Fire Coach Woodson Thread

[TTT 830]

Hey there, this is coach.  Looky what $6,000,000 dollars will buy!

[Juwan Moye 213]

I’m still not confident that our coach will put these young men in the right position to maximize success this year. My “way too early” guess is a top-6 B1G finish with a round of 32 exit.

 

Just enough for some people to think he should still be around, but bad enough with the talent where most still want him gone.

[TTT 830]

12 minutes ago, Juwan Moye said:

I’m still not confident that our coach will put these young men in the right position to maximize success this year. My “way too early” guess is a top-6 B1G finish with a round of 32 exit.

 

Just enough for some people to think he should still be around, but bad enough with the talent where most still want him gone.

Games that IU actually won by a few points among the many losses….Post games even against (not good teams) Coach Woodson will talk about;  how good IU played, winning is hard, we made shots, and games come down to the difference of a play or two.  That was a great win against a really good team.  These are teams that IU should have beat by no less than 15 to 20.  

[AKHoosier 6,654]

6 minutes ago, Juwan Moye said:

I’m still not confident that our coach will put these young men in the right position to maximize success this year. My “way too early” guess is a top-6 B1G finish with a round of 32 exit.

 

Just enough for some people to think he should still be around, but bad enough with the talent where most still want him gone.

We win the offseason again. I'm not at all convinced this is a tournament team.

Ballo raises our floor, but he is not an upgrade over Ware. Plus those FT shooting numbers will cost us late in some games. 

We've done nothing to fix our most glaring issue, which is shooting. I don't want to hear people telling me how excited I should be about adding guys who shot 30% from 3 last year. That doesn't mean the issue has been solved, it means the jury is still out.

I do like Rice. We needed Conwell though.

Mgbako is a big key for next year. If he picks up where we left off, we could be very solid. 

[Juwan Moye 213]

15 minutes ago, TTT said:

Games that IU actually won by a few points among the many losses….Post games even against (not good teams) Coach Woodson will talk about;  how good IU played, winning is hard, we made shots, and games come down to the difference of a play or two.  That was a great win against a really good team.  These are teams that IU should have beat by no less than 15 to 20.  

This is my worry again this year. Early season, we squeak by some KenPom 300+ team because we give up 10+ threes, and it feels like deja vu. Some fans try to convince us the Army and Florida Gulf Coast are underrated and the analytics are flawed. But in reality, we’re about to get torched by the three all year.

I REALLY prefer to be wrong here and would be so happy if coach actually adjusts. I’m just not optimistic based on everything we’ve said, and everything he’s said, up to this point.

 

[Juwan Moye 213]

10 minutes ago, AKHoosier said:

We win the offseason again. I'm not at all convinced this is a tournament team.

Ballo raises our floor, but he is not an upgrade over Ware. Plus those FT shooting numbers will cost us late in some games. 

We've done nothing to fix our most glaring issue, which is shooting. I don't want to hear people telling me how excited I should be about adding guys who shot 30% from 3 last year. That doesn't mean the issue has been solved, it means the jury is still out.

I do like Rice. We needed Conwell though.

Mgbako is a big key for next year. If he picks up where we left off, we could be very solid. 

I expect Ballo to be an upgrade early in the season over what Ware was early last year but late in the season it’s even if not worse because Ware really came into his own at the end of the year AND his game compliments Reneau better.

 

Agreed on the shooting concerns as well. Crimson colored glasses fans act like everyone progresses as a shooter each year but they can go backwards as well. The optimist in me hopes that better guard play can make it that come true but it’s far from a guarantee.

[TTT 830]

Team basketball intelligence IQ is a big factor which also coincides with shooting percentages.  The 3 ball is a big part of the game nowadays and 3 is more than 2.  Plus the old 2 point play plus 1 still equals 3.  And then the defense and team quickness and team speed and rebounding and low turnovers and efficiency of execution of it all.  All for $6,000,000.

One guarantee that all these upgrades/adjustments/money etc do is that in like other programs not meeting expectations….It Buys More Time for Vested Party/s Involved.

[TTT 830]

20 minutes ago, Juwan Moye said:

This is my worry again this year. Early season, we squeak by some KenPom 300+ team because we give up 10+ threes, and it feels like deja vu. Some fans try to convince us the Army and Florida Gulf Coast are underrated and the analytics are flawed. But in reality, we’re about to get torched by the three all year.

