How far away is IUBB from being elite again?

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,976]

24 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

That isn't true, just look at Wright's first 6-7 years and you don't see elite.

Kinda my point... Villanova became what it did because of the Big East breakup. 

[lillurk 4,193]

4 hours ago, Uspshoosier said:

Iu is on a trajectory to be better than they were last year by a wide margin and continue to move the program in the right direction. 

I think this is the key, and I don’t think it’s some sure thing next year is a step back. (Former 5 star sophs+ are about the best kind of player in CBB.) Feels like a lot of commentary here yesterday — less so today — was prisoner of the moment. If IU plays like that a bunch, we have a lot to worry about. I don’t think it was acceptable but sometimes it happens.

[Uspshoosier 48,800]

2 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

Kinda my point... Villanova became what it did because of the Big East breakup. 

Still had steps to take even after the Big East breakup though.  After Wrights first final 4 I don’t think he got out of the first weekend until he won it all 6 or 7 years later 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,976]

6 minutes ago, Golfman25 said:

Nova has been a solid program since the 1980s.  Very few down years.  Only four loosing records in that time. Too many 20 win seasons to count.  Have really stepped it up the last several years from that base.  Just shows how devastating the Sampson debacle was.  Absolutely killed the program.  

And during all that time... They were a middle of the pack Big East team... Then a certain thing happened... Before 2014, Nova had won conf titles in: 1978, 1979, 1980, 1982, 1997, 2006... Just 7. After the breakup... 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2019, 2020, 2021... 7 more... Conf tourneys? Had only won 2 before and won 5 after. That breakup did more to college basketball than people want to realize. And I don't believe in a good way. 

[WayneFleekHoosier 49,531]

Which schools in your opinion skipped steps to be elite?   Good convo by the way 

Off the dome?

UCLA, Arizona, Arkansas, Alabama to some extent.

Strong basketball schools, 3 of the 4. So kinda expected to have a smoother transition but no guarantee. Indiana should have never gotten themselves in this mess. Terrible decisions compounded by more terrible decisions coupled with an AD that isn’t truly concerned with winning but more concerned with peacocking morals and ethics. McRobbie was lining the Indiana pockets through other means, athletics is the sideshow.


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[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,976]

Just now, Uspshoosier said:

Still had steps to take even after the Big East breakup though.  After Wrights first final 4 I don’t think he got out of the first weekend until he won it all 6 or 7 years later 

They won a national title in 2016. The Big East broke up after the 2012-13 season. It took just 3 seasons after that. 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,976]

These are the 9 seasons leading up to the BE breakup and the 9 after. I didn't like the breakup then, I didn't like the other schools leaving for the ACC. 10 years later, UofL, Cuse, Pitt and Notre Dame... Meh to really bad. UConn? Makes a move BACK to the Big East... 2nd year in and they are the best team in the Big East. 

 

Personally, I felt if those schools were going to leave that UConn, UofL, Syracuse, Notre Dame, Pitt should have just started their own conference completely. Would have benefitted their programs way more in the long run. Go ahead and bring along South Florida and 4-6 others and I think you'd have a great 4-5 bid conference. Conference realignment has done nothing more than create more 1 bid leagues and I think that's hurt college basketball. But what do I know. 

 

Edit: Top photo is 2013-2014 through 2021-2022

Bottom photo is 2004-2005 through 2012-2013

[Golfman25 6,123]

19 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Off the dome?

UCLA, Arizona, Arkansas, Alabama to some extent.

Strong basketball schools, 3 of the 4. So kinda expected to have a smoother transition but no guarantee. Indiana should have never gotten themselves in this mess. Terrible decisions compounded by more terrible decisions coupled with an AD that isn’t truly concerned with winning but more concerned with peacocking morals and ethics. McRobbie was lining the Indiana pockets through other means, athletics is the sideshow.


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Arkansas, Alabama, elite?

[Uspshoosier 48,800]

7 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Off the dome?

UCLA, Arizona, Arkansas, Alabama to some extent.

Strong basketball schools, 3 of the 4. So kinda expected to have a smoother transition but no guarantee. Indiana should have never gotten themselves in this mess. Terrible decisions compounded by more terrible decisions coupled with an AD that isn’t truly concerned with winning but more concerned with peacocking morals and ethics. McRobbie was lining the Indiana pockets through other means, athletics is the sideshow.


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Probably where we differ on what being Elite means and the steps that get you there.   Of those Arkansas would be the one for me that is the closest to skipping steps.   Bama is an interesting case for me 

 16-15 in his first year with a losing conference record 

lights out second year  26-7 (16-2) sweet 16

19-14 (9-9) with a first round loss to Notre Dame 

Zona for me was set up the best out of all the teams with new coaches with Miller getting fired for non results based reasons.  Lloyd was able to take over a program not far removed from being a 1 seed and multiple tourney appearances 
And numerous teams with winning conference records.    Looking back he fell into an excellent situation 

ucla had a heck of a run in the ncaa tourney with no fans but not sure I would put them in elite status 

 

 

 

 

[WayneFleekHoosier 49,531]

4 minutes ago, Golfman25 said:

Arkansas, Alabama, elite?

