IUBB vs Wisconsin - 02/15/22 @ 9:00 on ESPN2

[Josh 13,229]

5 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

I'm sure there is even alcohol involved for some. 

Most IU fans right now

 

[Josh 13,229]

1 minute ago, IU - Kaulie said:

He can do or say whatever he wants until we do something about it.  

I know what I'd do about it.  Hopefully somebody's fist feels the same way

[AKHoosier 7,700]

1 hour ago, IUFAN1976 said:

It’s obvious that some people on here didn’t approve of the CMW hire in the first place.

Ya think? 

Honestly, this one just sucks. Wanted this win bad, but Wisconsin just has our number. They find ways to win.

A depressing thought: we're now 3-23 against UW over the last 26 games. 

That means there's a whole generation of Wisconsin fans coming of age at a time when the IU game is a guaranteed win.

[IU - Kaulie 2,101]

3 minutes ago, Josh said:

I know what I'd do about it.  Hopefully somebody's fist feels the same way

I know that’s the problem.  I don’t know if we have anyone that does.

[IU_FanClub 1,857]

I don't regret coming down here to Bloomington to support the team and try to bring home a win at all. I love Bloomington and I love IU. But this **** is getting really old. Yeah this roster has it's deficiencies but it is more than good enough to at least make the tournament. Woody has been completely lost for a few weeks now and whether or not any of us agree on them, those suspensions are going to end up costing us the season. We have a roster full of players that have never won consistently before and they **** down their leg at the end of games all the time. Don't even know what to think at this point and I usually have a really positive outlook but I just can't see us making the tournament at this point.

[Trish 14,473]

Just now, AKHoosier said:

Ya think? 

Honestly, this one just sucks. Wanted this win bad, but Wisconsin just has our number. They find ways to win.

A depressing thought: we're now 3-23 against UW over the last 26 games. 

That means there's a whole generation of Wisconsin fans coming of age at a time when the IU game is a guaranteed win.

It’s even worse when our coaching staff takes a good majority of the blame in both of our losses this year to Wisconsin. 
 

Up 22 at Wisconsin, then we lose. 
 

Up until the 2 minutes last night, then lose. 
 

Yeah this roster isn’t all that talented and it’s not his kids, but we had opportunities to beat Wisconsin twice this year and we failed to do so. Not great. 
 

[HoosierTrav 8,331]

7 hours ago, HoosierHoops1 said:

 

The committee isn't supposed to use a losing streak for any kind of getting into the tournament. It's body of work, regardless of how the last few games went. Seeding can be argued based on recent success or failure but making the tourney is not supposed to be based on that.

We win 3 of the 5 and we are in, win 2 of the 5 and round 1 in b1g tourney and we're likely in. For people to give up now, they need to give up sports.

How often has the committee left everyone scratching their heads, in regard to deciding on teams, based off of their own guidelines? Every year. I’m not sure people are giving up per se. Many of us see a familiar trend and it doesn’t require psychic abilities to forecast how the last 5 games are going to go. This team and program is broken. 
 

Not going to give up sports but I’ll admit that giving up on IU basketball would probably be best for my and many’s health. Not gotten much roi for my time. 

[HoosierAloha 30,102]

2 minutes ago, AKHoosier said:

Ya think? 

Honestly, this one just sucks. Wanted this win bad, but Wisconsin just has our number. They find ways to win.

A depressing thought: we're now 3-23 against UW over the last 26 games. 

That means there's a whole generation of Wisconsin fans coming of age at a time when the IU game is a guaranteed win.

Woody can still turn it around. He has a lot of work to do.

I'm still beyond shocked he would have P Stew handling the ball and draw that (whatever that was supposed to be) up as the play that would tie the game.

I think the reality of the college game has staggered Woody a bit. Let's see how he gets back up.

[Alford Bailey 13,227]

Typical IU over the last couple years. TJD goes off against inferior talent and Race does his thing. Everybody else sucked. I’m sure Wisconsin is perfectly happy with Galloway trying to score under a minute.

[Josh 13,229]

11 minutes ago, IU - Kaulie said:

I know that’s the problem.  I don’t know if we have anyone that does.

