IUBB vs Iowa - Saturday, 01.17.26 @ 2:00 on Fox TV

[Uspshoosier]

6 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Year 1 was critical for all the reasons we now realize as a fanbase. 

Year 1 was critical for some fans not all fans.  I’ve seen coaches destroy it in year 1 and everyone thought it was a home run and then struggle after and on the hot seat by year 3 or 4

[Hoosierfan2017]

1 hour ago, IUHoosierJoe said:

If fan appetite for a rebuild is zero, maybe it’s time for some fans to walk away. I get the frustration and disappointment. This program, with the exception of maybe 5 seasons, has accomplished nothing since 1992. We all know that. The program has been mismanaged for the better part of 34 years.
 

So, with that reality in place, why would anyone expect a coach to come in, having to replace an entire 13-man roster, and people think he is going to snap his fingers and collect enough talent in one portal haul to be a national contender in Year 1? It makes zero sense. And that is why this fan base is ridiculed nation-wide. That’s why Malik Reneau tweeted what he tweeted.

Yes, Curt Cignetti did it here. And now every dumb fan base in America—including ours, apparently—thinks every coach they hire should be able to do it, because Cignetti, I guess, is really nothing special.

Reality isn’t going to change just because some folks don’t like it. So, there’s going to be a rebuild, whether there’s an appetite for it or not, no matter who you hire. 

Who here says they expect a national championship in year 1? This team doesn’t even look like an NCAA contender in year 1, and that’s a problem. In no way is it unrealistic to expect a coach to be able to come to IU and make the tournament in year one. Mike Woodson did it and he probably couldn’t name half the players on his team  

Devries had to replace an entire 13-man roster in part because none of his players or recruits (other than his son) wanted to follow him to IU, which was a red flag. He did a horrible job identifying players to fill the roster. What coach would see Enright and Bailey and think they’re big ten caliber starters? Frankly, I can’t even really tell if Devries is a good enough coach or not because he constructed such a terrible roster. And he’s going to have to rebuild the roster again this offseason because we’re losing most of our players (which isn’t really a bad thing). His high school recruiting has been underwhelming, too, which doesn’t inspire confidence for the portal. 

People can complain about the fanbase as much as they want, but the fanbase has been the only thing the program has going for it for the better part of the 21st century. 

[BGleas]

43 minutes ago, IUHoosierJoe said:

For me, the "I'm pissed because I've already decided we'll suck next year" takes the cake, lol.

For me, it's you making stuff up people didn't say to create a false argument, that take the cake for me, lol 

[Golfman25]

15 minutes ago, Uspshoosier said:

Year 1 was critical for some fans not all fans.  I’ve seen coaches destroy it in year 1 and everyone thought it was a home run and then struggle after and on the hot seat by year 3 or 4

Is that because you’re looking at record, not process?   How many have you seen completely suck year one and have it cooking year 2-3? 

[BGleas]

1 hour ago, Uspshoosier said:

In today’s landscape teams will have to re recruit their own players every year.   As a program you could plan for bringing back your core players but nowadays you never know.  Very few Sisleys out there that are loyal.  I’m hoping he is.  I don’t know the answer or how to navigate around it but most coaches will have to deal with it.   New team every year.    It’s not just happening mediocre programs and teams.    Baylor thought they had some nice pieces back this year from a tourney team and a team that has been extremely successful over the last 6 years and this year they lost Wright to Baylor when Drew expected him back.  Baylor had 0 returning players  

Wild times.  I guess what I’m saying is nowadays you can plan all day on bringing core players back to build your program but that’s not a guarantee anymore 

For sure, the landscape has changed drastically and you definitely have to re-recruit your own players. 

Lots of programs are in that situation. 

I'd just feel more optimistic about next season if we had the opportunity to bring 3-4 of our core guys back. 

[realTomCrean]

12 hours ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

I was ridiculed for this observation in the offseason. 

 

12 hours ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Devries watched Enright every day for two years and thought he was a big ten caliber starting point guard.. that speaks volumes about his eye for talent.

His brother is going to be so angry on X at you guys. He’s so soft, def reading these boards 

[realTomCrean]

14 hours ago, ronzo4IU said:

It will prob come down to weather big donors have the confidence in him to throw a big bag his way to overspend x at least 5 players in the portal.  That is the only way out as I can see. On that note…not looking good.

