Do Not Fire Mike Woodson

[coonhounds]

Keep in line Mods. Personal attacks are written in the forum rules.

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Good to see your very active in this thread. Quit worrying about other posters and start posting how great coach woodson is! That's what this is all about

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[ebridges24]

Don't fire Mike Woodson

[bird4par]

5 hours ago, Schreckbagger said:

Fun Fact: CMW has a 63% winning percent as coach at IU. 3rd best in 60 years at IU.

 

 

 

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That’ll keep you in Blue Blood status   

[str8baller]

10 hours ago, Schreckbagger said:

Fun Fact: CMW has a 63% winning percent as coach at IU. 3rd best in 60 years at IU.

 

 

 

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60 seasons technically brings in Branch so he’d be 4th best. Remove Branch and we’ve only had one good coach in that time plus 1.5 seasons of Sampson. So while an interesting framing, it is kind of damning with faint praise. Either way, I’d concede he’s better than Watson, Oliver, Davis and Archie. 
 

The scary thing is that outside of Branch and Knight, we’re basically not much. Almost no intuitional inertia. 

[go iu bb]

18 hours ago, str8baller said:

60 seasons technically brings in Branch so he’d be 4th best. Remove Branch and we’ve only had one good coach in that time plus 1.5 seasons of Sampson. So while an interesting framing, it is kind of damning with faint praise. Either way, I’d concede he’s better than Watson, Oliver, Davis and Archie. 
 

The scary thing is that outside of Branch and Knight, we’re basically not much. Almost no intuitional inertia. 

Yep, the more hires we see the more obvious it becomes that IU really just got lucky on a few hires. Just look to how inept the football team has historically been as evidence of this in addition to other basketball coaches you mentioned.

[str8baller]

16 hours ago, go iu bb said:

Yep, the more hires we see the more obvious it becomes that IU really just got lucky on a few hires. Just look to how inept the football team has historically been as evidence of this in addition to other basketball coaches you mentioned.

At one point we were the only school with two coaches with multiple titles in basketball. That fact along with Everett Dean (essentially 3 HoF coaches hired in a 50yr stretch ) would’ve made me think IU was different. And maybe we were at one point, a long time ago. Whatever magic might have existed has long run its course. 

[str8baller]

12 hours ago, Schreckbagger said:

So "technically" you're saying Dakich was better.....‍

I reality, if using McCracken in the mix, it goes back 84 years and 11 coaches.

Yep, outside of the magic in a bottle hire like RMK, next coach historically won't won't move the needle.

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I don’t really count Dakich. Probably shouldn’t even include Oliver, either. Less than one season isn’t much of a tell.  
 

I only mentioned McCracken because if you count the last 60 seasons on bball ref, McCracken’s last season was exactly 60 seasons ago. He went 19-5 and is indisputably our second best coach ever.  
 

If we leave Dean (interesting career, fwiw) aside since most of his greatness was accomplished else where, it’s not a real high bar to get to #3 all-time on IU’s list. A B10 champ and FF run for Woody would probably do it assuming he doesn’t have any more seasons like last year on his way out. 

[ebridges24]

D.N.F.M.W.

[bird4par]

On 8/10/2024 at 8:55 AM, Schreckbagger said:

Fun Fact: CMW has a 63% winning percent as coach at IU. 3rd best in 60 years at IU.

 

 

 

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That is right in line with IU's win percentage of .634

 

Indiana Hoosiers Men's Basketball
2024–25 Indiana Hoosiers men's basketball team
University	Indiana University Bloomington
First season	1901
All-time record	1,931-1,117 (.634)

[go iu bb]

So the argument to keep Woodson seems to be that while he might not be that good, we probably won't do better so should just be happy with mediocrity. Cool.

[AH1971]

34 minutes ago, go iu bb said:

So the argument to keep Woodson seems to be that while he might not be that good, we probably won't do better so should just be happy with mediocrity. Cool.

Or...and hear me out....you don't fire a coach every 2-3 seasons and actually let him try and build something. Novel concept I know. 

