IUBB vs. Marian University (exhib) Sat., Oct. 29, 3 p.m. B1G+

[IUc2016 7,121]

I am a huge Jordan Geronimo fan. Not as big of a Race Thompson fan because of his lack of fit next to TJD. Just feel it gives our team a ceiling. I think Race is an awesome leader and rep of this team, so I am certainly glad he is on it. 

I just would rather see Race come off the bench for minutes at the 5 and start someone at the 4 with the ability to play on the perimeter and make more athletic plays. He tends to get lost on defense when he isn't guarding his man 1-1 in the post.

I know that will not happen though so it is just wishful thinking.

[Stuhoo 82,149]

21 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

One good thing is Parker is not on the team any longer and JHS will be getting his minutes. 

I see three monumental upgrades for this season:

1. Jalen Hood-Schifino instead of Parker Stewart and Rob Phinisee, 
2. Malik Reneau instead of Michael Durr, and
3. An established system instead of a system that was learned throughout the season

They are all very, very important and are gonna be a whole lot of fun to watch.

 

[Stuhoo 82,149]

1 minute ago, IUc2016 said:

I am a huge Jordan Geronimo fan. Not as big of a Race Thompson fan because of his lack of fit next to TJD. Just feel it gives our team a ceiling. I think Race is an awesome leader and rep of this team, so I am certainly glad he is on it. 

I just would rather see Race come off the bench for minutes at the 5 and start someone at the 4 with the ability to play on the perimeter and make more athletic plays. He tends to get lost on defense when he isn't guarding his man 1-1 in the post.

I know that will not happen though so it is just wishful thinking.

It happened a lot down the stretch last season. I care a lot less about who starts than about who finishes. 

In the Michigan, Illinois, and Wyoming wins Miller Kopp and Race Thompson started, but Trey Galloway and Jordan Geronimo primarily finished.

[Chris007 46,547]

4 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

I see three monumental upgrades for this season:

1. Jalen Hood-Schifino instead of Parker Stewart and Rob Phinisee, 
2. Malik Reneau instead of Michael Durr, and
3. An established system instead of a system that was learned throughout the season

They are all very, very important and are gonna be a whole lot of fun to watch.

 

Sometimes I have to give credit whether I like it or not but you are exactly right. You found your acorn for the day

[IUc2016 7,121]

5 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

It happened a lot down the stretch last season. I care a lot less about who starts than about who finishes. 

In the Michigan, Illinois, and Wyoming wins Miller Kopp and Race Thompson started, but Trey Galloway and Jordan Geronimo primarily finished.

I care about both honestly, I have never really agreed with not caring who starts. You can't dig yourself a hole from the start and we did that a lot with starting (PS, MK, and RT). 

And again, Race came in and played next to TJD. He hardly ever came in at the 5 to spell him. 

[HoosierHoopster 7,270]

16 minutes ago, IUc2016 said:

I care about both honestly, I have never really agreed with not caring who starts. You can't dig yourself a hole from the start and we did that a lot with starting (PS, MK, and RT). 

And again, Race came in and played next to TJD. He hardly ever came in at the 5 to spell him. 

Agree with both of  you -- we dug ourselves into holes in various games while always starting both PS and MK regardless of matchups, whether they were playing well or poorly, regardless of how well others played in preceding games or who was playing well together.

I'm a big believer in Woodson and where we're headed and think we're going to shine this season, but I'm not a fan of just sitting back and supporting bad coaching decisions because it's Woodson/former IU guy etc., he's been adjusting to coaching college kids and he favors vets (which I understand and don't really fault) but he was adjusting/learning and starting and playing the MK/PS combo irrespective of anything was just not a good coaching decision.

And finishing to me is at least as important as starting. The games ebb and flow and when we see adjustment and the guys finishing reflect who should be on the floor for O or D or to match up with the other guys or who are playing well together, etc., that tends to bring more W's.

In any event, this roster has better fit, Kopp may score at a higher level (he needs to justify starting, imo) with the spacing, movement and much better all around play we can expect to see with JHS/X. He's a good set shot shooter, he can help open the floor if -- and it's an if -- he's getting and taking shots while the ball moves, inside out etc. Bates brings scoring at 3 levels, and JG brings much faster play and athleticism, high level rebounding and D (perimeter D his growth area) with shooting (I think we'll see his outside shooting grow into the 35% range) at big moments. And Gallo brings just about everything but demonstrated shooting. Now you add in Ren too? I'm pretty stoked for this season.

