TOM CREAN FIRED

[TrueHoosier62]

A good portion of our fan base believes IU will lose in the round of 64/32. There is extreme paranoia.

What is up for debate? You don't fake your way to a Big Ten title. I don't care what the SOS was. Indiana dominated their opponents, for the most part.

There are two games left. Two. This is real. No debating whether this team can contend.

There's always something debatable on a forum, including whether or not this team can "contend". Contend for what, sole ownership of a Big Ten title? Sure, I'll agree with you, we can contend for that. Contend for a Big Ten tournament championship? Less sure, seeing as we've never done it before, even with the advantage that we should have, playing it in our back yard. Contend for an NC? Not a snowball's chance in hell. We'd have to have too many things break our way, and we'd have to shoot lights out for six straight games. On a neutral court. Against considerably better competition than we've seen in the Big Ten. With Tom Crean as our coach. Pffffft.

[MadAboutIndiana]

There's always something debatable on a forum, including whether or not this team can "contend". Contend for what, sole ownership of a Big Ten title? Sure, I'll agree with you, we can contend for that. Contend for a Big Ten tournament championship? Less sure, seeing as we've never done it before, even with the advantage that we should have, playing it in our back yard. Contend for an NC? Not a snowball's chance in hell. We'd have to have too many things break our way, and we'd have to shoot lights out for six straight games. On a neutral court. Against considerably better competition than we've seen in the Big Ten. With Tom Crean as our coach. Pffffft.

How many teams have you seen play better basketball than Indiana during the conference season? There aren't many. Michigan State would be one. UNC, Kansas. Villanova I guess?

We have a deep, complete team and our fans are scared. It's laughable. This team can absolutely contend for the NCAA. It's a crapshoot. We have as good a chance as any IMO. Look around at these other teams! College ball is diluted right now.

There's always room for debate but you'd have to be ignorant or stupid to keep questioning whether Indiana has a tough team this year. It's as plain as day that this team is having a ball playing together.

[MadAboutIndiana]

The fact that Indiana hasn't won the BTT before...is absolutely irrelevant to this season. The BTT itself is kind of irrelevant, tbh.

[biteoftheapple]

The fact that Indiana hasn't won the BTT before...is absolutely irrelevant to this season. The BTT itself is kind of irrelevant, tbh.

The tourney is definitly not irelevant, considering the prize given to the winner. Its something quite different if you do not agree with the reason for it or not. I honestly feel the regular season should count more, but the powers do not agree.

[Brass Cannon]

Something to consider for next year is that Crean has fielded a top 10 offense at Indiana without Yogi.  Zellers freshman year was the number 4 offense. 

 

Seems like for Creans offenses to be successful its less about the PG and more about having shooters, a dynamic forward and a scoring big man.  We should have all of those things.  We don't need Newkirk to be Yogi, we need him to be Verdell Jones

[MadAboutIndiana]

The tourney is definitly not irelevant, considering the prize given to the winner. Its something quite different if you do not agree with the reason for it or not. I honestly feel the regular season should count more, but the powers do not agree.

True.

Never have understood why the committee values play in conference tournaments so much. Louisville getting the #1 overall seed in 2013 due to winning the Big East tourney was a joke.

[southsidehoosier]

Something to consider for next year is that Crean has fielded a top 10 offense at Indiana without Yogi. Zellers freshman year was the number 4 offense.

Seems like for Creans offenses to be successful its less about the PG and more about having shooters, a dynamic forward and a scoring big man. We should have all of those things. We don't need Newkirk to be Yogi, we need him to be Verdell Jones

Good thing to keep in mind.

[TrueHoosier62]

How many teams have you seen play better basketball than Indiana during the conference season? There aren't many. Michigan State would be one. UNC, Kansas. Villanova I guess?

We have a deep, complete team and our fans are scared. It's laughable. This team can absolutely contend for the NCAA. It's a crapshoot. We have as good a chance as any IMO. Look around at these other teams! College ball is diluted right now.

