The nation's perspective on IUBB

[MartintheMopMan 7,765]

The Bears are second only to the Packers in number of championships won, but the last one the bears won was in 1985.

They dominated pre-merger right?

You just prompted me to look at their wikipedia page instead of relying on memory and I am so on the mark with the Bears. A disappointing loss in the championship game in the mid-00s? A series of championships spanning multiple decades but none since the late 80s? A coach who got them that last championship but then was fired after some disappointing years but remains a legend?

Come on. 

[chicagoHOOSIER 1,051]

They dominated pre-merger right?

You just prompted me to look at their wikipedia page instead of relying on memory and I am so on the mark with the Bears. A disappointing loss in the championship game in the mid-00s? A series of championships spanning multiple decades but none since the late 80s? A coach who got them that last championship but then was fired after some disappointing years but remains a legend?

Come on. 

 

 

They were a dynasty in the 40's.

 

Lots of similarities, except the Bears have only won 2 championships in the past 67 years.

 

And there are 32 NFL teams right now, more than at any time in the history of the NFL, and 300ish Division 1 college basketball teams.

 

It is at the very least an interesting comparison though.  Good job!

[JSHoosier 20,618]

 Seth Davis‏@SethDavisHoops10m10 minutes ago

I think I think they're going to the NCAA tourney. RT @WirelessGolf: Does IU even make the NIT?

"I think I think", I hope that was typo.  Otherwise he's really just saying he's not sure.

[LazOffTheBench 3,638]

College basketball-savvy fans that I talk to from other schools around the country say IU and its fans are "too smart" to keep a mediocre coach like Crean around when he isn't getting the job done. But a lot of IU fans continue to say "Give Crean more time!" It seems like fans from other schools give IU credit for being much smarter about basketball than it really is because Crean's still here, he's still mediocre, and the program becomes less and less relevant as the years go by.

[rebelhoosier848891 9,588]

College basketball-savvy fans that I talk to from other schools around the country say IU and its fans are "too smart" to keep a mediocre coach like Crean around when he isn't getting the job done. But a lot of IU fans continue to say "Give Crean more time!" It seems like fans from other schools give IU credit for being much smarter about basketball than it really is because Crean's still here, he's still mediocre, and the program becomes less and less relevant as the years go by.

 

Good points Laz.

 

Many of us don't hold Crean responsible for the rebuild years when we had such little talent that even Knight would have gotten clobbered. For us old schoolers---we actually liked rooting for those teams that played with heart and played the game the right way.

 

After the rebuild---we see 2 good years of IU basketball starting with Zeller's freshman season when we beat #1 UK and advanced to the Sweet 16--- playing perhaps the best basketball in the country other than UK who knocked us out. Then we followed with a Big Ten title, #1 ranking, and another sweet 16 appearance.

 

Then came the fiasco that was last year. Because of all the good things Crean has done with our academics and graduation rates and high win percentage against top 25 teams---we are willing to give him one bad year and see what he does this year. Several high level programs go through the same thing---UK is just 2 years removed from a first round NIT loss and bounced back in a big way. We hope IU can do the same thing.

 

For me---I will be off the Crean train if we have a second consecutive bad season for the reasons you list---It's IU we expect to compete for championships.  The difference I have with your opinion is that I believe we were competitive for championships 2 of the last 3 years and I want to get back to that.

 

Both of us have good factual arguments to make about why Crean should stay or go---and IMO we are going to know one way or the other very soon! This year is all I need to see to make my decision.

[Hutch89 2,946]

Nicely done rebel

[rebelhoosier848891 9,588]

Nicely done rebel

 

Thanks Scohutch---hope everything is going well over your way!

 

I am hoping we get the W tomorrow or this site will go into full meltdown mode.
 

[Magnanimous 4,631]

I'm not a fan of the Michigan comparison because Michigan is a big name flameout from the WWII era that has been good but not great since then. They have 1 co-national championship since 1948, and because they have a big stadium, classic helmets, and a great fight song they think they're a big time program. They're not. I could care less about all-time wins. They're a poor man's ND whose glory days were during the same time as Army's. If it wasn't for the money behind their program, they would have fallen off the CFB radar long ago.

 

I know some of that might draw some paralels to us, but I think a better comparison may be Penn State football (minus the whole Sandusky scandal). Our history goes back farther than theirs (they don't have a Branch McCracken-esq era before Paterno), but there are a lot of similarities:

- Glory days under the schools' best coaches were during the 70s and 80s,

- Said coach had a good track record of upholding student-athlete standards that future coaches have tried to replicate

- Both kept coaching longer than they should have and it hurt recruiting in the later years

- Both our and their last NC came in the same school year (86/87 season)

- Neither program has been able to escape the shadow of Knight/Paterno, who both left with controversial reasons

- Both have been producing sporadic quality seasons over the last 20 years.

- Despite all of this, attendance and fan support is tops in the nation

 

In the grand scheme of things, we're historically a better basketball program than they are football (we're top 5-6 all-time, I'd put them around number ten), but the programs have been essentially mirrors of each other since the early 90s.

 

I honestly don't like comparing college basketball programs to northern FB schools because IMO most of those programs are never truly coming back. The only one who has been remotely competitive since college sports blew up in the cable TV/internet era has been Ohio State, and even they have been a tier down from from the SEC/southwest schools the last decade (spare me 2012 ND, they didn't even belong on the same field as Alabama). I don't see Nebraska ever being what it once was, as not only are they now at a huge recruiting disadvantage, but they have failed miserably in adapting to today's style of play. Penn State has the facilities, brand name, and money to stay relevant under the right coach (as do Michigan and ND), and the CFB playoff does give these schools a better chance at contending now (especially when it expands to more teams), but I don't see any of them having repeat golden eras like the ones their fans are still expecting.