I REALLY prefer to be wrong here and would be so happy if coach actually adjusts. I’m just not optimistic based on everything we’ve said, and everything he’s said, up to this point.

 

That’s the old IU football tradition and in reality still is up to this point.

[AH1971 1,353]

49 minutes ago, Juwan Moye said:

I expect Ballo to be an upgrade early in the season over what Ware was early last year but late in the season it’s even if not worse because Ware really came into his own at the end of the year AND his game compliments Reneau better.

 

Agreed on the shooting concerns as well. Crimson colored glasses fans act like everyone progresses as a shooter each year but they can go backwards as well. The optimist in me hopes that better guard play can make it that come true but it’s far from a guarantee.

Unless Rice/Carlyle develop some kind of hitch in their shot and/or just completely forget how to shoot a basketball and lose all confidence, both will be more than adequate perimeter shooters next year. Will they hit at the magical 40 number next year? Probably not, don’t need too. 35% on 1.5-2 makes a game and IU will have a top 15 offense.

[Juwan Moye 213]

30 minutes ago, AH1971 said:

Unless Rice/Carlyle develop some kind of hitch in their shot and/or just completely forget how to shoot a basketball and lose all confidence, both will be more than adequate perimeter shooters next year. Will they hit at the magical 40 number next year? Probably not, don’t need too. 35% on 1.5-2 makes a game and IU will have a top 15 offense.

Last year’s offense was ranked 105th in the country. We will need A LOT to go really right to be a top-15 offense. CMWs highest ranked offense so far was 28th and that was with JHS and TJD.

[AH1971 1,353]

34 minutes ago, Juwan Moye said:

Last year’s offense was ranked 105th in the country. We will need A LOT to go really right to be a top-15 offense. CMWs highest ranked offense so far was 28th and that was with JHS and TJD.

Not relying on Trey Galloway to be your lead guard for 35 games on top of Gabe Cupps being asked to run the show for 75% of the conference season should go a long way. Rice/Carlyle/Mgbako is a significantly better trio than JHS/Galloway/Kopp and Reneau/Ballo is a better front court than Thompson/Ballo, at least offensively.

[iu eyedoc 1,736]

1 hour ago, AH1971 said:

Unless Rice/Carlyle develop some kind of hitch in their shot and/or just completely forget how to shoot a basketball and lose all confidence, both will be more than adequate perimeter shooters next year. Will they hit at the magical 40 number next year? Probably not, don’t need too. 35% on 1.5-2 makes a game and IU will have a top 15 offense.

 

You realize you are saying the addition of 1.8 to 2.8 additional made threes vs the departure of the 1.2 total  made by X and Gunn, who actually collectively shot at 35% instead of your wishful increase from 29%, transforms this offense?

 

And this addition of 3 for 8 or 4 for 11 from three from your "shooter" transfers  along with the loss of the best of the bad shooters in the 344th ranked 3 pt team turns this offense in to a top 15 offense?

If you mean top 15 in the Big 10, I agree.

If you mean that somehow morphs the 215th ranked offense(PPG) to 15th nationally...

 

 

[AH1971 1,353]

18 minutes ago, iu eyedoc said:

 

You realize you are saying the addition of 1.8 to 2.8 additional made threes vs the departure of the 1.2 total  made by X and Gunn, who actually collectively shot at 35% instead of your wishful increase from 29%, transforms this offense?

 

And this addition of 3 for 8 or 4 for 11 from three from your "shooter" transfers  along with the loss of the best of the bad shooters in the 344th ranked 3 pt team turns this offense in to a top 15 offense?

If you mean top 15 in the Big 10, I agree.

If you mean that somehow morphs the 215th ranked offense(PPG) to 15th nationally...

 

 

Jesus dude, it’s about volume. Quit looking at raw percentages. Assuming Carlyle and Rice are healthy and play the entire season, 1.5-2 makes a game at around 35% for each is ~55-70 made 3’s per player. Xavier Johnson and CJ Gunn COMBINED made 28 3 pointers last year. Did you seriously think you were clever posting this as some kind of gotcha?

[Juwan Moye 213]

18 minutes ago, AH1971 said:

Not relying on Trey Galloway to be your lead guard for 35 games on top of Gabe Cupps being asked to run the show for 75% of the conference season should go a long way. Rice/Carlyle/Mgbako is a significantly better trio than JHS/Galloway/Kopp and Reneau/Ballo is a better front court than Thompson/Ballo, at least offensively.