So the Woody approach

[Uspshoosier]

11 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Devries had to replace an entire 13-man roster in part because none of his players or recruits (other than his son) wanted to follow him to IU, which was a red flag. He did a horrible job identifying players to fill the roster. What coach would see Enright and Bailey and think they’re big ten caliber starters?

Which West Virginia players did you want to come over with him? When filling out 13 scholarships the odds of missing out on players is going to be higher then only having to fill out a couple of spots.  I’m not  convinced he brought Enright in to be a starter at first.   Maybe bring in a kid that is familiar with the system that you had success with in the past to help the other players with the system.  DeVries had a chance to bring him to West Virginia when he got that job and chose to bring him to the Big 12.   Bailey is a miss for B1G style play however he had some pretty big programs after him when he chose IU.  I think (my opinion only) DeVries has acknowledged that the B1G centers style is completely different than the bigs that are in the Big 12.  I think he under estimated the B1G style.  Hopefully with a full staff in place he can learn from his mistakes and fix it for next year.   Having 5 scholarship players contributing nothing is not helping.    Although from reports the 2 international kids are not taking up hardly any NIL money. Less the ln a mid major player. I don’t know the answer. 

[BGleas]

1 minute ago, realTomCrean said:

So the Woody approach

It's kind of everyones approach at this point. 

With DeVries, I feel much, much more confident he would coach those guys well. 

Give DeVries Woodson's rosters and I think we'd be in a much better spot. 

I'm just concerned we won't be able to get that level of talent at this point. 

[Stuhoo]

Enright was the first player in (other than Tucker) and he is a truly fantastic piece for a winning team. The problem is that he turned into a 30 minute per game starter.

[realTomCrean]

7 minutes ago, BGleas said:

It's kind of everyones approach at this point. 

With DeVries, I feel much, much more confident he would coach those guys well. 

Give DeVries Woodson's rosters and I think we'd be in a much better spot. 

I'm just concerned we won't be able to get that level of talent at this point. 

I’m sorry but I disagree. Devries talks about hustle, execution, movement on offense, and all the stuff that sounds good 

But I’ve watched 7 B1G games and 3 P4 games and my eyes say he isn’t a tactician by any means, his teams melt when they get punched, and we really get taken advantage of defensively time and again. It’s basic things like when an off player pump fakes, 3 IU guys go flying by. Offensively IU is so stagnant and dead. 
 

Part of these problems come from lack of repercussions for bonehead play. Conerway has made an excruciating amount of TOs from lack of effort, but he is not corrected. Tucker Devries is one of the laziest players in IU history, like up there with Ballo and Taco. If he’s not hitting shots he mopes around - nepotism can’t be good for team rapport 

To end my novel, Devries is not a good coach strategically or tactically per the eye test

[Uspshoosier]

10 minutes ago, Golfman25 said:

Is that because you’re looking at record, not process?   How many have you seen completely suck year one and have it cooking year 2-3? 

Every situation is different.  Plenty have sucked in their first years and then went on to become hall of fame coaches.   Different  era now so the chances a coach can work his way into it at a school will become less and less.  Tang at Kansas St came out of the gate hot and was looking like a fantastic hire but the last couple years has cooled off significantly.  Gates at Missouri started out with a 25-10 year with a tourney appearance.   Went winless in the sec the next year (8-24 overall) and then made it back in the tourney in year 3.   Who knows what can happen 

[realTomCrean]

1 minute ago, Uspshoosier said:

Every situation is different.  Plenty have sucked in their first years and then went on to become hall of fame coaches.   Different  era now so the chances a coach can work his way into it at a school will become less and less.  Tang at Kansas St came out of the gate hot and was looking like a fantastic hire but the last couple years has cooled off significantly.  Gates at Missouri started out with a 25-10 year with a tourney appearance.   Went winless in the sec the next year (8-24 overall) and then made it back in the tourney in year 3.   Who knows what can happen 

Hurley was awful his first two years as well

[IUCrazy2]

1 hour ago, BGleas said:

The bold is largely where my concern lies. I like DeVries for the most part and IMO he's definitely an upgrade from a coaching perspective compared to the last two coaches. 

But, we're right back in this position in 3 months. We have to recruit an entirely new team in 3 months. 

I'd feel a bit different if we had say Conorway, Wilkerson and maybe Alexis back along with Sisley. 

Then you go hit the portal hard for 3-4 legit, power 5 pieces to go with them, including a legit starting 5 that would make Alexis the backup, etc. 

We'd have a core to build around. 

