Player and Recruit Retention News/Discussion & Potential Transfers

[Brass Cannon]

Just now, SteelerHoosier said:

I've heard that before as well. The biggest thing though is that kids just found him weird and couldn't connect with him. At least from what I have heard. 

Oh I know but that's going to burn a coach pretty quick 

[OG's Wingspan]

So is Kostas Antetokounmpo an actual transfer option, or is this just a mere speculation? 

[Tom White]

15 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

I also heard that at times coaches would want him to come watch a kid and he would basically decline. Ironic if true considering his shotgun approach. 

I have also heard that he would tell a coach to use a kid a different way. The way he thought he would use the kid at IU, instead of what was better for the high school team.

[SteelerHoosier]

5 minutes ago, Tom White said:

I have also heard that he would tell a coach to use a kid a different way. The way he thought he would use the kid at IU, instead of what was better for the high school team.

Yeah who does that? 

[mdn82]

I've always been curious about something. When Crean signed Cody, Patterson, Hollowell, Yogi, Devin Davis, Hanner -- he had a decent run of getting Indiana kids. (Of course, except for Cody and Yogi, none of those worked out.) Still, I wonder: How did he develop such a disconnect with the state? I grew up in Indiana, attended IU and now live in Virginia. When I watch Kyle Guy, I think, "Damn! He should be a Hoosier." ... I have faith that Archie can get things back on the right track, but still, I wonder: What the hell happened? 

His oddities. Not willing to play the game. It was always his way or the highway. Not talking handing over benefits or anything in most cases. AAU coaches want to be a part of a pipeline. They don't want to feel like their kids are no different than a NY kid. Right or wrong the fit with him and AAU coaches weren't strong. He didn't have the stature as a coach to walk into a gym/practice the way he did more times than not.

 

 

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[Miller'sTheMan]

Hearing all of this makes happy we have Archie.

[Iubravos]

23 minutes ago, OG's Wingspan said:

So is Kostas Antetokounmpo an actual transfer option, or is this just a mere speculation? 

Anybody?  Anybody hear of any reports of how much he improved?

[incrediboy]

3 hours ago, Hoosiers High Life said:

I want Blackmon to stay idc what anyone says!
Defense can be taught but you can't teach that sweet stroke he has! He is a scorer! Today's generation is all bout offense bc no one cares bout defense in the NBA and that's ultimately what these kids are striving for! The coach has to stress how important defense is and I don't believe crean did. So leaders or not I'd like to see both of them back and with a new Leader you might just be surprised in how they will play


PULL THE TRIGGER!!!!

You don't think the intelligent coaching staff we had with Crean -- always drawing accolades for having a flock of former head coaches in the mix -- didn't try to teach Blackmon defense? I think it's ingrained in him to be a selfish scorer and everything else doesn't matter that much to him. He's a prima donna who thinks the team revolves around him. We won the '15-16 B1G BECAUSE he was hurt, not in spite of him being hurt IMO. And I think we'd a better team without him than with him unless Miller is willing to bench him every time he blows defensive assignments. Count me among those who hope he goes pro.

[Yogi's Picnic Basket]

I hear what you and others are saying in terms of nobody playing D so how can JBJ and RoJo be singled out. But remember, these guys are 3-year starting juniors. Crean talked a lot this past season about a lack of leadership and specifically pertaining to the junior class. Seems he was pointing that finger directly at these two. 
Being the quasi leaders, they should have been leading by example on that end of the court. RoJo had a golden opportunity to be the prime leader for the next two years and hasn't grabbed it yet. 

Was Yogi a leader after 2-3 years? Not exactly. Taking younger players to bars with fake ID's lol. He was at the party that started the whole Davis-Holt thing. He knew it was either time to put up or shut up. He was more selfish than JBJ 75% of the time. His Senior year makes people forget A LOT. I loved the kid and never held any of what I just said against him. He is a kid and it took him time to become a leader. Some kids can be leaders and some just can't. The more you try to force it the worse it is. JBJ showed leadership qualities last year taking big shot after shot. Like others have said Juwan was the only okay defender we had last year. IDC how long they have been here. At least JBJ has a excuse of MULTIPLE knee surgeries. It is ridiculous when people say they dont want this kid or he is a selfish player get him off the team. It is your opinion I get that but that isn't what any true fan should say sorry. I just don't get it. Like I have said tho if Archie decides he wants ANY kid to leave or if any kids decide to leave on their own that is fine. Those are the only 2 people that have a say in the matter though.

