They Fired Tom Allen!

[Hardwood83 4,747]

5 hours ago, TTT said:

Just keep T.A. and let contract run its course.  Unless a football miracle for remainder of contract… make sure T.A. is not extended if IU would happen to have a 6 and 6 season (win 2 or 3 games in a row…still looking for program stability)

Regardless, the circumstances not to long ago IU had a nationally ranked team if decision making was based on  identifying what it had in DeBoer, Womack…and Penix vs giving expensive long contract extension.

I just confirmed, per Indystar: If, for example, he were to be fired without cause following the 2023 season, Indiana University would still owe him more than $20 million. Beginning Dec. 1, 2024, IU’s duty falls to just 50% of that remaining income, a substantially smaller amount. Termination on that date, for example, would require the university to pay Allen a little under $8 million, and that number would fall under $6 million a year later.

In other words, nothing is gonna happen until after 12/1/24. 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,619]

17 minutes ago, Hardwood83 said:

Well, sure but I don't think the biggest issue with your proposition is with IU or even money. I can't imagine any scenario where Meyer returns to a job the level of IU. Can't hurt to make the call though. 

Gotta make the call. I don't think there are any big time programs with a job coming open anytime soon except maybe Texas A&M.

[go iu bb 5,532]

1 hour ago, Hardwood83 said:

I just confirmed, per Indystar: If, for example, he were to be fired without cause following the 2023 season, Indiana University would still owe him more than $20 million. Beginning Dec. 1, 2024, IU’s duty falls to just 50% of that remaining income, a substantially smaller amount. Termination on that date, for example, would require the university to pay Allen a little under $8 million, and that number would fall under $6 million a year later.

In other words, nothing is gonna happen until after 12/1/24. 

It's unfortunate but true.

[monskisprodigy 1,814]

8 hours ago, TTT said:

Just keep T.A. and let contract run its course.  Unless a football miracle for remainder of contract… make sure T.A. is not extended if IU would happen to have a 6 and 6 season (win 2 or 3 games in a row…still looking for program stability)

Regardless, the circumstances not to long ago IU had a nationally ranked team if decision making was based on  identifying what it had in DeBoer, Womack…and Penix vs giving expensive long contract extension.

I’m pretty sure his contract has an automatic 1 year extension added if he makes a bowl game.
 

Dudes agent pulled a masterclass on Dolson. 

[LamarCheeks 18,070]

You'd like to think that IU is a place coaches go to stay -- as long as they're successful -- rather than as a stepping stone. Though Glass was still the main man at the time, I wonder if Dolson had Tracy Smith and Chris Lemonis on his mind after CTA had a couple good years, and panicked.

Because man -- that was a foolish contract extension. 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 8,619]

34 minutes ago, LamarCheeks said:

You'd like to think that IU is a place coaches go to stay -- as long as they're successful -- rather than as a stepping stone. Though Glass was still the main man at the time, I wonder if Dolson had Tracy Smith and Chris Lemonis on his mind after CTA had a couple good years, and panicked.

Because man -- that was a foolish contract extension. 

Insanely foolish considering no one was after Allen.

[rayl456 475]

I have often thought that Allen being hired as HC by IU was a really, really bad imitation of Gerry Faust being hired by Notre Dame back in 1981.  

[Naturalhoosier 15,407]

13 hours ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

1. Urban Meyer

2. Kliff Kingsbury

3. Kane Wommack

4. Antwaan Randle El

 

If you're gonna throw 5M at a dude... it isn't Tom Allen. It's Urban Meyer. If you actually care to ever win in football, it's Urban Meyer.

Is ARE coaching at this point?  Legit question. I don’t know his status. 

[Stuhoo 79,751]

13 hours ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

1. Urban Meyer

2. Kliff Kingsbury

3. Kane Wommack

4. Antwaan Randle El

 

If you're gonna throw 5M at a dude... it isn't Tom Allen. It's Urban Meyer. If you actually care to ever win in football, it's Urban Meyer.