There's always room for debate but you'd have to be ignorant or stupid to keep questioning whether Indiana has a tough team this year. It's as plain as day that this team is having a ball playing together.

Jesus, I'm not even sure where to begin....but I'll try.

 

"Teams that have played better than Indiana during the conference season":

 

Penn State, Wisconsin & Michigan State come to mind. There are too many teams outside the conference for me to mention them all, but yes, Villanova, UNC, Kansas, Xavier, just to name a few, and there are probably, at least, another 10-15 teams, outside of our conference, who've played better ball than IU during the conference portion of our season.

 

"We have a deep, complete team and the NCAA is a crapshoot":

 

I might agree that we have a deep team, but that depends on what level of play you expect out of the bench. Ours is fair, decent, but hardly anything to hang your hat upon. And while the NCAA tournament involves a modicum of luck, it's hardly a crap shoot. To win six straight games against varying styles of play, athleticism and coaching, on neutral and sometimes not so neutral courts, you've got to be far more than just good, and a helluva lot more than lucky. That you think we can win it all simply because you perceive the tournament to be a crapshoot, says more about your own perception of our chances than I do.

 

"There's always room for debate but you'd have to be ignorant or stupid to keep questioning whether Indiana has a tough team this year. It's as plain as day that this team is having a ball playing together"

 

I consider myself neither stupid nor ignorant to question what to me, appears obvious. I don't think you're stupid or ignorant for disagreeing. I just disagree with you, that's all. The team can have a ball all they want. They can giggle and laugh and tickle each other for all I care. They just aren't, in my opinion, good enough or lucky enough, to contend for a NC

[coonhounds]

I don't jump off the fire tom crean train very easy just like I didn't jump on to fast either. I am impressed with our improvement this season but all I am saying is if we don't finish strong than I am not impressed. I will judge the entire body of work and that is far from completion

[MartintheMopMan]

Jesus, I'm not even sure where to begin....but I'll try.

 

"Teams that have played better than Indiana during the conference season":

 

Penn State, Wisconsin & Michigan State come to mind. There are too many teams outside the conference for me to mention them all, but yes, Villanova, UNC, Kansas, Xavier, just to name a few, and there are probably, at least, another 10-15 teams, outside of our conference, who've played better ball than IU during the conference portion of our season.

 

"We have a deep, complete team and the NCAA is a crapshoot":

 

I might agree that we have a deep team, but that depends on what level of play you expect out of the bench. Ours is fair, decent, but hardly anything to hang your hat upon. And while the NCAA tournament involves a modicum of luck, it's hardly a crap shoot. To win six straight games against varying styles of play, athleticism and coaching, on neutral and sometimes not so neutral courts, you've got to be far more than just good, and a helluva lot more than lucky. That you think we can win it all simply because you perceive the tournament to be a crapshoot, says more about your own perception of our chances than I do.

 

"There's always room for debate but you'd have to be ignorant or stupid to keep questioning whether Indiana has a tough team this year. It's as plain as day that this team is having a ball playing together"

 

I consider myself neither stupid nor ignorant to question what to me, appears obvious. I don't think you're stupid or ignorant for disagreeing. I just disagree with you, that's all. The team can have a ball all they want. They can giggle and laugh and tickle each other for all I care. They just aren't, in my opinion, good enough or lucky enough, to contend for a NC

Wait. You think Penn State has played better throughout it's conference season than Indiana has? Or they played better than Indiana in a single game?

[Stuhoo]

Jesus, I'm not even sure where to begin....but I'll try.

"Teams that have played better than Indiana during the conference season":

Penn State, Wisconsin & Michigan State come to mind. There are too many teams outside the conference for me to mention them all, but yes, Villanova, UNC, Kansas, Xavier, just to name a few, and there are probably, at least, another 10-15 teams, outside of our conference, who've played better ball than IU during the conference portion of our season.

