Fire Coach Woodson Thread

[IUFAN1976 2,746]

3 hours ago, Scotty R said:

I just think it is time to back the program and stop with this non sense. All of this talk doesn't help one bit and only hurt the program. He wasn't fired and will be the coach so why not be positive for once. Do I think he is a great coach no, but he has isn't inept or as bad as you guys make him out to be 

This thread will not stop, IMO!  He isn’t a good X’s and O’s guy or at least hasn’t been up to this point and it took him 4 years to finally get roster construction but the jury is still out whether he can sustain but he does seem to be a fairly decent to above average recruiter and player developer.  Also, I will give him props that he seems to care for his players but the entire thing goes away because of his holier than thou attitude, his God like/walk on water complex and this entitlement that he thanks he has and the bow down and kiss the ring personality that he has.  He could have saved this season last year and fans would have accepted not making the tournament if he would have accepted the blame and just admitted he made mistakes with roster construction and not playing his best players to beat those mediocre teams like a drum but he didn’t but instead blamed the fans and others!  Only thing we heard was “He done his job” lol

[Hoosierfan2017 20,668]

3 hours ago, JSHoosier said:

Pope would be underwhelming for sure but at least he has college experience; Woodson's HC career was over for almost a decade until IU called because no one else wanted him, if he didn't play here 40 years ago it'd be a completely laughable hire and no one would've been excited.

I don't expect Stevens, but that doesn't mean you stick with a lousy coach and stop trying. Or we could give him another unearned raise and hang a "I did my job" banner since that's only banner he'll ever hang.

UK did what IU did, hired a guy only because he went to the school, and they still managed to make a far better hire than IU did. Administration just can’t/wont get out of its own way. 

[Scotty R 2,127]

17 minutes ago, IUFAN1976 said:

This thread will not stop, IMO!  He isn’t a good X’s and O’s guy or at least hasn’t been up to this point and it took him 4 years to finally get roster construction but the jury is still out whether he can sustain but he does seem to be a fairly decent to above average recruiter and player developer.  Also, I will give him props that he seems to care for his players but the entire thing goes away because of his holier than thou attitude, his God like/walk on water complex and this entitlement that he thanks he has and the bow down and kiss the ring personality that he has.  He could have saved this season last year and fans would have accepted not making the tournament if he would have accepted the blame and just admitted he made mistakes with roster construction and not playing his best players to beat those mediocre teams like a drum but he didn’t but instead blamed the fans and others!  Only thing we heard was “He done his job” lol

I think his out of bounds plays and our if time out plays are pretty good

[Scotty R 2,127]

13 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

UK did what IU did, hired a guy only because he went to the school, and they still managed to make a far better hire than IU did. Administration just can’t/wont get out of its own way. 

So did these other schools

Duke 

UNC

Syracuse 

Villanova

[IUFAN1976 2,746]

31 minutes ago, Scotty R said:

I think his out of bounds plays and our if time out plays are pretty good

Ok, maybe average!

[IUFAN1976 2,746]

21 minutes ago, Scotty R said:

So did these other schools

Duke 

UNC

Syracuse 

Villanova

And still, IU’s administration made a subpar hire!  Other schools administration you listed > IU’s administration, lol

[Scotty R 2,127]

1 hour ago, IUFAN1976 said:

And still, IU’s administration made a subpar hire!  Other schools administration you listed > IU’s administration, lol

None of those hires are considered home run hires. 3 of them had no HC experience at any level and if IU made those hires you would been upset. If those administrations are so good why did they settle for these guys. U get it you despise Woodson and will find any little things bing to hash him. I understand questioning his coaching but making it personal is what I don't understand. Besides the comment at Senior day I haven't seen anything off the court to be upset with. None of us no hom personally so none of us I ow what kind of person he is.

[IUFAN1976 2,746]

10 minutes ago, Scotty R said:

None of those hires are considered home run hires. 3 of them had no HC experience at any level and if IU made those hires you would been upset. If those administrations are so good why did they settle for these guys. U get it you despise Woodson and will find any little things bing to hash him. I understand questioning his coaching but making it personal is what I don't understand. Besides the comment at Senior day I haven't seen anything off the court to be upset with. None of us no hom personally so none of us I ow what kind of person he is.

I would say Duke’s and UNC’s aren’t bad, but I still say our Administration settled and was influenced by one QB

[Scotty R 2,127]

16 minutes ago, IUFAN1976 said:

I would say Duke’s and UNC’s aren’t bad, but I still say our Administration settled and was influenced by one QB

I just see Duke and Syracuse having HIF coaches who were there over 49 years so I doubt the administration today had anything to do with those hires. I just don't see what makes those administration better than IU's. You probably can put Villanova in the same category.