1. Urban Meyer is an excellent, winning football coach.
2. Urban Meyer, in my opinion, is a dirtbag.
3. There are excellent, winning football coaches that are not dirtbags.

Summary takeaway? A school does not need to hire a dirtbag to get an excellent, winning football coach.

[rayl456 475]

11 minutes ago, Naturalhoosier said:

Is ARE coaching at this point?  Legit question. I don’t know his status. 

ARE is the wide receivers coach for the Detroit Lions.

[go iu bb 5,532]

11 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

1. Urban Meyer is an excellent, winning football coach.
2. Urban Meyer, in my opinion, is a dirtbag.
3. There are excellent, winning football coaches that are not dirtbags.

Summary takeaway? A school does not need to hire a dirtbag to get an excellent, winning football coach.

Moot point because Urban Meyer wouldn't even consider coaching at IU. The only way that might happen is for an absolutely ridiculous amount of money, waaaaay more than IU is willing to spend on football. And even then he probably wouldn't be interested in this train wreck.

[Stuhoo 79,751]

And while Kingsbury would also not have interest in IUFB,  I am not sure why he is an attractive option for any team.

Kingsbury's head coaching record? 

• College: 36-38, 19-35 in conference.
• Pro: 28-37

Wommack makes $772k/$1.7m after bonuses. That could work.

Randle El has never been a head coach but he truly has a Mike Woodson affection for IU, and while he would be a dice roll as a P5 head coach, that could also work.

[Lebowski 2,442]

Folks, Meyer isn't going to coach IUFB. Nor is any big time established winning HC. It's a pipe dream to think this. This job isn't that kind of job. Nor is ARE a Coach Prime type hire. Come back down here on Earth 1 and evaluate the current and overall picture of IUFB.

Serious question, if, and it's a big if, this year's IUFB team goes bowling and wins said bowl; those advocating the termination of CTA still want him gone? Follow up questions, if you still think he should go, what are your expectations for IUFB? If you think he shouldn't go, is it as simple as bowl or bust for you?

[MemphisHoosier 2,048]

12 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

And while Kingsbury would also not have interest in IUFB,  I am not sure why he is an attractive option for any team.

Kingsbury's head coaching record? 

• College: 36-38, 19-35 in conference.
• Pro: 28-37

Wommack makes $772k/$1.7m after bonuses. That could work.

Randle El has never been a head coach but he truly has a Mike Woodson affection for IU, and while he would be a dice roll as a P5 head coach, that could also work.

I highly doubt Womack comes back to Bloomington to replace his friend and mentor while the seat is still warm.

[Hardwood83 4,747]

1 minute ago, Lebowski said:

Folks, Meyer isn't going to coach IUFB. Nor is any big time established winning HC. It's a pipe dream to think this. This job isn't that kind of job. Nor is ARE a Coach Prime type hire. Come back down here on Earth 1 and evaluate the current and overall picture of IUFB.

Serious question, if, and it's a big if, this year's IUFB team goes bowling and wins said bowl; those advocating the termination of CTA still want him gone? Follow up questions, if you still think he should go, what are your expectations for IUFB? If you think he shouldn't go, is it as simple as bowl or bust for you?

I am not one that is advocating for him to be fired, but will answer any way. If IU makes a bowl this year he is completely off the hot seat and likely gives him a couple more years at very least. IU football expectations are very low. 

Now, do I think that is gonna happen? ..........

[Hoosierfan2017 20,921]

28 minutes ago, Lebowski said:

Serious question, if, and it's a big if, this year's IUFB team goes bowling and wins said bowl; those advocating the termination of CTA still want him gone? Follow up questions, if you still think he should go, what are your expectations for IUFB? If you think he shouldn't go, is it as simple as bowl or bust for you?

Honestly? Yes. I don’t like Allen’s personality. I find it embarrassing, to be frank. I think he’s bad at holding people accountable. His in-game management is not good. Far too often he plays ‘not to get blown out,’ versus playing to win. The OSU game this year, for example. No one can convince me that he went into that game with a game plan designed to win. 