[PartyintheVillas]

1 hour ago, AH1971 said:

Or...and hear me out....you don't fire a coach every 2-3 seasons and actually let him try and build something. Novel concept I know. 

Mike Davis got 6 seasons.

Sampson got 1.5, but fired for reasons other than not winning enough

Crean got 9 seasons.

Miller got 5 seasons.

Woodson is currently preparing for his 4th.

Coaches are not being fired every 2-3 years. Coaches are being given opportunities to build a consistent winner, and none have so far since the year 2000.

Edited August 12, 2024 by PartyintheVillas

[go iu bb]

3 minutes ago, PartyintheVillas said:

Mike Davis got 6 seasons.

Sampson got 1.5, but fired for reasons other than not winning enough

Crean got 9 seasons.

Miller got 5 seasons.

Woodson is currently preparing for his 4th.

Coaches are not being fired every 2-3 years. Coaches are being given opportunities to build a consistent winner, and none have so far since the year 2000. In fact, the final seasons for Davis, Sampson, Crean, and Miller resulted in 2 NCAA tournament appearances, a loss in the second round by a Mike Davis team and a loss in the first round by a Sampson/Dakich team.

Miller "only" got 4 seasons but your point still stands. 

[AH1971]

1 minute ago, PartyintheVillas said:

Mike Davis got 6 seasons.

Sampson got 1.5, but fired for reasons other than not winning enough

Crean got 9 seasons.

Miller got 5 seasons.

Woodson is currently preparing for his 4th.

Miller got 4 seasons and if it were up to the large majority of this board, Woodson would have been gone after this past season. IU's had five different coaches this century, running a coach off at a rate of just under 5 seasons isn't a recipe for success. No way to ever find continuity when you're constantly turning over.

[TTT]

My estimation roughly $40,000,000 to $50,000,000 million in head coach salaries only;  for century 21…sounds like a good gig if you can get it.

[bird4par]

4 hours ago, go iu bb said:

So the argument to keep Woodson seems to be that while he might not be that good, we probably won't do better so should just be happy with mediocrity. Cool.

IMO - this is way above the head coach. The IU administration has been pretty much a joke.  

[go iu bb]

1 hour ago, Schreckbagger said:

Least us not forget, the guy who won 3 National Championships had 29 seasons at IU.

And, can't forget the 24 years of Branch at IU that gave us 2 NC's.

What a coincidence huh.....

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Winning coaches get to stay a long time? How shocking. 

Woodson is nowhere close to being as good as either of those two. Being better than Archie Miller doesn't automatically make him the next Knight or McCracken.

[LamarCheeks]

1 hour ago, Schreckbagger said:

Least us not forget, the guy who won 3 National Championships had 29 seasons at IU.

And, can't forget the 24 years of Branch at IU that gave us 2 NC's.

What a coincidence huh.....

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Some context ... 

RMK went to the Final Four in his second season, the Elite Eight in his fourth and won a natty in his fifth. 

McCracken won a natty in his second year and was  87-17 (.840) over his first five seasons. 

[LamarCheeks]

16 minutes ago, Schreckbagger said:

More content.....Mike Davis went to a Championship game in year one. Tom Creans team was ranked #1 for a good part of one season.

 

Neither have a better win percentage than CMW.

 

Both were fired.

 

McCracken had 3 loosing seasons in 24 yrs at IU. He didn't get fired.

 

RMK's NC team at 32-0 was followed up by his next team that went 14-13. He didn't get fired either.

 

Hope that helps....

 

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No need to get all huffy. 

I was just pointing out that RMK and McCracken were very successful in their first five seasons. Comparing their tenures to Archie and Woody is sorta like the old apples-oranges cliche. 

And it would help if I knew what a loosing season was ... 

[TTT]

Accounting for inflation/cost of living….I wonder how salaries, support staff including cost when comparing Branch McCracken and Bob Knight to the 21st century IU men’s basketball coaches and staff.