[WayneFleekHoosier 47,754]

I would say Duke’s and UNC’s aren’t bad, but I still say our Administration settled and was influenced by one QB

I don’t think Duke or UNC have great coaches. Maybe no better than Woodson even, but their administrations are serious and both schools have made sure to have top 1-10 talented rosters every season so it’s hard for their coach to screw it up. Indiana finally has attempted that this season far more the than most seasons.

My biggest gripe with Woodson/staff so far is talent evaluation. Last years roster never had close enough to enough guard talent. I knew that from my couch before the season. Then we suffered a miserable season full of excuses with a lackluster roster 2 pieces short. Frustrating.

Thus I’ve lost faith in this staff knowing what it takes to be a top 10 team because they all referenced last years team maybe be better than the TJD team in the preseason. Missed the mark. Now we just hope they’ve learned some things.


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[HoosierHoopster 6,679]

16 hours ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

I don’t think Duke or UNC have great coaches. Maybe no better than Woodson even, but their administrations are serious and both schools have made sure to have top 1-10 talented rosters every season so it’s hard for their coach to screw it up. Indiana finally has attempted that this season far more the than most seasons.

My biggest gripe with Woodson/staff so far is talent evaluation. Last years roster never had close enough to enough guard talent. I knew that from my couch before the season. Then we suffered a miserable season full of excuses with a lackluster roster 2 pieces short. Frustrating.

Thus I’ve lost faith in this staff knowing what it takes to be a top 10 team because they all referenced last years team maybe be better than the TJD team in the preseason. Missed the mark. Now we just hope they’ve learned some things.


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My biggest gripe with Woodson / staff isn't talent evaluation, it's style / system of play. Every single year under Woodson it's been 2-big play through the post 1970s style ball. That's an above-obvious recipe for failure in today's game, he has continued to largely fail, and yet he stubbornly insists on running it. TJD largely saved him but we still couldn't do anything in the tourney with that ridiculously outdated and simplistic "scheme" and yet he just keeps doing it -- but in fairness, JHS was a great addition and that's part of the talent evaluation side.

What has been killing me every season under Woodson is the simply absurd shooting on volume at the very bottom of Div 1 ball. There is absolutely no excuse for that.

That was up to now, though. I am cautiously -- cautiously -- optimistic, and giving Woodson the benefit of the doubt this season, that we will see different looks, more perimeter- based guard and wing-based sets, actions, with more outside shooting with what we, very clearly, now have in some very skilled guard additions, including experience.

This is Woodson's year to show he's not a stubborn old man who either can't or isn't willing to adjust his 2-big play through the post style of ball. If he does I'll be the first to get in line behind him and celebrate a return to good basketball. If he doesn't, I'm done with him (for what that matters)

[IUFAN1976 2,746]

On 7/21/2024 at 11:16 AM, HoosierHoopster said:

My biggest gripe with Woodson / staff isn't talent evaluation, it's style / system of play. Every single year under Woodson it's been 2-big play through the post 1970s style ball. That's an above-obvious recipe for failure in today's game, he has continued to largely fail, and yet he stubbornly insists on running it. TJD largely saved him but we still couldn't do anything in the tourney with that ridiculously outdated and simplistic "scheme" and yet he just keeps doing it -- but in fairness, JHS was a great addition and that's part of the talent evaluation side.

What has been killing me every season under Woodson is the simply absurd shooting on volume at the very bottom of Div 1 ball. There is absolutely no excuse for that.

That was up to now, though. I am cautiously -- cautiously -- optimistic, and giving Woodson the benefit of the doubt this season, that we will see different looks, more perimeter- based guard and wing-based sets, actions, with more outside shooting with what we, very clearly, now have in some very skilled guard additions, including experience.

This is Woodson's year to show he's not a stubborn old man who either can't or isn't willing to adjust his 2-big play through the post style of ball. If he does I'll be the first to get in line behind him and celebrate a return to good basketball. If he doesn't, I'm done with him (for what that matters)

He can improve his attitude some too!

3 things I will be looking for besides his attitude adjustment, lol:

1) Not playing 2 bigs near as much but just rotating them in and out to keep them both fresh and out of foul trouble

2) Matchup our team to exploit the weaknesses of the other team, that includes playing smaller

3) Shooting more volume of 3’s and hitting them at a decent percentage, 36% or higher as a team is not out of the question,  IMO

[AH1971 1,415]

On 7/21/2024 at 11:16 AM, HoosierHoopster said:

My biggest gripe with Woodson / staff isn't talent evaluation, it's style / system of play. Every single year under Woodson it's been 2-big play through the post 1970s style ball. That's an above-obvious recipe for failure in today's game, he has continued to largely fail, and yet he stubbornly insists on running it. TJD largely saved him but we still couldn't do anything in the tourney with that ridiculously outdated and simplistic "scheme" and yet he just keeps doing it -- but in fairness, JHS was a great addition and that's part of the talent evaluation side.