 

Indiana on the other hand is located in the college basketball hotbed of the country. Kentucky, Louisville, Ohio State, Michigan State, and Michigan are all within 5 hour drives (as are Purdue, Butler, and Illinois). Indianapolis and Chicago are prime recruiting grounds. And with basketball, you only really need a few good recruits to hit it big, as with football you need several successful classes of 20+ players in a row to even be competitive, let alone contending. The right coach will turn this program around in no time.

[Bigdaddy76 111]

I think that the Notre Dame comparison makes the most sense. But ya gotta be real careful with that. Most people think that Notre Dame fans are HIGHLY irrational about the prospects of that team every year. It would be very hard for me to beleive that IU's best days as a power program are past us. Or maybe I am being too optimistic. It really seems to me that this administration is really concerned with having ANY coach have a huge shadow such as RMK had for so many years. Just seems a little too obvious to me with the hires that they have made so far. Its almost like they have went out of there way to NOT hire a big name coach, or someone with a previous tie to the school and its traditions.  

[CR3AMnCR1MS0N 1,867]

If Crean can't right the ship---the big question is-----who is that 1 hire? Lots of debate about that already and not much consensus. It needs to be a homerun or we risk having this same debate in a few years again.

Brad Stevens. Guy does no good in the pros, comes back to college and kills it like Saban

[rebelhoosier848891 9,588]

Brad Stevens. Guy does no good in the pros, comes back to college and kills it like Saban

 

Good points--and a real possibility---but IMO still too premature because Crean has this year to win and quiet the critics. The Pitt win was a start--- but a UL win would be huge---we shall see. I still think he gets it done---this team is young but talented and should continue to improve and be very good by tourney time.
 

[CR3AMnCR1MS0N 1,867]

Good points--and a real possibility---but IMO still too premature because Crean has this year to win and quiet the critics. The Pitt win was a start--- but a UL win would be huge---we shall see. I still think he gets it done---this team is young but talented and should continue to improve and be very good by tourney time.
 

I agree, but your question did hinge on if CTC didn't right the ship, so, I put our #1 guy out there for ya!

[Str8Hoosiers 2,965]

Just saw Kenpom updated his prediction for IU to go 9-9 in conference play which is a little better but still has us at 18-13 overall which means we lose 2 more non conference.... I really hope not... We need both Butler & Georgetown

[Stuhoo 82,158]

Just saw Kenpom updated his prediction for IU to go 9-9 in conference play which is a little better but still has us at 18-13 overall which means we lose 2 more non conference.... I really hope not... We need both Butler & Georgetown

 

Not quite:

 

We need one out of Butler/Gtown. That would put us at 19-12 with wins over SMU, Pitt, Butler/Gtown, and at least 9-9 in conference would very likely include four attractive B1G wins. We only play NW and Penn St. once. To get to nine wins with w's over Rutgers twice, PU once, NW and Penn St, that would include four wins over good B1G resume-builder teams. 

 

19-12 makes us an NCAA bubble team at worst, One B1G tourney win puts us at 20 wins, and we're in.

[Str8Hoosiers 2,965]

Not quite:

We need one out of Butler/Gtown. That would put us at 19-12 with wins over SMU, Pitt, Butler/Gtown, and at least 9-9 in conference would very likely include four attractive B1G wins. We only play NW and Penn St. once. To get to nine wins with w's over Rutgers twice, PU once, NW and Penn St, that would include four wins over good B1G resume-builder teams.

19-12 makes us an NCAA bubble team at worst, One B1G tourney win puts us at 20 wins, and we're in.

Assuming those 5 BIG wins hopefully isn't a stretch... Maybe I should have said I need both instead of we... I need us to beat both... And go at least 10-8 in conference to feel confident

[biteoftheapple 4,115]

Maybe my hopes are unrealistic, but I want more. I want the players to want more, I want the fanbase ti want more. I want to fight to finish top 4 in the B1G. Fight for the Conference title most years. Un my mind, top half and just abive. 500 is a disappointing season. I want more than whats being said.

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,834]

Maybe my hopes are unrealistic, but I want more. I want the players to want more, I want the fanbase ti want more. I want to fight to finish top 4 in the B1G. Fight for the Conference title most years. Un my mind, top half and just abive. 500 is a disappointing season. I want more than whats being said.

ditto. Our whole starting 5 are top 50 recruits. We should be winning this year. We should have won last year. Lots of blame to pass around but no reason we aren't a perennial top 20 team each year. At least that's what i hope for.

[Alford Bailey 12,421]

ditto. Our whole starting 5 are top 50 recruits. We should be winning this year. We should have won last year. Lots of blame to pass around but no reason we aren't a perennial top 20 team each year. At least that's what i hope for.

^This.

[schoosier 3,524]

ditto. Our whole starting 5 are top 50 recruits. We should be winning this year. We should have won last year. Lots of blame to pass around but no reason we aren't a perennial top 20 team each year. At least that's what i hope for.

The blame gets put on the coach making 2+ million a year as it should. Who cares if he's not willing to accept it. 2 out of 7 years we were a top 20 team and prospects aren't looking up; instead its the other way with high % of players in trouble for various reasons. Sorry, this isn't Indiana basketball and you can't just coach speak your way out of it. Crean will go the way of Gillepsie at UK, Shula at Bama, Hoke at Mich, and Muschamp at Florida. Glass needs to go with him. Give Stevens, I mean the new coach, a clean slate.

[Str8Hoosiers 2,965]

Way to early but Lunardi currently has us in the first four out... Win, win now, win often... Raise the standards of the Hoosier faithful