Negativity Thread

[Bobman1 2,909]

 

At the risk of over-dramatizing, the concluded Purdue game and this Thursday's game could have implications that last for years.
 

Not wrong at all. Win a few games and make the tournament and Archie’s probably back with some hope for next year assuming TJD stays. Lose against Iowa at home, spiral out on the road with a few more losses, bounce early in the NIT and we’re looking at a lot of unknowns for the offseason.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners

[Aaron 4,265]

23 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

It would not surprise me, but I do think they would have to hire the new AD first. No one wants Fred making this decision

That is absolutely correct and what I heard. There is no way he is gone after third year unless he loses out, but after next year he will be gone with new AD regardless of buyout and donors will pony up.

It is kind of cowardly for Glass to leave because he is worried about Archie, but at same I get it as he would be fired anyways and wants to resign while getting is still good and most people would do same including me.

Don't blame Fred for hire and I liked it at time but its simply not working out right now.    

[bigrod 2,848]

Just now, Bobman1 said:

Not wrong at all. Win a few games and make the tournament and Archie’s probably back with some hope for next year assuming TJD stays. Lose against Iowa at home, spiral out on the road with a few more losses, bounce early in the NIT and we’re looking at a lot of unknowns for the offseason.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners

I agree. I'm just not sure what changes.

[Aaron 4,265]

13 minutes ago, southernindianahoosier2 said:

So Glass is leaving his athletic department he’s ran for 10 years with potentially no cash on hand, not making the tournament for 4 years, and leaving the brand heavily diluted according to current apathy levels.

How hard is it to write in a clause in Archie’s contract that if you don’t make the tournament for 3 years your buyout drops? It incentivizes Archie to win, and helps us cut bait if he fails. Did he learn nothing from the Crean contract and the mess he created with that? How do we not have any cash on hand to fire him if we need to? 


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners

You can add any clause in a contract you want (like what Glass did for Moren that she can't go to  Purdue without 10 million dollar buyout which was brilliant). The problem is no coach is going to agree to that clause with making tourney or buyout drops. You can try it (and IU might have) but no coach or lawyer will agree to such language. 

As I said above it is kind of cowardly for Glass to leave over Archie, but he would of been fired anyways and anyone else would do same including you or me. You would much rather resign from a job before being fired which I did in high school when I was about to get axed.  

As I said donors will pay out if needed once Glass is gone. Unfortunately, Glass has done so much else well and improved almost every other sport at IU, but basketball is what matters and he has really failed there and ultimately will be his demise as it should be. 

[coonhounds 8,793]

I am at the point I don't care who the next coach is I just want to win. I thought archie would be great so give me anyone who can win. This is pathetic. Reasons archie should not get another year are many. He hasn't beaten purdue he hasn't improved and only adds historical losses to his record. I am not sure making NCAA is enough for me anymore because of how embarrassing we look

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

[Alford Bailey 12,356]

19 minutes ago, JSHoosier said:

Great job managing the athletic department and it's most visible entity, Fred.

We have a new volleyball building though....

[southernindianahoosier2 902]

8 minutes ago, Aaron said:

You can add any clause in a contract you want (like what Glass did for Moren that she can't go to  Purdue without 10 million dollar buyout which was brilliant). The problem is no coach is going to agree to that clause with making tourney or buyout drops. You can try it (and IU might have) but no coach or lawyer will agree to such language. 

As I said above it is kind of cowardly for Glass to leave over Archie, but he would of been fired anyways and anyone else would do same including you or me. You would much rather resign from a job before being fired which I did in high school when I was about to get axed.  

As I said donors will pay out if needed once Glass is gone. Unfortunately, Glass has done so much else well and improved almost every other sport at IU, but basketball is what matters and he has really failed there and ultimately will be his demise as it should be. 

If there was a clause at the time of the hire that if he misses the tournament in his first 3 consecutive seasons, his buyout drops. Seems very reasonable to achieve. Seems pretty reasonable to agree to it if you want the job... at the time of hire people would have said that we would only miss the tourney 3 times in a row if it was a colossal failure. So if this is a colossal failure, why is the buyout $12million dollars right now/ cannot get out of it?

[HoosierFan1994 4,722]

14 minutes ago, coonhounds said:

I am at the point I don't care who the next coach is I just want to win. I thought archie would be great so give me anyone who can win. This is pathetic. Reasons archie should not get another year are many. He hasn't beaten purdue he hasn't improved and only adds historical losses to his record. I am not sure making NCAA is enough for me anymore because of how embarrassing we look

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
 

Same here. We all get hyped up about resumes. Go look at Bob Knights prior to IU. Imagine if BTown Banners was a thing in 1971. We all would have rioted. (Granted it was much harder to make the tournament in the 1960s). 