Woodson/staff's greatest failure by far and away was their grave misevaluation of Xavier Johnson as a starting PG in this conference. It doesn't matter what style or scheme you play if you don't have a consistent floor general. Purdue played through the post every possession last season (while playing two bigs) and shot 40% from 3 while having the 2nd most efficient offense in the country. If our back court is as good as advertised this year, style of play/scheme will become irrelevant. 

[HoosierHoopster 6,679]

1 hour ago, AH1971 said:

Woodson/staff's greatest failure by far and away was their grave misevaluation of Xavier Johnson as a starting PG in this conference. It doesn't matter what style or scheme you play if you don't have a consistent floor general. Purdue played through the post every possession last season (while playing two bigs) and shot 40% from 3 while having the 2nd most efficient offense in the country. If our back court is as good as advertised this year, style of play/scheme will become irrelevant. 

It won't become irrelevant. It doesn't matter if you can hit threes if you don't shoot them. There's no getting around that under Woodson we have shot, on VOLUME, at the very bottom of Div. I ball. There's no excuse for that. And if we run 2 bigs for extended minutes without different looks, and continue to barely shoot 3's -- that is SCHEME -- we'll lose, especially in the tourney. Of course scheme matters.

[Stuhoo 79,236]

6 minutes ago, HoosierHoopster said:

It won't become irrelevant. It doesn't matter if you can hit threes if you don't shoot them. There's no getting around that under Woodson we have shot, on VOLUME, at the very bottom of Div. I ball. There's no excuse for that. And if we run 2 bigs for extended minutes without different looks, and continue to barely shoot 3's -- that is SCHEME -- we'll lose, especially in the tourney. Of course scheme matters.

And who were supposed to be our volume three point shooters last season?

1. Mgbako
2. ...??
3. ...??
4. ...??

The roster construction sucked big-time. Adding Goode, Carlyle, Hatton, and hopefully Rice as players that at a minimum at least need to be guarded at the three point line was critical.

[AH1971 1,415]

8 minutes ago, HoosierHoopster said:

It won't become irrelevant. It doesn't matter if you can hit threes if you don't shoot them. There's no getting around that under Woodson we have shot, on VOLUME, at the very bottom of Div. I ball. There's no excuse for that. And if we run 2 bigs for extended minutes without different looks, and continue to barely shoot 3's -- that is SCHEME -- we'll lose, especially in the tourney. Of course scheme matters.

We didn't shoot a lot of 3's the last two years because we had one player in the lineup each of those years capable of making 3's on any kind of volume. Purdue played through the post with two bigs on the court last year and still shot a lot of 3's because they had three players on the perimeter capable of making a high volume number of 3 point shots. This isn't hard to understand. Nobody played through the post more than Purdue last year. 

[Stuhoo 79,236]

11 minutes ago, AH1971 said:

We didn't shoot a lot of 3's the last two years because we had one player in the lineup each of those years capable of making 3's on any kind of volume. Purdue played through the post with two bigs on the court last year and still shot a lot of 3's because they had three players on the perimeter capable of making a high volume number of 3 point shots. This isn't hard to understand. Nobody played through the post more than Purdue last year. 

And since this is the anti-Woodson thread, let me add the reminder that the crap-tastic roster construction was entirely the fault of Mike Woodson. 

But he has solved that (I think). A prime example is that his marquee portal acquisition, Oumar Ballo, is an extremely effective player on both ends who will rarely have offense run through him. I would imagine that if we play with Ballo and Malik on the court at the same time, Malik will get the vast majority of post touches and Ballo will be the perimeter screener who then rim runs.

[AH1971 1,415]

Just now, Stuhoo said:

And since this is the anti-Woodson thread, let me add the reminder that the crap-tastic roster construction was entirely the fault of Mike Woodson. 

But he has solved that (I think). A prime example is that his marquee portal acquisition, Oumar Ballo, is an extremely effective player on both ends who will rarely have offense run through him.

Agreed

[go iu bb 5,404]

2 hours ago, AH1971 said:

Woodson/staff's greatest failure by far and away was their grave misevaluation of Xavier Johnson as a starting PG in this conference. It doesn't matter what style or scheme you play if you don't have a consistent floor general. Purdue played through the post every possession last season (while playing two bigs) and shot 40% from 3 while having the 2nd most efficient offense in the country. If our back court is as good as advertised this year, style of play/scheme will become irrelevant. 

Give them a break. They only had 2 years before last to evaluate him.

[AH1971 1,415]

27 minutes ago, go iu bb said:

Give them a break. They only had 2 years before last to evaluate him.

Right. That's why I called it a grave misevaluation...the fact that he was the starting PG for 3 seasons. I don't blame Woodson and staff in the least for playing through two elite big men, I blame them for not surrounding them with better guards.