TOM CREAN FIRED

[AZ Hoosier]

4 hours ago, Class of '66 Old Fart said:

Devil's advocate here - did IU expect RMK to do what he did when he was hired?    Did Duke expect Coach K to do what he's done?    It's just a total crapshoot and college basketball and recruiting is so much different today than it was when RMK and Coach K were initially hired.  I really do feel for Glass in the challenge he has in replacing CTC (assuming that process is underway) given the passion the fans have for IU basketball and the desire to return to the year in and year out truly elite level.  I ain't gettin' any younger and I want to see another banner hung in Assembly Hall before.....well, you know.

This pretty much sums up my thought on the issue. The Stevens and Donovans are not "up and comers". However, with any non-top tiered coach, there is always a risk. Bill Orwig took it when he hired Knight and it paid off. Glass failed with Crean*... and he'll have another chance, hopefully after this season. But if he doesn't get Brad Stevens or Billy Donovan, he will be taking a risk - there are always unknowns...

The best predictor of future behavior is past, relevant behavior. The same can be said of success. The "home run" hire will be someone with success at their current location/situation.

EDIT: (As '66 Old Fart pointed out, it was Rick Greenspan that hired Crean, not Glass)

[Alford Bailey]

1 hour ago, Class of '66 Old Fart said:

Several posters are very familiar with milehiiu on 247 and this was another post from him last night that I don't think has made it into this thread.

"Everything hinges upon Crean's agent.  And Stevens has already said no to Glass"

Please keep us informed  of what this guy says. And, who is Creans agent?

[AZ Hoosier]

8 minutes ago, nixie said:

I agree with your point about the past 6 years.  So, 3 sweet 16 appearances, and two conference titles in 6 years, so FIRE HIM? I get it... THIS is Indiana.  

The conference championships are great. The Sweet 16 finishes with the talent we had, not so much. If you can't get past the Sweet 16 with the #2 and #4 players in the same NBA draft class, you're not much of a coach, IMO.

[WayneFleekHoosier]

I'm thinking Crean/IU wins both games this week and the national heat lessens. Purgatory.

We lose tonight, the end of the Crean era may actually become a reality.

My gut still says Crean returns next season unless Crean is ready for a change.




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[WayneFleekHoosier]

Also, unless we have a Homerun hire lined up......

The national media will crucify Indiana for letting the COY and B1G champ go 1 year later. The media doesn't get it. They will paint IU awfully, unless we have a true homerun hire to be made


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[Alford Bailey]

9 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Also, unless we have a Homerun hire lined up......

The national media will crucify Indiana for letting the COY and B1G champ go 1 year later. The media doesn't get it. They will paint IU awfully, unless we have a true homerun hire to be made


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Dont think this will be an issue at all. Plenty of coaches get fired for alienating the fan base, inconsistency, not meeting expectations  ect. Crean would have been let go a long time ago at any other blue blood.

[Alford Bailey]

What if we wait another year and 2-3 conference opponents make a change this year? We risk losing a candidate in conference which would really suck. Still think all the stars are aligning. 

[Class of '66 Old Fart]

33 minutes ago, AZ Hoosier said:

. Glass failed with Crean...

Crean was hired by Greenspan.

[TheWatShot]

19 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Also, unless we have a Homerun hire lined up......

The national media will crucify Indiana for letting the COY and B1G champ go 1 year later. The media doesn't get it. They will paint IU awfully, unless we have a true homerun hire to be made


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Even if they do, who cares? Not the people who would be interested in the job, which is all that matters. Our fans really need to stop worrying so much about the media thinks of us. 

 

 I must have missed the national outrage when Ben Howland was let go from UCLA just TWO WEEKS after winning the Pac-12. Here was Pat Forde's reaction to it: http://sports.yahoo.com/news/ncaab--losing--off-court-issues-justifiably-lead-to-firings-of-ben-howland--tubby-smith-000403175.html

[AZ Hoosier]

1 minute ago, Class of '66 Old Fart said:

Crean was hired by Greenspan.