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[Hoosiers High Life]

You don't think the intelligent coaching staff we had with Crean -- always drawing accolades for having a flock of former head coaches in the mix -- didn't try to teach Blackmon defense? I think it's ingrained in him to be a selfish scorer and everything else doesn't matter that much to him. He's a prima donna who thinks the team revolves around him. We won the '15-16 B1G BECAUSE he was hurt, not in spite of him being hurt IMO. And I think we'd a better team without him than with him unless Miller is willing to bench him every time he blows defensive assignments. Count me among those who hope he goes pro.

They didn't demand it out of any of the players. Ya all of them should of been bench after Nebraska loss for the whole next game but no we had a coach that was not a leader. How do you expect kids to lead if you can't even lead them?


PULL THE TRIGGER!!!!

[HoosierTrav]

His oddities. Not willing to play the game. It was always his way or the highway. Not talking handing over benefits or anything in most cases. AAU coaches want to be a part of a pipeline. They don't want to feel like their kids are no different than a NY kid. Right or wrong the fit with him and AAU coaches weren't strong. He didn't have the stature as a coach to walk into a gym/practice the way he did more times than not.

 

 

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This! I know for a fact of a few AAU coaches who resented him for the way he carried himself. Not saying it was a universal feeling amongst them all, bc I don't know but I do know that he had 0% credibility with quite a few coaches. That's a big reason why a change HAD to be made.

[Hoosierfan2017]

5 minutes ago, incrediboy said:

You don't think the intelligent coaching staff we had with Crean -- always drawing accolades for having a flock of former head coaches in the mix -- didn't try to teach Blackmon defense? I think it's ingrained in him to be a selfish scorer and everything else doesn't matter that much to him. He's a prima donna who thinks the team revolves around him. We won the '15-16 B1G BECAUSE he was hurt, not in spite of him being hurt IMO. And I think we'd a better team without him than with him unless Miller is willing to bench him every time he blows defensive assignments. Count me among those who hope he goes pro.

Blackmon was playing for a coach that wouldn't hold players accountable and would routinely make up excuses for his own shortcomings. It was a toxic environment for everyone involved. Archie seems like a guy who wouldn't be afraid to bench him if he didn't want to play defense. I think it's kind of silly to wish away our best scorer because of things he did with Crean as the coach. 

[Yogi's Picnic Basket]

You don't think the intelligent coaching staff we had with Crean -- always drawing accolades for having a flock of former head coaches in the mix -- didn't try to teach Blackmon defense? I think it's ingrained in him to be a selfish scorer and everything else doesn't matter that much to him. He's a prima donna who thinks the team revolves around him. We won the '15-16 B1G BECAUSE he was hurt, not in spite of him being hurt IMO. And I think we'd a better team without him than with him unless Miller is willing to bench him every time he blows defensive assignments. Count me among those who hope he goes pro.

That was nothing about JBJ. That was more about having a true pg/leader than anything and then being forced to give OG more minutes led to him being a big part of our team. If OG played more when JBJ was still playing then we see a different result. Look at how MSU started this year or ISU. A lot of good teams start slow and even the ones that start fine get better as the season goes along.

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[Hoosiers High Life]

You don't think the intelligent coaching staff we had with Crean -- always drawing accolades for having a flock of former head coaches in the mix -- didn't try to teach Blackmon defense? I think it's ingrained in him to be a selfish scorer and everything else doesn't matter that much to him. He's a prima donna who thinks the team revolves around him. We won the '15-16 B1G BECAUSE he was hurt, not in spite of him being hurt IMO. And I think we'd a better team without him than with him unless Miller is willing to bench him every time he blows defensive assignments. Count me among those who hope he goes pro.

Your wrong about last year to we won the B1G because yogi stepped up


PULL THE TRIGGER!!!!

[Miller'sTheMan]

27 minutes ago, Iubravos said:

Anybody?  Anybody hear of any reports of how much he improved?

