What Can IUBB do to Revive Your Excitement/Confidence?

[Brass Cannon]

Just now, Hoosierfan2017 said:

The honeymoon for Archie ended when he landed Romeo Langford, had a senior Juwan Morgan, and proceeded to lose 12 conference games in a 13 game stretch. From 12-2 and 3-0 in the conference to 13-14 and 4-12 in the conference. I still don't understand how that happened. Fair or not, the clock started ticking after that happened, and he's running out of time. He has to turn it around in a big way if he wants to keep his job. 

The only Big Ten quality player in that Bunch was Romeo.  That class has given basically nothing since he left for the NBA.  
 

If Archie moved Al, Phinisee and Hunter to the end of the bench I would probably back off for a year and let him see what he could do with the guys he brought in 

[Honkyman]

I agree: Lander, Franklin, Galloway, Race & TJD.  The offense needs to get more creative. Armaan needs to practice his free throws. Galloway needs to work on his 3-point shot. Race needs to get more aggressive.

[zsmithey4]

Lander getting more minutes and experience here in the next couple games could be huge. The kid is mega talented and not scared when he is out there I would love to see him play more and more.

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich]

My biggest problem with Phinisee and Durham is that they just play through the motions. No IQ on how to read and react to the defense. They HAVE to run the offense like its practice. 

[Hovadipo]

6 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

My biggest problem with Phinisee and Durham is that they just play through the motions. No IQ on how to read and react to the defense. They HAVE to run the offense like its practice. 

But the system is bad. Wouldn’t running it correctly just make things worse????

 

Schroedinger’s offense imo. 

[Brass Cannon]

6 minutes ago, Hovadipo said:

But the system is bad. Wouldn’t running it correctly just make things worse????

 

Schroedinger’s offense imo. 

Yep begs the question is our system:

-Broken and needs revamped

-Do we have 4 or so guards that aren’t fits to execute the system 

-Do we have guards that just aren’t that good   
 

I honestly think it’s all 3 to some degree but if you think there’s some particular one most at fault that’s fair  

All 3 are on Archie of course 

 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich]

7 minutes ago, Hovadipo said:

But the system is bad. Wouldn’t running it correctly just make things worse????

 

Schroedinger’s offense imo. 

That's kinda the issue. Those two continue just going through the motions. The system is absolutely terrible. It's not an offense built to score. It's built to waste time. 

[Brass Cannon]

1 minute ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

That's kinda the issue. Those two continue just going through the motions. The system is absolutely terrible. It's not an offense built to score. It's built to waste time. 

His system is designed to score ironically. It’s modeled after the Phoenix fast break.  The players aren’t doing it.  And not being held accountable. 
 

We are terrible in half court offense yet because they play slow we end up in it all the time. 

[Hovadipo]

16 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

It's not an offense built to score. It's built to waste time. 

I’d like some proof of that. 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich]

12 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

His system is designed to score ironically. It’s modeled after the Phoenix fast break.  The players aren’t doing it.  And not being held accountable. 
 

We are terrible in half court offense yet because they play slow we end up in it all the time. 

It doesn't help that Phinisee and Durham jog the ball up the floor. Lander is the only one look to race up the court. 

If Archie's offensive system actually works, then put the players on the court that can make it happen. Phinisee and Durham are not those players. 

[Brass Cannon]

Just now, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

It doesn't help that Phinisee and Durham jog the ball up the floor. Lander is the only one look to race up the court. 

If Archie's offensive system actually works, then put the players on the court that can make it happen. Phinisee and Durham are not those players. 

Problem with his defense first mentality.  Our upper classmen are better on D and that seems to be all Archie cares about.  One defensive mistake and the freshmen get yanked. Never mind they might make the offense flow better.  

[JSHoosier]

Lander might have the highest ceiling of our guards and I understand wanting to get him experience, but I could also understand if Miller wants to bring him along slower.  HS to college ball is a big jump as it is, and Lander should still be in HS.

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich]

3 minutes ago, Hovadipo said:

I’d like some proof of that. 