[Stuhoo 79,794]

9 minutes ago, HoosierFan1994 said:

Same here. We all get hyped up about resumes. Go look at Bob Knights prior to IU. Imagine if BTown Banners was a thing in 1971. We all would have rioted. (Granted it was much harder to make the tournament in the 1960s). 

You mean the last Lou Watson team which finished 17-7 and 9-5 in the Big Ten?

That team was magnificently successful in comparison.

[GnarlyTimGarl 1,433]

A few thoughts on the current state of IU basketball...

After the Wisconsin game in December, I made a post defending the team against all of the outrage that was directed by some fans against the team. At the time, it was the first loss of the season and I felt it was appropriate to give THIS YEAR'S team a chance to right the ship. There have been a number of disappointing losses since then. But I still held on to hope. I'm a fan. I follow IU basketball for a leisurely activity. I want to think the best. I try to be fair. I don't want to be miserable. However, the effort displayed by the team against Purdue was among the most disappointed I have ever been as a fan of IU basketball. The Purdue game was huge for about a hundred different reasons... and then the team played like they did.

It has become clear that this isn't working. We were told at the beginning of the era that we would push the pace on offense. We don't. We were told there would be variations of the motion to the offense. The offense stands still for multiple possessions in a row. My understanding is that our defense is predicated on packing the lane and forcing play away from the basket. Instead, we see guys driving into the lane without much resistance. (Anyone see Nojel Eastern's drive to the basket on the first play of the 2nd half? Unbelievable.) If by chance we do stop them in the lane, our rotations have shown to be poor in that we often leave guys WIDE open for outside shots. We were also told that every possession is important and there would be an emphasis on ball-security. Yet, we're among the worst in the league in turnover percentage. Add in the fact we are a poor shooting team. Again. To put it simply, we're not executing.

I've come to a point where I'm searching to find hope that this will get turned around. And I'm struggling to find answers. Can I put my hope in the players? I can with TJD... but who else? Right now, we have one "good" player and a bunch of random pieces. Some of which don't fit. Can I put my hope with the coaches? Not from their experience at IU. You have to look at Dayton success and it's fair to question if that translates to IU. You HAVE to make the tournament at IU. You HAVE to. That's the minimum. It shouldn't be THAT hard. Just be one of the Top 68 teams in the nation. That's all. Unless we get this thing turned around in a hurry, this coaching staff will have gone 0 for 3 in that regard. And that just can't happen.

I really think the Purdue game turned a lot of fans against Archie. That's not good. It would be nearly impossible to get them back. Once Crean lost them, he lost them. Didn't matter that he won another Big Ten championship. Support was gone. If the same has happened to Archie, it's over (barring a Final Four appearance... and even THEN, I'm still not sure.) So does IU let him go this year? Unlikely considering the buyout, new AD, etc. So we let this toxic environment play out for another year (at least.) How fun. Plenty of excitement, there.

I really want to believe we have bright days in our immediate future... but my fear is that we're about to re-live the end of the Crean tenure all over again. And that's not even getting into the mess that could be finding the right candidate to be the next head coach...

[Brass Cannon 24,271]

Let’s be honest here. Recruiting for 2021 is dead under Archie. It just is. Too easy for other coaches to negative recruit him. 
 

2021 is a loaded in state class. Firing Archie gives us a chance to get some of that talent. Keeping him means the new coach has to potentially play against those guys. 
 

There’s been no progress under Archie. Bite the bullet and move on dear god please. 

[Class of '66 Old Fart 84,062]

5 minutes ago, GnarlyTimGarl said:

A few thoughts on the current state of IU basketball...

After the Wisconsin game in December, I made a post defending the team against all of the outrage that was directed by some fans against the team. At the time, it was the first loss of the season and I felt it was appropriate to give THIS YEAR'S team a chance to right the ship. There have been a number of disappointing losses since then. But I still held on to hope. I'm a fan. I follow IU basketball for a leisurely activity. I want to think the best. I try to be fair. I don't want to be miserable. However, the effort displayed by the team against Purdue was among the most disappointed I have ever been as a fan of IU basketball. The Purdue game was huge for about a hundred different reasons... and then the team played like they did.

It has become clear that this isn't working. We were told at the beginning of the era that we would push the pace on offense. We don't. We were told there would be variations of the motion to the offense. The offense stands still for multiple possessions in a row. My understanding is that our defense is predicated on packing the lane and forcing play away from the basket. Instead, we see guys driving into the lane without much resistance. (Anyone see Nojel Eastern's drive to the basket on the first play of the 2nd half? Unbelievable.) If by chance we do stop them in the lane, our rotations have shown to be poor in that we often leave guys WIDE open for outside shots. We were also told that every possession is important and there would be an emphasis on ball-security. Yet, we're among the worst in the league in turnover percentage. Add in the fact we are a poor shooting team. Again. To put it simply, we're not executing.

