. We'll be seeing plenty of him Saturday and Monday against the cupcakes.

[Alabaster Thunder 306]

Maybe a combination of things here but I'd say, mainly, your expectations were too high.

 

I realize there was talk about him coming in and contributing "right away" (as in his first game ever I suppose you took that as) but he is a freshman who missed the summer, missed the Canada trip, missed the exhibitions, and missed the first two games. Crean was clearly not comfortable enough with Holt's experience level to place him in this level of a game. And looking at it from a "how could he have done worse" perspective isn't a perspective most CBB coaches subscribe to, imo.

 

You'll see him tomorrow and can make judgements on him then. 

This! Holt is likely a little green still.  Be happy CTC recognized that and didn't throw the kid to the wolves last night... Imagine the mini meltdowns on here if Holt had played and gotten embarrassed in some way or made a crucial turnover. Here's to Holt getting his feet wet against Lamar, and hopefully alleviating a lot of our interior woes!

[eljefe6 358]

I agree that is probably the best explanation but when all we heard was how this kid would come in an IMMEDIATELY be able to contribute....seems like someones evaluation was a little off...that's all....I was excited to see this kid come in and wow us when we needed him and he never got off the bench...

He hasn't played any college ball since he missed the first 4 "warm-up" games, where he could have started to adjust to the faster pace. I don't think that means the evaluation was necessarily off, just that he didn't get those first 4 under his belt.

I understand your frustration in the responses to making critical observations though. Chalk it up to a bunch of Hoosiers happy about a win over our first decent competition this season.

[Bk4life 190]

Seriously? Are you seriously saying that deflections s a meaningless stat because it isn't being kept track of in the stat box? Wow, just wow is all I can say. Go talk to any coach not named Mike D'Antoni and there is a 99.99% chance they keep track of deflections because it is an important stat

I don't consider it a meaningless stat...IMO it's more important for our interior guys to maybe have more than 2 points and zero rebounds a game...if interior presence was measured on deflections alone or even in the top 10 of evaluations for interior play, we should be starting any number of guys as a center...if you are unable to grab a rebound, but it counts for you to get your fingers on the ball, then I could be a center....come on...let's see how excited you are about his play when we are shutdown by (insert Big Ten team here) due to his zero/zero stats...will you be counting deflections and be excited about it then? Probably not...PERSPECTIVE