"We have a deep, complete team and the NCAA is a crapshoot":

I might agree that we have a deep team, but that depends on what level of play you expect out of the bench. Ours is fair, decent, but hardly anything to hang your hat upon. And while the NCAA tournament involves a modicum of luck, it's hardly a crap shoot. To win six straight games against varying styles of play, athleticism and coaching, on neutral and sometimes not so neutral courts, you've got to be far more than just good, and a helluva lot more than lucky. That you think we can win it all simply because you perceive the tournament to be a crapshoot, says more about your own perception of our chances than I do.

"There's always room for debate but you'd have to be ignorant or stupid to keep questioning whether Indiana has a tough team this year. It's as plain as day that this team is having a ball playing together"

I consider myself neither stupid nor ignorant to question what to me, appears obvious. I don't think you're stupid or ignorant for disagreeing. I just disagree with you, that's all. The team can have a ball all they want. They can giggle and laugh and tickle each other for all I care. They just aren't, in my opinion, good enough or lucky enough, to contend for a NC

You really think that Penn State has played better than us during the conference season?!?

Yes, I understand that on one given night they played better than us, but that's why the total won/loss record is relevant.

Additionally, you may not think that our bench is deep, but it is merely deeper than any other big 10 team, save for possibly Michigan State.

[TrueHoosier62]

Wait. You think Penn State has played better throughout it's conference season than Indiana has? Or they played better than Indiana in a single game?

Just a single game of course. I may have taken his assertion incorrectly.

[Hovadipo]

RELEVANT:

https://instagram.com/p/BCWBBwuycfR/

[TrueHoosier62]

You really think that Penn State has played better than us during the conference season?!?

Yes, I understand that on one given night they played better than us, but that's why the total won/loss record is relevant.

Additionally, you may not think that our bench is deep, but it is merely deeper than any other big 10 team, save for possibly Michigan State.

I was only referring to a single game against Penn State. My point was to show that we are, perhaps, more capable of beating ourselves than any other team that might make the NCAA field. Our bench is good, and compared to other Big Ten teams, it's towards the top. But "MadaboutIU"s assertion dealt with how it might play in the NCAA and/or the larger field, and in that context, it's only average. Duke, UNC, Kentucky, Kansas, all have considerably deeper benches, with more talent than we do.

[VO5]

I was only referring to a single game against Penn State. My point was to show that we are, perhaps, more capable of beating ourselves than any other team that might make the NCAA field. Our bench is good, and compared to other Big Ten teams, it's towards the top. But "MadaboutIU"s assertion dealt with how it might play in the NCAA and/or the larger field, and in that context, it's only average. Duke, UNC, Kentucky, Kansas, all have considerably deeper benches, with more talent than we do.

Duke plays 7 guys, and I'll take our bench over UK's any day of the week. I'll give you UNC and Kansas, but I don't think you're giving us enough credit

[ALASKA HOOSIER]

Much more to be done. That is all....

[Btownhoosier25]

Much more to be done. That is all....

What outcome will be acceptable in your opinion? Sweet 16 at least?

[ALASKA HOOSIER]

Elite eight or better.

[Stuhoo]

I was only referring to a single game against Penn State. My point was to show that we are, perhaps, more capable of beating ourselves than any other team that might make the NCAA field. Our bench is good, and compared to other Big Ten teams, it's towards the top. But "MadaboutIU"s assertion dealt with how it might play in the NCAA and/or the larger field, and in that context, it's only average. Duke, UNC, Kentucky, Kansas, all have considerably deeper benches, with more talent than we do.

Hate to nitpick, but "more capable of beating ourselves than any other team" is waaayyy too strong.

Pretty much every team has been capable of beating themselves against inferior competition. Did you see #1 Kansas versus 12-17 Oklahoma State, Purdue against Illinois, UK against Auburn, Maryland against Minne-freakin-sota? This happens everywhere, and at Penn St, while not a "good loss", is not that bad a loss.

[Brass Cannon]

For me a successful season will be at least 6 postseason games played.