Exactly.  Any players who aren't fired up and pissed off about it will never be a winner on the court.  Any fan who isn't fired up about it doesn't deserve to say the players aren't good enough.  

I don't know if our players know because they weren't near him, but there is clearly video of it at the conclusion of the game.  I hope somebody gets it to them today to light that fire

[reconmkd 4,750]

6 minutes ago, HoosierAloha said:

Woody can still turn it around. He has a lot of work to do.

I'm still beyond shocked he would have P Stew handling the ball and draw that (whatever that was supposed to be) up as the play that would tie the game.

I think the reality of the college game has staggered Woody a bit. Let's see how he gets back up.

What ever double screen action Woody set up there was absolutely blown up by Wisc switching on both screens and our players fold and just stand there. There is no one on this team that can get there own shot, especially under pressure. Even Woody said after the play was blown up, the offense just froze. HOW does a team full of players that have been playing basketball for over a decade in their lives not know what to do when a play gets blown up? How do those players just stand around the ball and look lost? For Christ's sake, once the play is blown, EVERY ONE, except for a ball handler to help out of a trap situation, RUN AWAY FROM THE BALL TO SPREAD THE FLOOR, IT IS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE! CLEAR OUT!

[IU - Kaulie 2,101]

2 minutes ago, Josh said:

Exactly.  Any players who aren't fired up and pissed off about it will never be a winner on the court.  Any fan who isn't fired up about it doesn't deserve to say the players aren't good enough.  

I don't know if our players know because they weren't near him, but there is clearly video of it at the conclusion of the game.  I hope somebody gets it to them today to light that fire

Let’s face it.  IU is a team you can talk trash to because we will just go stupid in the head.  You can’t talk trash or shouldn’t to a team like Wisco, PU, or Illinois but you can do it without fear against IU.

[IUFAN1976 4,320]

23 minutes ago, AKHoosier said:

Ya think? 

Honestly, this one just sucks. Wanted this win bad, but Wisconsin just has our number. They find ways to win.

A depressing thought: we're now 3-23 against UW over the last 26 games. 

That means there's a whole generation of Wisconsin fans coming of age at a time when the IU game is a guaranteed win.

I guess what comes around goes around.  I remember they day when the script was flipped.  It’ll turn around for us eventually!  When?  I have no idea but it better happen soon, the natives are way past being restless!

[MikeRoberts 7,993]

1 hour ago, brumdog45 said:

But what is the point of pissing in the cornflakes of those of us who do want to have hope?  What's in it for you?

I just don't get the MO of coming in after a loss -- especially a game that was tight, emotional loss -- to say 'we suck, I was right'?

I don’t think it’s a matter of feeling right, it’s a matter of being upset that the glaring issues that were there on day one are still there at the end of the season.

I just don’t understand the need for some to have such blind faith and feel the need to rip apart anyone that doesn’t.

it’s the inability for many to acknowledge our struggles and to call BS that is mind boggling. Parker Stewart stood around all game, barely moving until he got scratched and then lost a 1x1 battle thereafter. Go back and watch the early games of Parker Stewart and guess what, he stood around all game yet he has continued to play and play and play and play. 

There has been no development of culture. It’s been talked about but has it been implemented? No. 28 games in and the same players are standing around and being rewarded for playing time. So, when people don’t believe that culture is being built in a good way, there are reasons all around us

[HoosierAloha 30,102]

8 hours ago, str8baller said:

So I know you harp on this some, but the truth is complicated. Basically, a college coach shouldn’t have to teach most of that stuff. And if he does, then you won’t have a good team, even if you have Brad Stevens on the sidelines. 
 

Practice time is limited. A good continuity offense takes multiple seasons to install. So you have to dedicate time to that even though it won’t pay big dividends right away. Team defense can be built throughout a season, and Woody has done a solid job here. 
 

The rest of the stuff…okay, say you have to spend 5 min every practice reminding TJD not to hunt blocks. Then 5 min reinforcing Parker S not to extend his arm and get charges when he drives. Then 10 min coddling XJs emotional problems. Then five reminding Race about situational awareness behind the 3 pt line.  
 

