TOM CREAN FIRED

[Rookie33 932]

He's gone.  He's told the team.  They are playing with house money and have NOTHING to lose.  Teams often play better when they are more relaxed and the stakes are low. That's why we have seen some improvement the last couple of games.  Of course, it doesn't hurt that we have made a TON of 3s (while still turning the ball over way too much).  I continue to stand by Janitor's/BB4IU's post that Crean and Glass already have agreed he's gone after the season.  Everyone needs to Chillax and take a Xanex or sip multiple Zombie Dusts.  

[HoosierCoop 3,962]

46 minutes ago, Chris Nieman said:

I feel for Tom Crean. I really do. When i was playing in high school i can remember a petition going around that basically was asking the school to let go of our coach even though he'd been the coach for 20+ years and had multiple conference championships and even coached an IU target and future US Olympian Lloy Ball. My parents thankfully refused to sign any of that BS. We were a small school with very very very low expectations. In 1997 when my future school played Luke Recker in the Northeast Regional at the Fort Wayne Coliseum that was the pinnacle of our schools history. In Tom Crean's case, more is expected at Indiana University. I dont hate the guy. I've had multiple friends that were or are students there that have had very positive run in's with him. I appreciate his contribution to the program. I wish him well. He's done.

The mighty Warriors of Woodlan!!!!!!

[Cheaney40 854]

2 minutes ago, Jboser42 said:

I've heard this aswell, even from a former player from the 2013 team


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I'd like to hear what his reasoning was for saying this ..... I've not seen any evidence of it, would like to know details.  

[Chris Nieman 669]

5 minutes ago, HoosierCoop said:

The mighty Warriors of Woodlan!!!!!!

Yes sir! Coincidentally our fight song is "On Wisconsin". Awkward

[GloryDays 5,931]

I remember a long period of time when I had never seen Wisconsin beat IU.


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claps up to 11... haha.

Such a promising start to the tourny with a beatdown like that. 

 

btw, love your profile pic hahah

I remember when they were pretty much an afterthought and automatic win.



Im old!

[Yogi's Picnic Basket 5,004]

Don't know if it has been said yet but RMK went on Dan Patrick recently. Said he will never go back to that university. Dan said well I think most of them are gone and like we all know of him he responds I hope their all dead. Said his love for us fans is the best thing that he will remember when he is on his death bed. That is the best we will get for closure people.

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[Jboser42 217]

I'd like to hear what his reasoning was for saying this ..... I've not seen any evidence of it, would like to know details.  

Basically he said that Crean was the ultimate sales person and absolutely played favorites. He said a few players loved him but that most of them just didn't fully trust him once the recruiting process is ended.

Another small piece from my convo with him I found interesting that the team were pretty excited about the tourney obviously and being a number one seed, but that he stated Syracuse was the absolute last team he wanted to see in their bracket.

This player I'm speaking of was a walk on and transferred to Indiana Wesleyan where he won a national title.


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[Dalton26 16,892]

43 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Yup. There's nothing in the world that could change my mind on Crean. He's not the guy for the job and never will be. 

Also I'm not sold on him being this "great guy". I'm sure he's nice when he's interacting with fans around town, but there are too many stories about him being a real jerk for me to come to a conclusion.  

I've heard plenty of stories of him being a real douchebag to people.

[Chris Nieman 669]

4 minutes ago, Yogi's Picnic Basket said:

Don't know if it has been said yet but RMK went on Dan Patrick recently. Said he will never go back to that university. Dan said well I think most of them are gone and like we all know of him he responds I hope their all dead. Said his love for us fans is the best thing that he will remember when he is on his death bed. That is the best we will get for closure people.

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Here's the link to that exchange. 

 

[mdiu28 1,880]

4 minutes ago, Yogi's Picnic Basket said:

Don't know if it has been said yet but RMK went on Dan Patrick recently. Said he will never go back to that university. Dan said well I think most of them are gone and like we all know of him he responds I hope their all dead. Said his love for us fans is the best thing that he will remember when he is on his death bed. That is the best we will get for closure people.

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Sad but not surprising. RMK is who he is and he isn't changing. Some people just aren't built to forgive and forget - Bob Knight is one of those people. 