You are correct... my bad. Glass wasn't hired until the fall of 2008... Crean was hired in April of the same year.

[Class of '66 Old Fart]

Mike White's name has popped up a couple of time and I know very little about him.  The very first thing that jumped out at me when I looked at his background is that he's always been in the deep deep south - born and raised, college, coaching experience, etc.  Purely an observation.

[WayneFleekHoosier]

Dont think this will be an issue at all. Plenty of coaches get fired for alienating the fan base, inconsistency, not meeting expectations  ect. Crean would have been let go a long time ago at any other blue blood.

I agree completely but the Media won't get it. My thinking is WHO cares so much as we make a great hire.

I knew this needed to happen years ago, but I was hoping Crean could be the guy to deliver the results even though "eye test" was indicating otherwise.

I keep coming back to 2017 recruiting. It doesn't excite the fanbase or give us a chance to be contenders next year. Plus the Indiana kids??? Crean really sealed his fate with this class IMO. I even think some of the guys could be great players but on paper it doesn't evoke dominance. It looks like a low major recruiting class trying to find steals.


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[Class of '66 Old Fart]

25 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Also, unless we have a Homerun hire lined up......

The national media will crucify Indiana for letting the COY and B1G champ go 1 year later. The media doesn't get it. They will paint IU awfully, unless we have a true homerun hire to be made


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Certainly there would be some backlash, but it could be mitigated if there was another coaching or even AD position elsewhere that at least outwardly appeared to be a reasonable move on CTC's part.  

[akhosrof]

A sleeper name if you're looking for a Mark White-type hire: Ben Jacobson of Northern Iowa. Extremely sharp guy. Reading on Jacobson:

https://www.google.com/amp/www.blackheartgoldpants.com/platform/amp/2010/3/23/1386061/the-short-list-ben-jacobson?client=safari

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/sports/college/northern-iowa/uni-panthers/2016/03/17/northern-iowa-ben-jacobson-texas-longhorns-shaka-smart-ncaa-tournament-basketball/81916942/

Was a finalist for the TAMU job when they replaced Turgeon. Jacobson has since signed an extension where I believe he has a buyout close to $3M.

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[GnarlyNormEllenberger]

A few thoughts:

- We ARE a blue-blood program. We have history, tradition, pull 14,000+ fans in for a practice every year and pay our head coach an elite-level salary while providing him a recruiting budget that far surpasses most of our conference foes while living in the middle of a recruiting hotbed. We have a mini-museum dedicated to Indiana Basketball. Our brand alone garners us a bunch of national TV appearances regardless of how good we're projected to be. No, we have not had consistent success over the past 20 years. But there's a reason why we're still invited (and decline?) to play in major showcases with other programs like UK, UNC and UCLA. Because we're STILL a big name in college basketball. That's what separates us from Purdue and Illinois (who are two solid programs in their own right.)

- If we're paying Crean around 3.2 million and determine he's not good enough, how much do you think we'll pay the new guy? It's a guess, but I'd be surprised if the new guy isn't making at least $4 million a year (or more!) So my question is: Is Coach (insert candidate here) worth $4 million a year? My point is that we're not going to cut ties with Crean only to acquire a coach with similar results/consistency. I know it's fun to throw out names and what-not, but seriously. If we can attract a coach like Tom Crean when our program was in the state of a dumpster fire, what kind of coach can we get with the current state of the program? Something to ponder...

- This program would absolutely take off like a rocket ship with the right leadership. And all of us know it. You'd see a Renaissance of IU basketball that has not been seen in well over 20 years. Maybe not Duke-level of success, but certainly like Michigan State or better. We could (should?) easily become the premier program of the Big Ten. But who is the guy to do it? I'm not sure, but don't let anyone tell you otherwise. Indiana Basketball has a LOT more potential that what it's currently showing. And I think many people in college basketball know it.