And you know what, you should probably teach that if you must. but after a while it adds up to real time in your two hr practice. And what are Matt Painter and Gard doing during that time? Not teaching HS jv fundamentals. No…they’re installing more advanced stuff and doing game week gameplan implementation. And Gard doesn’t have to teach Davis because over the summer (when players get better) Davis worked his butt off becoming a better player when Gard wasn’t  around.  
 

As the years go by Woody will own more and more of the program. Right now we’ve got problems on our hands that can’t be solved with extra layup drills and FTs. 

I'm not disagreeing that a college coach shouldn't have to do these things. A college coach should know what he has and what he has to emphasize. Getting these small things set in your first year so they don't manifest throughout your tenure is important. Having players absorb this information so they're teaching the next group of incoming freshmen and possibly transfers is critical.

We had 10 (?) extra practices and an overseas trip to get some of these issues addressed. There should be plenty of film and material distributed so when practice starts you're ensuring they picked it up. I know players are taking classes in summer but let's not kid ourselves that it is taking up that much time.

I understand what Woody was trying to do with giving players freedom but that should only go so far. There needs to be an acceptable window players are allowed to play in. Again, some film breakdown that players can study on their own time. You back that up during cupcake season to reinforce habits. "Trayce, I like the e and e but we're pushing that boundary of acceptable." See how the players react, back to knowing your personnel. "Race, we're not taking that shot in that situation." It's not hurting you that much in games you win sleep walking. It's building an environment, culture, etc. and reinforcing good habits are rewarded and bad habits won't be tolerated.

I love me some XJ, the reason is personal and in a different realm than basketball. That dude turned out pretty okay when the right leaders took him under their wings. XJ hasn't developed to where I had hoped but he showed some signs for a few games. I think this could have paid massive dividends if molded properly. Again, back to the summer and early noncon season. In the summer, I'd have Rob all up in his **** and have the officials not calling it. Put him in those positions where he is going to lost it and show him what is an acceptable response. You control that environment and can build good habits from it.

We shouldn't be in the position where these fundamentals have to be taught, monitored and reinforced but we are. This has been a problem at IU for years. We get talent and try to go 60 mph without knowing if the players can start the damn vehicle or put it in drive. It starts with fundamentals and knowing who and what you have.

We're coming down the home stretch and, with the game on the line, Woody put the ball in the hands of someone who should be catching and shooting not creating. That's even more evidence that from top to bottom we didn't put in the work that we needed last summer to succeed in crunch time.

[Stuhoo 89,311]

1 hour ago, Trish said:

He’s not wrong, folks. 

 

It's more than "he's not wrong." He's right.

Was thinking about who are the third and fourth best overall players on this team. Probably even with all of his flaws X is clearly our third best overall player. Which means that none of our three best overall players have the ability to hit an outside shot with any minimum consistency. 

Our fourth best overall player? Yikes, that's really a tough one. Now think around the B1G to other teams third and fourth best overall players. Forget the Purdue, OSU, Illinois comparisons -- those are top 20 teams nationally.

We compare favorably against Minny and Nebraska for sure, but after that even PSU, Maryland, and NW arguably have better "third and fourth best overall players." The third and fourth best overall options on the lower half of the B1G:

• PSU: After Harrar and Pickett they still have Lundy and Sessoms
• Maryland: After Fatts and Ayala there's still Donta Scott and Hakeem Hart
• NW: After Buie and Nance there's still Audidge and Ryan Young

None of those teams have a player nearly as good as Trayce; arguably none of those teams have any players as effective as Race,  but I'd take any of those six I listed over a whole bunch of our role players.

 

[HoosierAloha 30,102]

35 minutes ago, Josh said:

Exactly.  Any players who aren't fired up and pissed off about it will never be a winner on the court.  Any fan who isn't fired up about it doesn't deserve to say the players aren't good enough.  

I don't know if our players know because they weren't near him, but there is clearly video of it at the conclusion of the game.  I hope somebody gets it to them today to light that fire

I wouldn't really say I'm fired up over it. They punked us, again, and we took it. Who didn't see Davison using his shenanigans before this game? He did and we lost our ****.

Look how the players responded in the MSU game after being suspended. They had some fight, it was just directed in a horrible manner. The team is disconnected with what they're trying to do.