I think this all originated when one guy tweeted that he was coming to IU, but later deleted that tweet. I'd be surprised if he comes.

[BGleas]

20 minutes ago, Yogi's Picnic Basket said:

Was Yogi a leader after 2-3 years? Not exactly. Taking younger players to bars with fake ID's lol. He was at the party that started the whole Davis-Holt thing. He knew it was either time to put up or shut up. He was more selfish than JBJ 75% of the time. His Senior year makes people forget A LOT. I loved the kid and never held any of what I just said against him. He is a kid and it took him time to become a leader. Some kids can be leaders and some just can't. The more you try to force it the worse it is. JBJ showed leadership qualities last year taking big shot after shot. Like others have said Juwan was the only okay defender we had last year. IDC how long they have been here. At least JBJ has a excuse of MULTIPLE knee surgeries. It is ridiculous when people say they dont want this kid or he is a selfish player get him off the team. It is your opinion I get that but that isn't what any true fan should say sorry. I just don't get it. Like I have said tho if Archie decides he wants ANY kid to leave or if any kids decide to leave on their own that is fine. Those are the only 2 people that have a say in the matter though.

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I didn't say a single word about Yogi in my post. I think it's crazy that it took 3.5 years for him to become a leader. IMO it was some flaw in Crean's model. i don't know if it was not naming captains officially, or this "everyone is a leader" mantra, but for some reason during much of his tenure it seemed leadership was a quality that took longer to develop. 

I also never said a word about not wanting any player, so not sure where your post is really coming from? I was addressing why JBJ and RoJo are taking more heat for their poor defense compared to other guys, and rightfully so. Crean basically flat-out said it when he called out his junior class publicly. 

[woodenshoemanHoosierfan]

You don't think the intelligent coaching staff we had with Crean -- always drawing accolades for having a flock of former head coaches in the mix -- didn't try to teach Blackmon defense? I think it's ingrained in him to be a selfish scorer and everything else doesn't matter that much to him. He's a prima donna who thinks the team revolves around him. We won the '15-16 B1G BECAUSE he was hurt, not in spite of him being hurt IMO. And I think we'd a better team without him than with him unless Miller is willing to bench him every time he blows defensive assignments. Count me among those who hope he goes pro.

Did anyone see the Frank Martin answer to the question from a SI for Kids kid reporter? He asked what Martin thought came first when it came to defense, attitude or technique. Martin said attitude cones first. JBJ and the rest of this team need to develop that attitude. It starts with themselves to want to do it.

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[Travis Scott]

At this time, there aren't really any jobs that I think Crean will go to which could be a blessing for our current program.  I feel like there are a few players that might have gone with him to a new school (current & recruits). These kids always liked Crean a great deal.  Without Crean coaching them as an option, the easiest play is to stay at IU. Oh, which happens to be a top tier basketball school with a ton of excitement all around it.

[Uspshoosier]

If he had an open scholly for this year I was thinking he could kill 2 birds with 1 stone. Politics will always be involved in high level college and athletics sooner or later it will come. He could offer the scholly to zach mcroberts. Now you and I know the kid deserves it from how he played last and he is one of your own on the team. Now the politics of it show high school coaches and AAU coaches you are serious about the inside out recruiting. Unless the scholly's are full this is what I would do. Thoughts?

 

 

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[HoosierAloha]

I didn't say a single word about Yogi in my post. I think it's crazy that it took 3.5 years for him to become a leader. IMO it was some flaw in Crean's model. i don't know if it was not naming captains officially, or this "everyone is a leader" mantra, but for some reason during much of his tenure it seemed leadership was a quality that took longer to develop. 
I also never said a word about not wanting any player, so not sure where your post is really coming from? I was addressing why JBJ and RoJo are taking more heat for their poor defense compared to other guys, and rightfully so. Crean basically flat-out said it when he called out his junior class publicly. 

So much this. I understand the theory of "everyone is a leader" but it falls short in practice. If you take thirteen 17-22 year olds and have them around each other for most of everyday of the year leaders will naturally emerge. You then have to have a coach who is willing to groom those leaders to get what you need done.

Crean's system failed. He was on Izzo's bench and has read "every book on leadership" but didn't implement what he should have learned from those experiences.