I've come to a point where I'm searching to find hope that this will get turned around. And I'm struggling to find answers. Can I put my hope in the players? I can with TJD... but who else? Right now, we have one "good" player and a bunch of random pieces. Some of which don't fit. Can I put my hope with the coaches? Not from their experience at IU. You have to look at Dayton success and it's fair to question if that translates to IU. You HAVE to make the tournament at IU. You HAVE to. That's the minimum. It shouldn't be THAT hard. Just be one of the Top 68 teams in the nation. That's all. Unless we get this thing turned around in a hurry, this coaching staff will have gone 0 for 3 in that regard. And that just can't happen.

I really think the Purdue game turned a lot of fans against Archie. That's not good. It would be nearly impossible to get them back. Once Crean lost them, he lost them. Didn't matter that he won another Big Ten championship. Support was gone. If the same has happened to Archie, it's over (barring a Final Four appearance... and even THEN, I'm still not sure.) So does IU let him go this year? Unlikely considering the buyout, new AD, etc. So we let this toxic environment play out for another year (at least.) How fun. Plenty of excitement, there.

I really want to believe we have bright days in our immediate future... but my fear is that we're about to re-live the end of the Crean tenure all over again. And that's not even getting into the mess that could be finding the right candidate to be the next head coach...

[HoosierFan1994 4,722]

13 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

You mean the last Lou Watson team which finished 17-7 and 9-5 in the Big Ten?

That team was magnificently successful in comparison.

No-Knights Army record. It was okay but nothing great. People today would not have like the hire because of that. 

[Aaron 4,265]

33 minutes ago, southernindianahoosier2 said:

If there was a clause at the time of the hire that if he misses the tournament in his first 3 consecutive seasons, his buyout drops. Seems very reasonable to achieve. Seems pretty reasonable to agree to it if you want the job... at the time of hire people would have said that we would only miss the tourney 3 times in a row if it was a colossal failure. So if this is a colossal failure, why is the buyout $12million dollars right now/ cannot get out of it?

Like I said I would love to put that in a contract but you HAVE to get the coach to agree to that provision which is hard. You may NOT have ANY decent coaches to hire if you tried that. Would be worth a shot, just not sure its practical or realistic to get ANY high level coach we need to agree to.

[HoosierFan1994 4,722]

I was thinking the other day-in my IU fandom I've had what I consider 4 special teams (2002, 2012, 2013, and 2016). Only one of them made it past the Sweet 16. I'm amazed that kids today even root for IU considering Butler, Notre Dame, and Purdue have had more success recently. My buddy is a Patriots fan. I told him to enjoy Belichick as long as he can. There aren't too many out there like him. As IU fans we know this. I'm not saying IU can't ever win agian. But what Knight did from really 1972-1993 was special. It's hard to be that good for that long. To me, the blame is mainly on the IU administration. They let it get this bad. Davis did a special thing in 2002 but many IU fans knew he wasn't the long term answer. I felt like Sampson was wrong place at the wrong time. If he did that in 2018 instead of 2008 he would've been fine. Crean did an awesome job bringing IU back but he couldn't get over the hump. He also lost the culture of the program. Archie....well I don't know what to say about him. I think Saturday was it for me. I've defended him since day 1. I was even at Assembly Hall when he was introduced. He's been all talk. No accountability. Don't give me the APR or Bill of Rights stuff. I hope the new AD can turn this program around. 

[bigrod 2,848]

14 minutes ago, HoosierFan1994 said:

No-Knights Army record. It was okay but nothing great. People today would not have like the hire because of that. 

I think you have to look at it in context. It was Army. He made them a tough team to play with pretty limited talent.

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,623]

Are we talking basketball or Internet arguments?

Basketball.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,623]

Here is the thing I keep saying is the athletic department doesn't have the money to buy him out. Fred is not doing anything anymore, he is riding out till retirement. I will agree that it's as bad as ever right now but there is no money unless someone donates a lot. The athletic department has borrowed from my department twice in the last year with no plan on paying us back. 

Indiana has the donors to do it. Especially if they are mad enough. Mark Cuban probably wipes his butt with $17mil.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,623]

This is really the only way I see it happening is if Fred sees it this way.

Problem is he will be the one hiring the next coach and I don’t believe he will want that either.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

Problem is that Glass sees everything as being wonderful and peachy.


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,623]

You are correct Fred is leaving because he's not sure Archie is the guy anymore and he doesn't want to be the guy to have to make that decision. I've heard that from several people in athletics 

So then he’s a coward?


Sent from my iPhone using BtownBanners mobile app