[pumpfake 3,946]

57 minutes ago, Cheaney40 said:

I've had a couple of run ins with him here in Bloomington ... he's a GREAT guy.  Took the time to talk to my kids, took pictures with them....he was very engaging to us as fans.

That being said, I agree ... it's not about him as a person ... it's about the fact that more is expected at IU.  If we continue down this road, in 10 years, IU will be another program that has low expectations, who has a "history" but is irrelevant.  I don't want that.  

We're nearly there already ..... I mean, we haven't won a title in 30 years!!!  I was 6 ... and have no memory of it.  Our last Final 4 was 15 years ago.....Duke, UNC, Kansas, pUKe have all passed us by .... 

To quote another member on this board ..... "this is embarrassing, fire him!"

No doubt we're in a period of drought as far as national prominence goes.  But you only have to look at Kansas to see that it's not unprecedented.  None of their NCAA titles were closer together than 20 years (20 and 36 years).  They also had a similar period of spotty appearances in the NCAA tournament through the 60's and 70's and weren't by any means perennial threats during that time.  Larry Brown brought them back and they've followed with Roy and Self since then and have stayed toward the top ever since (although Williams and Self have only combined for a single national title and it could be argued 1988 was aided by cheating).  Of course, there's also UCLA that has never managed to regain sustained prominence after the glory years of John Wooden.

My point is that even historically "blue blood" programs have had periods of mediocrity or moderate success (which is where we've been for a while), but with the right coach they were resurrected to their former status.  Obviously, most here recognize that something has to change to be the catalyst for our resurgence.

[Yogi's Picnic Basket 5,004]

I know it is not a popular opinion on here---but I would take another look if we made an NCAA Final Four run ---and Banner 6 would do the trick for me and get him another couple years to see if he could keep us elite. That would be the progress I expected to see this year given our talent and early season success. Back to reality---I do not see that happening and the inconsistency and lack of improvement with excellent talent is why it is time for a change. Just another average seed and sweet sixteen berth is no longer enough. He has had ample opportunity and been unable to deliver the results expected at an elite program.

I'm truly sorry for saying this but if Crean won a banner he would not only be here next year but deserve to be here. Just in the last two years he would boast a B1G title, possibly BTT, 2 Sweet Sixteens, 1 Elite eight, 1 FF & a championship. Throw in 2 more Sweet Sixteens and another B1G title in the 6-7 years we have actually counted him on and that would be a good run. If he even made the tourney one more time in that span he probably gets an extension. JS. It is crazy to think we won the title and then fired him right after. No coach would come here that was a big name. We would have to go for someone who had a huge ego or and up and comer. I don't think any coach has ever been fired after winning a title.

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[Trish 11,728]

Tom Crean is a great human. I've talked to him a number of times, I've even had the chance to teach his daughter at a certain point. The Crean's are a great family, it's a shame it's come down to this but we need to do what's best for everyone's interest. 

[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,266]

We had a big guy at basic that during hand to hand combat took a swing at a Ranger DS, oh Lord he immediately regretted that! DS pile and the guy ended up in the TMC.

Lol. We had a kid who brought some little critters with him after a liaison with a not so clean lady before he left for basic. He didn't know until about a month in to basic. We spent 2 days fumigation the barracks and equipment and we all had to take special showers. The funniest part was mail call those 2 nights. Our DS made everyone stand on 1 end of the barracks. He stood on the other and threw the mail at us as he passed it out.

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[pumpfake 3,946]

13 minutes ago, Yogi's Picnic Basket said:

 

I'm truly sorry for saying this but if Crean won a banner he would not only be here next year but deserve to be here. Just in the last two years he would boast a B1G title, possibly BTT, 2 Sweet Sixteens, 1 Elite eight, 1 FF & a championship. Throw in 2 more Sweet Sixteens and another B1G title in the 6-7 years we have actually counted him on and that would be a good run. If he even made the tourney one more time in that span he probably gets an extension. JS. It is crazy to think we won the title and then fired him right after. No coach would come here that was a big name. We would have to go for someone who had a huge ego or and up and comer. I don't think any coach has ever been fired after winning a title.