Arkansas is on a path under Musselman to be considered Elite.  Happened almost immediately. Recruiting and on court results are at that level. 
 

Alabama  less so, but could be working towards that based on recruiting results.  
 

I think to truly be considered Elite you have to post repetitive results across different teams.  So we will see, but they are off to a quick start and if they keep it up and improve, then absolutely.  

[Rico 3,355]

15 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

These are the 9 seasons leading up to the BE breakup and the 9 after. I didn't like the breakup then, I didn't like the other schools leaving for the ACC. 10 years later, UofL, Cuse, Pitt and Notre Dame... Meh to really bad. UConn? Makes a move BACK to the Big East... 2nd year in and they are the best team in the Big East. 

 

Personally, I felt if those schools were going to leave that UConn, UofL, Syracuse, Notre Dame, Pitt should have just started their own conference completely. Would have benefitted their programs way more in the long run. Go ahead and bring along South Florida and 4-6 others and I think you'd have a great 4-5 bid conference. Conference realignment has done nothing more than create more 1 bid leagues and I think that's hurt college basketball. But what do I know. 

 

Edit: Top photo is 2013-2014 through 2021-2022

Bottom photo is 2004-2005 through 2012-2013

The Big East football schools should have made their own conference minus UConn.  It would/should have been Notre Dame, Syracuse, Pitt, Boston College, Louisville, and West Virginia.  Throw in Cincinnati, Memphis, and a few Florida schools and you got a basketball conference.

[WayneFleekHoosier 49,531]

3 minutes ago, Uspshoosier said:

Probably where we differ on what being Elite means and the steps that get you there.   Of those Arkansas would be the one for me that is the closest to skipping steps.   Bama is an interesting case for me 

 16-15 in his first year with a losing conference record 

lights out second year  26-7 (16-2) sweet 16

19-14 (9-9) with a first round loss to Notre Dame 

Zona for me was set up the best out of all the teams with new coaches with Miller getting fired for non results based reasons.  Lloyd was able to take over a program not far removed from being a 1 seed and multiple tourney appearances 
And numerous teams with winning conference records.    Looking back he fell into an excellent situation 

ucla had a heck of a run in the ncaa tourney with no fans but not sure I would put them in elite status 

 

 

 

 

Yeah, Arkansas and Arizona probably the best case descriptions. I agree Alabama, maybe not but that’s a historically marginal program and what Oats has done with them so quickly makes me think of them. 
 

UCLA, like UNC, Kansas, Duke should return to prominence more easily because everything else is in place.  That’s where the frustrations come in. Indiana was/is a blue blood. The same way we expect these other teams to figure it out quickly should also be the case at Indiana.  We aren’t Alabama, D1 U, etc.  Our pathway shouldn’t have been as hard. 

[Uspshoosier 48,800]

4 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Arkansas is on a path under Musselman to be considered Elite.  Happened almost immediately. Recruiting and on court results are at that level. 
 

Alabama  less so, but could be working towards that based on recruiting results.  
 

I think to truly be considered Elite you have to post repetitive results across different teams.  So we will see, but they are off to a quick start and if they keep it up and improve, then absolutely.  

Muss did lose 10 of 12 in his first year and finished with a losing conference record and finished tied for 10th in the SEC.   But his next 2 years were really good and it would seem to me he isn’t going to slow down.    Transfer portal is huge for him.  He was the king of transfers at Nevada 

[Uspshoosier 48,800]

3 minutes ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Yeah, Arkansas and Arizona probably the best case descriptions. I agree Alabama, maybe not but that’s a historically marginal program and what Oats has done with them so quickly makes me think of them. 
 

UCLA, like UNC, Kansas, Duke should return to prominence more easily because everything else is in place.  That’s where the frustrations come in. Indiana was/is a blue blood. The same way we expect these other teams to figure it out quickly should also be the case at Indiana.  We aren’t Alabama, D1 U, etc.  Our pathway shouldn’t have been as hard. 

I will be interested in how UCLA does with a B1G schedule.  PAC 12 depth isn’t the same as the B1G despite B1Gs problems in March 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,976]

23 minutes ago, Rico said:

The Big East football schools should have made their own conference minus UConn.  It would/should have been Notre Dame, Syracuse, Pitt, Boston College, Louisville, and West Virginia.  Throw in Cincinnati, Memphis, and a few Florida schools and you got a basketball conference.

I would have been fine with that. Going to the ACC was a terrible decision though for UofL, ND, Cuse and Pitt. No doubt. They started off hot... And now it's the opposite. 