Valid points but I also think that if Vegas had a line on where our offense will end up this year it’d be closer to the 30s-40s than top-15.

Personally, while offense is fun, I’m more excited to see improvements on the defensive end. And in particular, defending the three point line.

 

[iu eyedoc 1,736]

18 minutes ago, AH1971 said:

Jesus dude, it’s about volume. Quit looking at raw percentages. Assuming Carlyle and Rice are healthy and play the entire season, 1.5-2 makes a game for each is ~55-70 made 3’s per player. Xavier Johnson and CJ Gunn COMBINED made 28 3 pointers last year. Did you really think you were clever posting this?

Let's do the  shot volume math with your numbers. We'll take your pie in the sky high ends for sh*ts and giggles. 140 made 3's on 400 attempts at your mythical 35%

An additional 420 points on offense.

Now let's subtract those 400 additional shots from IU's 2 point shooting last season which shot at .534 from inside the arc.

That is  214 made 2's for a grand total of...class...anyone...428 pts.

I'm kind of a simple guy. Help me figure out how subtracting 428 pts and adding 420 points skyrockets the 215th ranked offense to top 15.

 

[AH1971 1,353]

1 minute ago, iu eyedoc said:

Let's do the math. We'll take your pie in the sky high ends for sh*ts and giggles. 140 made 3's on 400 attempts at your mythical 35%

An additional 420 points on offense.

Now let's subtract those 400 additional shots from IU's 2 point shooting last season which shot at .534 from inside the arc.

That is  214 made 2's for a grand total of...class...428 pts.

I'm kind of a simple guy. Help me figure out how subtracting 428 pts and adding 420 points skyrockets the 215th ranked offense to top 15.

 

Carlyle and Rice not going to make a shot inside the arc or at the free throw line next year lol?

[iu eyedoc 1,736]

1 minute ago, AH1971 said:

Carlyle and Rice not going to make a shot inside the arc or at the free throw line next year lol?

What are you talking about? You want to add 400 3 pt attempts but not subtract 2 pt attempts? Are you honestly saying IU is going to add 400+ offensive possessions?  Those shots are coming from somewhere.

[AH1971 1,353]

4 minutes ago, iu eyedoc said:

Let's do the math. We'll take your pie in the sky high ends for sh*ts and giggles. 140 made 3's on 400 attempts at your mythical 35%

An additional 420 points on offense.

Now let's subtract those 400 additional shots from IU's 2 point shooting last season which shot at .534 from inside the arc.

That is  214 made 2's for a grand total of...class...428 pts.

I'm kind of a simple guy. Help me figure out how subtracting 428 pts and adding 420 points skyrockets the 215th ranked offense to top 15.

 

Also you understand that between Galloway, Cupps, Johnson, Leal, and Gunn, the 5 of them combined went 77/238 for 32% last year. You get that correct? Asking how the offense will improve with two guys shooting 35% from 3 on volume before even taking into consideration production from Mgbako, Reneau, and Ballo is legit asinine.

[Hornsby 1,640]

We win the offseason again. I'm not at all convinced this is a tournament team.
Ballo raises our floor, but he is not an upgrade over Ware. Plus those FT shooting numbers will cost us late in some games. 
We've done nothing to fix our most glaring issue, which is shooting. I don't want to hear people telling me how excited I should be about adding guys who shot 30% from 3 last year. That doesn't mean the issue has been solved, it means the jury is still out.
I do like Rice. We needed Conwell though.
Mgbako is a big key for next year. If he picks up where we left off, we could be very solid. 

But Woodson said he is here to win national titles. Well he bought his best roster yet so the expectation need to be sky high. 20 wins isn't going to cut it now


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[AH1971 1,353]

16 minutes ago, iu eyedoc said:

What are you talking about? You want to add 400 3 pt attempts but not subtract 2 pt attempts? Are you honestly saying IU is going to add 400+ offensive possessions?  Those shots are coming from somewhere.

400 extra possessions equates to roughly 11 more possessions a game over the course of a 35 game season. Playing at a slightly faster tempo with dynamic guards + Ballo’s offensive rebounding potency doesn’t make this nearly as far fetched as you want to make it out to be. And that’s using the absolute high end scenario I ascribed.