But right now, I just see very little path to making next season markedly better than this season. 

I just don't see how this gets much better next season. 

He has to do a much better job in the portal next season and it can't all be guys going into their last year.

[BGleas]

10 minutes ago, realTomCrean said:

I’m sorry but I disagree. Devries talks about hustle, execution, movement on offense, and all the stuff that sounds good 

But I’ve watched 7 B1G games and 3 P4 games and my eyes say he isn’t a tactician by any means, his teams melt when they get punched, and we really get taken advantage of defensively time and again. It’s basic things like when an off player pump fakes, 3 IU guys go flying by. Offensively IU is so stagnant and dead. 
 

Part of these problems come from lack of repercussions for bonehead play. Conerway has made an excruciating amount of TOs from lack of effort, but he is not corrected. Tucker Devries is one of the laziest players in IU history, like up there with Ballo and Taco. If he’s not hitting shots he mopes around - nepotism can’t be good for team rapport 

To end my novel, Devries is not a good coach strategically or tactically per the eye test

I'll say I lightly disagree lol. 

What I mean is, the system is sound and I've actually been impressed with how we've been defensively, given our roster limitations. 

IU wilting in second halves IMO is largely a roster issue, not a coaching or scheme one. 

It's hard to stop runs against teams bigger, faster and more athletic. We have no size and can't stay in front of guys because we're slow. 

The reason I say "lightly disagree" is because I don't know what it will look like if/when we have comprobable size and athleticsm. I think our system and coaching is fine if we can get a solid, balanced Big Ten caliber roster. 

We don't have that right now. Of course that is the staffs and administrations fault. 

[realTomCrean]

@BGleas Totally understand what you’re saying. I’m lashing out like a child because we got ran by a mid team at home, after blowing a 15pt 2H lead at home. The X Os could be fine but with Bailey, Devries , and Enright executing who knows? 
 

Here’s what I do know for a fact: There is no repercussion for lack of effort by CDD. If there is, it is not immediate & is not visible. Drives me nuts

[BGleas]

9 minutes ago, realTomCrean said:

@BGleas Totally understand what you’re saying. I’m lashing out like a child because we got ran by a mid team at home, after blowing a 15pt 2H lead at home. The X Os could be fine but with Bailey, Devries (fat), and Enright executing who knows? 
 

Here’s what I do know for a fact: There is no repercussion for lack of effort by CDD. If there is, it is not immediate & is not visible. Drives me nuts

I hear you. The state of IU basketball is very frustrating (meaning the last 10 years and even 20+ years). 

I don't really see lack of effort from this group, though. I feel like we've largely played hard. 

Although I think Conorway is way too nonchalant for me. But, I haven't seen a team 'mailing it in'.

I think we just have a huge lack of athleticism, strength and size, which is really frustrating and is easy to expose for Big Ten teams. 

Why did we think Bailey could be a starting Big Ten center? Why is Tucker DeVries so out of shape? Etc.,etc 

[Golfman25]

24 minutes ago, realTomCrean said:

Hurley was awful his first two years as well

Was he though?  If you only look at the record, then sure.  But what was he doing to build his program?   First couple of years I want to see the vision and the process to support that vision.  The record will take care of itself.  

[ronzo4IU]

22 minutes ago, realTomCrean said:

@BGleas Totally understand what you’re saying. I’m lashing out like a child because we got ran by a mid team at home, after blowing a 15pt 2H lead at home. The X Os could be fine but with Bailey, Devries (fat), and Enright executing who knows? 
 

Here’s what I do know for a fact: There is no repercussion for lack of effort by CDD. If there is, it is not immediate & is not visible. Drives me nuts

I rewatched the game-painstakingly-and I agree with BGleas.  
The effort is there but the limitations make it look like poor effort.  
Connerway was busting azz going to the hoop since everyone is guarding us tight out 50’ lol.

Enright also hustles but physically limited..

Baily has good effort but seems lost a lot.

Tucker, yes…could work harder but isn’t very athletic….so on and so forth.

Wilkerson can’t win by himself and Alexis is far from a rim runner.

Teams have neutralized us by taking our 3pt shot away for sure and the adjustments DD is trying to make are being worked on in practice but not in games according to him.

[Golfman25]

49 minutes ago, ronzo4IU said:

 

Teams have neutralized us by taking our 3pt shot away for sure and the adjustments DD is trying to make are being worked on in practice but not in games according to him.

That, right there, is the barn on fire.