Just my opinion.

[GloryDays]

Fair enough. Though we have 19 seasons of Marshall coaching, whereas Knight had 6 years, and K had 6 years of coaching. We have a pretty good idea what we'll get with Marshall, Knight and K were still really young in their coaching careers. 

Marshall's age is one knock I have.I know from experience the energy wanes a bit when you hit 50.I would much rather go for a younger guy.Plus if the hires a good one we wont be here again in 10 years.

[GloryDays]

Mike White's name has popped up a couple of time and I know very little about him.  The very first thing that jumped out at me when I looked at his background is that he's always been in the deep deep south - born and raised, college, coaching experience, etc.  Purely an observation.

 

I watched them against Ky the other night and they weren't even on the same level talent wise but destroyed Ky with defense.If thats his M.O. I'm all in.

 

[Alford Bailey]

2 hours ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

I agree completely but the Media won't get it. My thinking is WHO cares so much as we make a great hire.

I knew this needed to happen years ago, but I was hoping Crean could be the guy to deliver the results even though "eye test" was indicating otherwise.

I keep coming back to 2017 recruiting. It doesn't excite the fanbase or give us a chance to be contenders next year. Plus the Indiana kids??? Crean really sealed his fate with this class IMO. I even think some of the guys could be great players but on paper it doesn't evoke dominance. It looks like a low major recruiting class trying to find steals.


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Agree. Instate recruiting matters here. We dont need to get every kid but we need to be the major player instate. Totally struck out recently.  I expect Glass knows this and will address it with a new hire.

[Alford Bailey]

1 hour ago, GnarlyTimGarl said:

A few thoughts:

- We ARE a blue-blood program. We have history, tradition, pull 14,000+ fans in for a practice every year and pay our head coach an elite-level salary while providing him a recruiting budget that far surpasses most of our conference foes while living in the middle of a recruiting hotbed. We have a mini-museum dedicated to Indiana Basketball. Our brand alone garners us a bunch of national TV appearances regardless of how good we're projected to be. No, we have not had consistent success over the past 20 years. But there's a reason why we're still invited (and decline?) to play in major showcases with other programs like UK, UNC and UCLA. Because we're STILL a big name in college basketball. That's what separates us from Purdue and Illinois (who are two solid programs in their own right.)

- If we're paying Crean around 3.2 million and determine he's not good enough, how much do you think we'll pay the new guy? It's a guess, but I'd be surprised if the new guy isn't making at least $4 million a year (or more!) So my question is: Is Coach (insert candidate here) worth $4 million a year? My point is that we're not going to cut ties with Crean only to acquire a coach with similar results/consistency. I know it's fun to throw out names and what-not, but seriously. If we can attract a coach like Tom Crean when our program was in the state of a dumpster fire, what kind of coach can we get with the current state of the program? Something to ponder...

- This program would absolutely take off like a rocket ship with the right leadership. And all of us know it. You'd see a Renaissance of IU basketball that has not been seen in well over 20 years. Maybe not Duke-level of success, but certainly like Michigan State or better. We could (should?) easily become the premier program of the Big Ten. But who is the guy to do it? I'm not sure, but don't let anyone tell you otherwise. Indiana Basketball has a LOT more potential that what it's currently showing. And I think many people in college basketball know it.

Just my opinion.

Agree. The potential is huge and could be easily reached. I think we could pass UNC and Kansas and be right there with Duke and UK. This state and fan base is a powder keg waiting for the spark.

[Yogi's Picnic Basket]

I watched them against Ky the other night and they weren't even on the same level talent wise but destroyed Ky with defense.If thats his M.O. I'm all in.

 

Mike White is gonna be a popular name probably after this year or next. Florida isn't looked at like the Donovan area so it isn't in the top tier area or even middle tier. He seems like a good coach but I would like to see him more and his name be a little more popular to come here. Two things that can quickly change.

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