As for expectations, I don’t really have any at this point. 6-7 wins more often than not would be nice. 

[LamarCheeks 18,070]

1 hour ago, rayl456 said:

I have often thought that Allen being hired as HC by IU was a really, really bad imitation of Gerry Faust being hired by Notre Dame back in 1981.  

I see your point, but it never felt that way to me. CTA actually did have have some college experience and even a little success -- but as a coordinator. Faust hadn't coached one second of college ball when he got the ND gig. 

To me, hiring CTA felt like the hirings of Bill Lynch and Mike Davis. Rather than perforn their due dilligence and conduct a national search, the ADs just took the path of least resistence and hired the interim coach. Clearly, neither was ready for a job like IU. 

When Glass announced the parting of the ways wth Wilson and Allen was there, I thought -- "That makes sense, he's gonna be the interim coach." But when Freddy said he had hired Allen for the permanent gig, I thought -- "Oh, no -- here we go again." 

 

[rayl456 475]

21 minutes ago, LamarCheeks said:

I see your point, but it never felt that way to me. CTA actually did have have some college experience and even a little success -- but as a coordinator. Faust hadn't coached one second of college ball when he got the ND gig. 

To me, hiring CTA felt like the hirings of Bill Lynch and Mike Davis. Rather than perforn their due dilligence and conduct a national search, the ADs just took the path of least resistence and hired the interim coach. Clearly, neither was ready for a job like IU. 

When Glass announced the parting of the ways wth Wilson and Allen was there, I thought -- "That makes sense, he's gonna be the interim coach." But when Freddy said he had hired Allen for the permanent gig, I thought -- "Oh, no -- here we go again." 

 

Good point!  I knew he'd been a coordinator prior to IU... but still thought of him as a high school coach.  Ofc, Notre Dame didn't waste time moving on from Gerry when it became obvious he wasn't going to lead them back to the land of milk and honey.  No forty years wandering in the desert with him for ND.

[Lebowski 2,442]

41 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Honestly? Yes. I don’t like Allen’s personality. I find it embarrassing, to be frank. I think he’s bad at holding people accountable. His in-game management is not good. Far too often he plays ‘not to get blown out,’ versus playing to win. The OSU game this year, for example. No one can convince me that he went into that game with a game plan designed to win. 

As for expectations, I don’t really have any at this point. 6-7 wins more often than not would be nice. 

Thanks for sharing and there's a lot to unpack here. I don't want to discuss the specifics of that OSU game because I don't think it's really necessary in the grand scheme of things. I'll just say that I don't agree with you about his game plan. But like you said, no one can convince you and I'm certainly not going to try. I'd rather discuss the bigger picture if that makes sense. You're definitely bring up some valid points about accountability. I've already mentioned on here that his loyalty will most likely be the reason for him ultimately getting let go. That trait is something you want in a friend but when it comes to performing a job sometimes being loyal to a friend doesn't work and makes matters worse. As it did for him. 

Your expectations are actually pretty fair considering the history of IUFB.

Is it safe to say you never liked the hire to begin with? If so, did you still feel the same way when they were ranked 11th in 2020 and had 8 wins in 2019?  Basically asking if you felt the same when IUFB reached well beyond your own expectations. Like way above your ceiling. If you did like the hire, when did it change for you? Like when the wheels fell off after 2020?

Again, thanks for sharing and appreciate it. 

[Lebowski 2,442]

19 minutes ago, rayl456 said:

Good point!  I knew he'd been a coordinator... but still thought of him as a high school coach.  Ofc, Notre Dame didn't waste time moving on from Gerry when it became obvious he wasn't going to lead them back to the land of milk and honey.  No forty years wandering in the desert with him for ND.

Not that any of this matters but Coach Prime was also a high school coach with zero experience coaching at the college level when he got hired at Jackson State. To this day, he still has less college coaching experience than CTA. I'm just pointing that out because personally, I don't think it matters if someone coached high school football. What matters is what kind of other coaches you surround yourself with and how you manage your staff. X's and O's don't change at any level. Just my two cents.