How much trust is being given when we have one of our worst defenders guarding their best player and giving up buckets? How much trust do you think we have when you run that last play and we look like fools? How does it feel when you build the slightest of leads and then the entire bench is put in to give it up time after time after time?

We have a tiny window to win games against the better teams in the Big 1.o. We have to play tremendous defense and hope we can get some buckets to fall. We didn't push the lead out enough because of small mental mistakes that cost us the game. We're not good enough to do that but act like we are. This is the result of that.

[Hoosierfan2017 24,849]

24 minutes ago, MikeRoberts said:

I don’t think it’s a matter of feeling right, it’s a matter of being upset that the glaring issues that were there on day one are still there at the end of the season.

I just don’t understand the need for some to have such blind faith and feel the need to rip apart anyone that doesn’t.

it’s the inability for many to acknowledge our struggles and to call BS that is mind boggling. Parker Stewart stood around all game, barely moving until he got scratched and then lost a 1x1 battle thereafter. Go back and watch the early games of Parker Stewart and guess what, he stood around all game yet he has continued to play and play and play and play. 

There has been no development of culture. It’s been talked about but has it been implemented? No. 28 games in and the same players are standing around and being rewarded for playing time. So, when people don’t believe that culture is being built in a good way, there are reasons all around us

Honestly, there have been warning signs since the very first game of the season. We shot 4-24 from 3 against EMU but got up to a 21 point lead in spite of that. Then we let our foot off the gas and let them get with 1 with under 3 minutes to play. Our non conference schedule was just so weak that we were able to win despite our flaws. Now we’re in the Big 10 and can’t out talent teams. 

[MikeRoberts 7,993]

1 hour ago, IU - Kaulie said:

I’m still surprised Stew got so much run in the 2nd half.  I can’t stand Davison but I knew after their altercation or whatever that Stewart’s head was lost and it was going to fire Davison up.

I know we desperately need his shooting but you absolutely have to hide him on defense and Wisco is not a good matchup for him.  This was not a good game to try to trade his defense for some offense.

X was awful and had a bad game.  It happens.

Anthony Leal needs to play right now. He is much better on defense than Stew and he can get open on offense unlike Kopp who either can’t or won’t.

Lander cannot be playing.  I know we are short handed. I don’t care.  I don’t know who the other guard is for Wisco but he got anything he wanted on offense against him and knew when he was in the game that he was going to take him every time.

Bates has to play more.  He hardly played in the 2nd half.  I know he wasn’t getting his shot to go down in the 1st half but he should still be playing over Kopp or Stew late in the game.

Gallo has to continue to work on his shot this summer.  He had a couple of really good looks late that didn’t go down.  Although he is not the wing that should be getting those shots right now he puts himself in that position and wasn’t afraid to go up and take the shot because it was the right play.  They didn’t go down and one wasn’t even close but I like that about him.

CMW has to be better.  That last play of the game was really bad coming out of timeout and I highly question who he is giving playing time to and his substitution patterns.  That out of bounds call he needed to be in the officials face or call some people out to the media or do something.  
RUN. RUN. RUN.  Late in the game we went back to playing post TJD up with his back to the basket and the stand around game.  That’s not TJD’s strength.  You have to get him in space and facing the basket where he can attack or you have to have him play the high low game with Race.  Having them both just stand on each block with their back to the basket and trying to force it in there and playing the stand around game on the perimeter doesn’t work.  That is just bad coaching and I’m someone that generally likes CMW.  This team has to play with pace.  
 

 

 

100%
 

a lot of what you called out is on the staff. Weird and bad decisions that I truly believe cost is the win

[HoosierAloha 30,102]

1 minute ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Honestly, there have been warning signs since the very first game of the season. We shot 4-24 from 3 against EMU but got up to a 21 point lead in spite of that. Then we let our foot off the gas and let them get with 1 with under 3 minutes to play. Our non conference schedule was just so weak that we were able to win despite our flaws. Now we’re in the Big 10 and can’t out talent teams. 

I remember that one. That was the one that we locked them up on defense for a large portion of the game only to have one of their players get hot and torch us for them to get back into it. There were so many signs in that game for the season. We were wrong though because it was just one game, that resembled so many games from the previous 4 years.