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I don't think there should be any doubt that winning a NCAA title would (and should) guarantee him at least 2 or 3 more seasons.  Thankfully, it's quite unlikely and would be the greatest "fluke" champion in quite a long time (if not ever).

Edited March 10, 2017 by pumpfake
clarification

[HoosierAloha 30,077]

I'll argue Mike Davis is not an relevant comparison. He never finished better than 4th in the B1G besides 2002, never won 20 games in his final three seasons, missed the tournament twice, and didn't make it past the second round besides 2002. Same situation really with Ollie.

 

Crean has had a much better 6 years, and did it with his own players. He's proven he can win and is a much much better coach than Davis. Once again, 3 S16s and 2 B1G Titles in 6 years is nothing to brush off. It's just not good enough for us anymore.

 

 

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I would agree with some of this. However, last seasons B1G title was won on the easiest schedule by far. How did that work out in the BTT?

3 sweet 16s in 6 years or 9 years? My point was that one miracle run to meet standards doesn't change the other 7 years of underachieving. Mike Davis wasn't good enough even with a run at the national finals. Crean has proven by underachieving in 5 of 6 completed years that he's not good enough. One fluke run by turning the ball over and shooting a crazy percentage from deep won't change what Crean is as a coach. He's an average coach at Indiana.

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

Basically he said that Crean was the ultimate sales person and absolutely played favorites. He said a few players loved him but that most of them just didn't fully trust him once the recruiting process is ended.

Another small piece from my convo with him I found interesting that the team were pretty excited about the tourney obviously and being a number one seed, but that he stated Syracuse was the absolute last team he wanted to see in their bracket.

This player I'm speaking of was a walk on and transferred to Indiana Wesleyan where he won a national title.


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Not to discredit our good buddy Jonny, but no **** a coach plays favorites. And the guys riding the pine aren't exactly going to be singing the coach praises. Every single coach ever has done that. And once recruiting is over, it's no longer sunshines and rainbows. Perform or sit down. I think this sounds like how any team/job operates.

Id love to hear stories demonstrating how much of a jerk he supposedly is behind the scenes.

As for this idea that he's "manipulatively nice", I think that's a pretty far stretch. He's been actively engaged in the IU and Bloomington community since he arrived. He probably has a lot of rough edges, but damn the dude has put in a lot of effort to be a positive force in Btown.


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[Bruce 10]

Tom Crean is a great human. I've talked to him a number of times, I've even had the chance to teach his daughter at a certain point. The Crean's are a great family, it's a shame it's come down to this but we need to do what's best for everyone's interest. 

Tom creans personal conduct and ethics have never been questioned to my knowledge but the fact is he is not a good coach by any metric u choose


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[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

I would agree with some of this. However, last seasons B1G title was won on the easiest schedule by far. How did that work out in the BTT?

 

3 sweet 16s in 6 years or 9 years? My point was that one miracle run to meet standards doesn't change the other 7 years of underachieving. Mike Davis wasn't good enough even with a run at the national finals. Crean has proven by underachieving in 5 of 6 completed years that he's not good enough. One fluke run by turning the ball over and shooting a crazy percentage from deep won't change what Crean is as a coach. He's an average coach at Indiana.

"Easiest B1G schedule" - do we have SOS numbers to prove it? I've seen this repeated, but haven't seen the actual numbers. I think it's sort of a flimsy argument honestly.

 

Agreed that one run changes nothing compared to 9 years of contradictory evidence.

 

All I was saying is that Crean has demonstrated his average is at a much higher level than Davis. Certainly a run this year wouldn't really change that he's an average/slightly above average coach. He's wildly inconsistent. Sometimes he's looked like the best coach out there, other times completely clueless. I never understand where those amazingly coached games come from, and it's not just the players executing. He's legitimately coached some amazing games in the past (usually against Calimari).

 

 

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[Dizz 323]

27 minutes ago, Yogi's Picnic Basket said:

Don't know if it has been said yet but RMK went on Dan Patrick recently. Said he will never go back to that university. Dan said well I think most of them are gone and like we all know of him he responds I hope their all dead. Said his love for us fans is the best thing that he will remember when he is on his death bed. That is the best we will get for closure people.

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Knight is just a sad, angry, old man who used to be a sad, angry young man.