[IUc2016 7,121]

14 minutes ago, HoosierHoopster said:

Agree with both of  you -- we dug ourselves into holes in various games while always starting both PS and MK regardless of matchups, whether they were playing well or poorly, regardless of how well others played in preceding games or who was playing well together.

I'm a big believer in Woodson and where we're headed and think we're going to shine this season, but I'm not a fan of just sitting back and supporting bad coaching decisions because it's Woodson/former IU guy etc., he's been adjusting to coaching college kids and he favors vets (which I understand and don't really fault) but he was adjusting/learning and starting and playing the MK/PS combo irrespective of anything was just not a good coaching decision.

And finishing to me is at least as important as starting. The games ebb and flow and when we see adjustment and the guys finishing reflect who should be on the floor for O or D or to match up with the other guys or who are playing well together, etc., that tends to bring more W's.

In any event, this roster has better fit, Kopp may score at a higher level (he needs to justify starting, imo) with the spacing, movement and much better all around play we can expect to see with JHS/X. He's a good set shot shooter, he can help open the floor if -- and it's an if -- he's getting and taking shots while the ball moves, inside out etc. Bates brings scoring at 3 levels, and JG brings much faster play and athleticism, high level rebounding and D (perimeter D his growth area) with shooting (I think we'll see his outside shooting grow into the 35% range) at big moments. And Gallo brings just about everything but demonstrated shooting. Now you add in Ren too? I'm pretty stoked for this season.

Agreed. I love Woody, but my biggest gripe was his rotations. And honestly, the Race and Trayce issue is not really his fault, just a matter of dealing with poor roster construction from the previous coach. 

I too, am stoked for this season.

[HoosierFan1994 4,777]

1 hour ago, IUc2016 said:

I am a huge Jordan Geronimo fan. Not as big of a Race Thompson fan because of his lack of fit next to TJD. Just feel it gives our team a ceiling. I think Race is an awesome leader and rep of this team, so I am certainly glad he is on it. 

I just would rather see Race come off the bench for minutes at the 5 and start someone at the 4 with the ability to play on the perimeter and make more athletic plays. He tends to get lost on defense when he isn't guarding his man 1-1 in the post.

I know that will not happen though so it is just wishful thinking.

I'm kind of with you..as long as Jordan can play a much bigger role (reserve to a starter). But, it won't happen. Race has been getting 28 minutes a game the last two years. I think that number, along with producation, will decrease a little. Don't get me wrong, he's a good player and an awesome teammate. But, there are times his game doesn't fit the flow of the game. I'd kind of like to see him and Jordan split that 4 spot at times. 

[HoosierFan1994 4,777]

1 hour ago, Stuhoo said:

I see three monumental upgrades for this season:

1. Jalen Hood-Schifino instead of Parker Stewart and Rob Phinisee, 
2. Malik Reneau instead of Michael Durr, and
3. An established system instead of a system that was learned throughout the season

They are all very, very important and are gonna be a whole lot of fun to watch.

 

Spot. On. Man, I hope Jalen isn't a one and done. I'd love to see him and Malik start together. 

[cthomas 6,523]

I see a lot of talk about guys being "three level scorers" but I don't currently see that on this roster. The potential is there but no one returning has established that they can do that. Until one of the guys who can get to the basket develops a consistent three point shot, we'll have the same problem we have dealt with for the past several years. Teams will pack it in and cut off driving lanes.

[HoosierFan1994 4,777]

47 minutes ago, cthomas said:

I see a lot of talk about guys being "three level scorers" but I don't currently see that on this roster. The potential is there but no one returning has established that they can do that. Until one of the guys who can get to the basket develops a consistent three point shot, we'll have the same problem we have dealt with for the past several years. Teams will pack it in and cut off driving lanes.

This, specifically good teams. This is the difference between this team losing the first weekend and making the second weekend and beyond. 

[HoosierHoopster 7,270]

1 hour ago, cthomas said:

I see a lot of talk about guys being "three level scorers" but I don't currently see that on this roster. The potential is there but no one returning has established that they can do that. Until one of the guys who can get to the basket develops a consistent three point shot, we'll have the same problem we have dealt with for the past several years. Teams will pack it in and cut off driving lanes.