[southernindianahoosier2 950]

5 hours ago, IU Scott said:

What is wrong with the uniforms 

1. The cut or "Fit" is out of touch with the current styles. At one point IU was rocking sleeveless style where the current trend was the spaghetti tank

2. The stars on the back just make the uniform look dumpy

3. The Adidas logo breaking up the piping makes the uniform look non symmetrical

4. Why do we have 0 alternate uniforms????

5. Why do we have 0 collabs? IU Could easily get a collab with Aimé Leon Dore, Noah, or Kidsuper

6. Where's the script Indiana Jersey? 

7. What about a throwback Cream colored Jersey? 

8. Look at the IU shop, I dare you to find the powder blue quarter zips, or orange shirts the football teams wear?...

9. We talk a lot about IUFB... Wheres the cross-collab LEO jerseys? 

10. Why is there no LEO swag available in the shop? I couldn't even fid a shirt. I'd buy a LEO skull cap or bandana... NOPE don't exist outside of the players.

11. Why can't we have a fun Bison Mascot on an alternate uniform and the side of the pants like Kansas and the JayHawk? 

12. Does IU not get a portion of sales from IU Adidas merch? I tried to buy a quarter zip on the shop for christmas and couldn't find anything. I checked purdue and they have 9! thats 9 pages of swag with like 6 quarterzips to choose from. 

13. I was at the Arizona game and almost all of the swag was from the ancillary shirt companies like homefield, or shirts with the Bison.. Why is IU not capitalizing on that? 

14. My buddy played D1 tennis and said that their swag was night an Day to IU's... 

15. Even if Nike pays $3m less on a contract.... Don't we receive a portion of the sales... wouldn't 9 pages of Nike IU swag make up the difference there? 

 

[go iu bb 7,350]

Further away from elite than I was hoping for entering the season. I'm not upset at the record, going  2-2 in the tough non-con games. But now the team is 1-3 in the last 4 games and those 3 loses they got blown out. They did beat UNC but, quite frankly, UNC was not playing well at the time and the game was at home. The losing isn't what bothers me, but how they lost. Despite the team's experience, they still don't know how to win, or even play well, on the road.

Of course, JHS was out for 2 of those 3 loses and XJ got hurt in the other. That doesn't help but injuries are part of the game. Good teams can overcome. They got beaten so badly in those loses that I don't think being fully healthy would've mattered all that much anyways.

Unless they figure out how to play away from home, I think this is looking like a middle of the pack B1G team and not one competing for a conference championship. The Xavier win was nice, but that is looking more like an outlier than the norm.

[Hovadipo 58,765]

1 minute ago, southernindianahoosier2 said:

1. The cut or "Fit" is out of touch with the current styles. At one point IU was rocking sleeveless style where the current trend was the spaghetti tank

2. The stars on the back just make the uniform look dumpy

3. The Adidas logo breaking up the piping makes the uniform look non symmetrical

4. Why do we have 0 alternate uniforms????

5. Why do we have 0 collabs? IU Could easily get a collab with Aimé Leon Dore, Noah, or Kidsuper

6. Where's the script Indiana Jersey? 

7. What about a throwback Cream colored Jersey? 

8. Look at the IU shop, I dare you to find the powder blue quarter zips, or orange shirts the football teams wear?...

9. We talk a lot about IUFB... Wheres the cross-collab LEO jerseys? 

10. Why is there no LEO swag available in the shop? I couldn't even fid a shirt. I'd buy a LEO skull cap or bandana... NOPE don't exist outside of the players.

11. Why can't we have a fun Bison Mascot on an alternate uniform and the side of the pants like Kansas and the JayHawk? 

12. Does IU not get a portion of sales from IU Adidas merch? I tried to buy a quarter zip on the shop for christmas and couldn't find anything. I checked purdue and they have 9! thats 9 pages of swag with like 6 quarterzips to choose from. 

13. I was at the Arizona game and almost all of the swag was from the ancillary shirt companies like homefield, or shirts with the Bison.. Why is IU not capitalizing on that? 

14. My buddy played D1 tennis and said that their swag was night an Day to IU's... 

15. Even if Nike pays $3m less on a contract.... Don't we receive a portion of the sales... wouldn't 9 pages of Nike IU swag make up the difference there? 

 

We aren’t elite because you can’t find a 1/4 zip you like..?

[southernindianahoosier2 950]

1 hour ago, WayneFleekHoosier said:

Off the dome?

UCLA, Arizona, Arkansas, Alabama to some extent.

Strong basketball schools, 3 of the 4. So kinda expected to have a smoother transition but no guarantee. Indiana should have never gotten themselves in this mess. Terrible decisions compounded by more terrible decisions coupled with an AD that isn’t truly concerned with winning but more concerned with peacocking morals and ethics. McRobbie was lining the Indiana pockets through other means, athletics is the sideshow.


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Agree. Virtue signaling this superior morality at the cost of winning anything. My friend worked for the IU foundation and said her team had to actively hide any big donations to the School from McRobbie, he would try to get involved and people would pull their funds. 

[southernindianahoosier2 950]

9 minutes ago, Hovadipo said:

We aren’t elite because you can’t find a 1/4 zip you like..?

If IU was serious about being elite, they would take the opportunity to leverage gear to make $$ and entice recruits to come and play here. IU then takes that money and uses it to fund, NIL, New Practice Facility, you name it.... Also I'm not saying there was a quarter zip and I didn't like it, I'm saying I found 0 quarter zips... Come to NYC and you'll see how quickly IU is out of touch with fashion.