How about the fact that we average 71 possessions per game? Which is 222nd in the nation. Obviously some teams can make it work. We are not one of those teams. There are several P5 teams behind us. UCLA, Texas Tech, Purdue, Wisconsin, Virginia. But all 9f those teams are more efficient than us. It's difficult to run at such a slow pace and average less than a point per possession. And we are right on the cusp of doing so but we aren't there. Moving Phinisee to the bench was a good move. Durham needs to be next. 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich]

3 minutes ago, JSHoosier said:

Lander might have the highest ceiling of our guards and I understand wanting to get him experience, but I could also understand if Miller wants to bring him along slower.  HS to college ball is a big jump as it is, and Lander should still be in HS.

We really don't have time for that. It would be different if we had Yogi or Tom Coverdale. Even Armon Bassett. But we have guys who should be playing at Indiana State. You just have to let the kid play. 

[Hovadipo]

8 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

How about the fact that we average 71 possessions per game? Which is 222nd in the nation. Obviously some teams can make it work. We are not one of those teams. There are several P5 teams behind us. UCLA, Texas Tech, Purdue, Wisconsin, Virginia. But all 9f those teams are more efficient than us. It's difficult to run at such a slow pace and average less than a point per possession. And we are right on the cusp of doing so but we aren't there. Moving Phinisee to the bench was a good move. Durham needs to be next. 

In favor of who? Lander? Durham should’ve been the one sitting yesterday, but you can’t sit both. You can justify it now but you’d continue bitching when we continue losing because Lander isn’t ready. 
 

Saying our offense isn’t built to score but built to waste time is still inaccurate, by the way. That’s just you being difficult. If we had more than one shooter you’d have to find something else to complain about because this offense has produced wasted opportunities all season. 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich]

8 minutes ago, Hovadipo said:

In favor of who? Lander? Durham should’ve been the one sitting yesterday, but you can’t sit both. You can justify it now but you’d continue bitching when we continue losing because Lander isn’t ready. 
 

Saying our offense isn’t built to score but built to waste time is still inaccurate, by the way. That’s just you being difficult. If we had more than one shooter you’d have to find something else to complain about because this offense has produced wasted opportunities all season. 

Lander can shoot. But there is a period of growing pains you'll have to go through with him. Same with Leal. Both should be getting way more minutes. 

[MikeRoberts]

2 hours ago, Uspshoosier said:

He also had one of the worst seasons in Illinois basketball history and has yet to coach a game in the ncaa tournament with Illinois.   2 seasons finishing under .500.  in his first 4 years.  Lol this place would be on fire just like the Illinois board was before his projected first round 5 star in state guard decided to stay 2 extra years.   Same people would be killing him just like the same people would defending him saying give him time.   

Argument for argument sake it appears. There is a clear pattern of growth at Illinois, It is apparent in all phases. Talk to Illinois fans, they’re excited for this season and what’s ahead. I live in Illinois and there is optimism that hasn’t been there for a long time. That optimism started in Underwoods third year and has carried over to his fourth. 
 

that program started in a worse place and is in a better place than IU in the same time period. We aren’t improving like other teams in the bigten

[NashvilleHoosier]

1 hour ago, Brass Cannon said:

People are enamored with him because he’s had the same time as Archie and gotten a lot more done.  

Yes, my point is that people are enamored with a coach that they wouldn’t actually be enamored with if we had him. 
 

And “done a lot more” is a bit of a stretch. If you want to say it appears at this moment in time that the trajectory of Illinois under Underwood is slightly better that IU under Archie, then fine. But that story hasn’t been fully written. And saying he’s done a lot more, to warrant being enamored with, is again, quite a stretch.

[JSHoosier]

43 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

We really don't have time for that. It would be different if we had Yogi or Tom Coverdale. Even Armon Bassett. But we have guys who should be playing at Indiana State. You just have to let the kid play. 

I watch him and see a player that isn't ready, not intended as a knock on him as it's entirely understandable; and he's shooting about 26% from range so he's not helping the shooting issues either.

Phinisee and Durham need pine time, but we don't have a good alternative if we sit both.

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich]

9 minutes ago, NashvilleHoosier said:

Yes, my point is that people are enamored with a coach that they wouldn’t actually be enamored with if we had him. 
 

And “done a lot more” is a bit of a stretch. If you want to say it appears at this moment in time that the trajectory of Illinois under Underwood is slightly better that IU under Archie, then fine. But that story hasn’t been fully written. And saying he’s done a lot more, to warrant being enamored with, is again, quite a stretch.

Well year 3 and Illinois finishes 4th in the B1G and ranked 21st while Indiana was 10th and a bubble team. Year 4 is looking to be about the same.