Think you're referring to my comments -- no question that Bates came to IU as a three level scorer, that was all over the scouting reports and that's what he showed at the HS level, agree he didn't demonstrate that (consistently) as a frosh, but I'd bet on his showing it this season, he absolutely has three level scoring ability -- and we've already seen some of his outside shooting improvements to start this year -- he was a strong outside shooter coming to IU, he's found his range.

[IU Scott 2,375]

1 hour ago, cthomas said:

I see a lot of talk about guys being "three level scorers" but I don't currently see that on this roster. The potential is there but no one returning has established that they can do that. Until one of the guys who can get to the basket develops a consistent three point shot, we'll have the same problem we have dealt with for the past several years. Teams will pack it in and cut off driving lanes.

I think XJ proved that he can score at the rim as well as shooting the 3

[Stuhoo 82,149]

19 minutes ago, HoosierHoopster said:

Think you're referring to my comments -- no question that Bates came to IU as a three level scorer, that was all over the scouting reports and that's what he showed at the HS level, agree he didn't demonstrate that (consistently) as a frosh, but I'd bet on his showing it this season, he absolutely has three level scoring ability -- and we've already seen some of his outside shooting improvements to start this year -- he was a strong outside shooter coming to IU, he's found his range.

Last year Tamar Bates was a "no level scorer."

I'd be ecstatic if he's a one or two level this year.

[J34 1,511]

5 hours ago, Chris007 said:

One good thing is Parker is not on the team any longer and JHS will be getting his minutes. 

Definitely a net gain!

[HoosierHoopster 7,270]

1 hour ago, Stuhoo said:

Last year Tamar Bates was a "no level scorer."

I'd be ecstatic if he's a one or two level this year.

I think you'll be ecstatic

[DChoosier 8,884]

3 hours ago, cthomas said:

I see a lot of talk about guys being "three level scorers" but I don't currently see that on this roster. The potential is there but no one returning has established that they can do that. Until one of the guys who can get to the basket develops a consistent three point shot, we'll have the same problem we have dealt with for the past several years. Teams will pack it in and cut off driving lanes.

I agree for the most part but X did show 3 level ability the last 10 games or so when he made better decisions and hit 3’s at a much higher clip.

The “eye test” tells me we got better late last year, that the X-TJD combo found their groove etc etc all of which are positives. On the other hand “the record is the record” and at the end of the season, in which we feel we got hot, our record was:

Last 2 games 1-1

Last 4 games 2-2

Last 6 games 3-3

Last 8 games 4-4

Last 10 games 5-5

Last 12 game 5-7

A mediocre end of season record (albeit against some good teams), 9-11 in the BT  and  hoping the offense improves, that Bates becomes a 3 level scorer (I incorrectly thought he would be starting by the end of last year), JG becomes a three, JHS is as advertised (which I think he will be) all give me pause about rankings that have us in the top 10.  
That being said I think we have a very high floor and our ceiling can elevate if two of JHS, Bates and/or JG can meaningfully contribute this year (I’ll also throw in Trey if he can spread the D by hitting 35% or so from the 3).

[Hoosierfan2017 22,135]

5 hours ago, HoosierHoopster said:

Think you're referring to my comments -- no question that Bates came to IU as a three level scorer, that was all over the scouting reports and that's what he showed at the HS level, agree he didn't demonstrate that (consistently) as a frosh, but I'd bet on his showing it this season, he absolutely has three level scoring ability -- and we've already seen some of his outside shooting improvements to start this year -- he was a strong outside shooter coming to IU, he's found his range.

The season hasn’t even started yet so idk how we’ve seen that… 

[HoosierHoopster 7,270]

22 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

The season hasn’t even started yet so idk how we’ve seen that… 

We’ve seen him shoot at HH, we’ve heard and read multiple reports about him including his shooting from the practices and scrimmages, no need to be snarky of course we haven’t seen it in games yet, I’m betting we will

[go iu bb 6,776]

Just now, HoosierHoopster said:

We’ve seen him shoot at HH, we’ve heard and read multiple reports about him including his shooting from the practices and scrimmages, no need to be snarky of course we haven’t seen it in games yet, I’m betting we will

A lot of people are reluctant to believe that someone's shooting has greatly improved until they see it in actual games. Throughout the Miller years, we seemed to always hear that so-and-so was a "sniper in practice, you'll see when the season begins." It never worked out. Even heading into last year, Bates, Kopp, and/or Stewart were going to fix the shooting woes. Didn't happen. So after that over and over, is surprising that people are cynical?