IU vs WIU- Game Thread 11/5 @ 7 pm BTN+

[fwgreenway]

Didn't see the game (listen to the radio) and read btb. A lot to like to open the season. And just think if/when our seniors (Green & Davis) get healthy - this team might surprise me with their end results.

[mdn82]

I didn’t see his comments Monday, but in watching the team I don’t see any way that a healthy Phinisee, Green and Durham don’t start. It’s just one game, but IU looked their best when they went small last night, when they pushed the ball and were athletic on defense. Those three guys are the guys that make everything happen, they’re the most experienced guys, etc.

I see Brunk ultimately coming off the bench as the first big coming in with De’Ron getting situational minutes. 

He had talked about being mainly big trying to draw fouls early. Sticking to a strict script early in the season in the 1st half during good and bad. Then in the 2nd half go with what’s working. I agree Al was one of the best players last night but I don’t see him starting over Smith. To me they both looked like players playing for their minutes and I think both get them.

 

 

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[Napleshoosier]

Our lineup will probably depend on the teams we are playing. Should be fun to watch though. As we move into the meat of the season I doubt if Anderson gets a lot of time but the rest will get minutes. I hope Deron gets back.



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[BGleas]

50 minutes ago, mdn82 said:

He had talked about being mainly big trying to draw fouls early. Sticking to a strict script early in the season in the 1st half during good and bad. Then in the 2nd half go with what’s working. I agree Al was one of the best players last night but I don’t see him starting over Smith. To me they both looked like players playing for their minutes and I think both get them.

 

 

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He's not going to start over Smith, he's going to start with Smith. 

[mdn82]

He's not going to start over Smith, he's going to start with Smith. 

Who do you have sitting? Brunk? Or Green? I think Green is more likely than Brunk if Al HAS to start. I think his versatility gives more options off of the bench to start. I still think Al ends up 3rd on mpg even if he doesn’t start. Purely going from what Archie said Monday and in the past I don’t see this as a situation where we go that route, but we will see. I know it’s the thing to do here is to say if someone doesn’t start that means you dislike them. I am not that at all when it comes to Al. I just like his versatility 1-3 dependent how the game starts. We all know Archie isn’t going to change his starting lineup much. To me? I really don’t care as he could sub in Al or whomever 30 seconds in and it’s the same difference.

 

 

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[Stuhoo]

5 minutes ago, mdn82 said:

Who do you have sitting? Brunk? Or Green?


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At this point Green I would guess.

When DeVonte gets back and fully acclimated that could change.

 

[BtownBanner6]

Just my opinion, but the prototypical starting lineup is going to have Brunk, TJD and Smith in it. I also think green is a lock, so one of Rob and Al will “come off the bench” but will get starter minutes. Then Archie will go with a bigger or smaller lineup late in the game based on what worked. Not important to get hung up on the technical “Starters” when probably 7 or 8 guys will all have around the same minutes 

[mdn82]

 

At this point Green I would guess.

When DeVonte gets back and fully acclimated that could change.

 

And that could be fair if Al continues to shoot the ball well. Archie has been very open about Green being the main if not the only one that can create for his own shot regularly. That’s also why I said in my original post I suspect my lineup that FK scoffed at was for the FSU game when it gets real. The next 6 games will be heavily scripted (Archie’s words). I too could see them easing Green into it until then.

 

 

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[mdn82]

Just my opinion, but the prototypical starting lineup is going to have Brunk, TJD and Smith in it. I also think green is a lock, so one of Rob and Al will “come off the bench” but will get starter minutes. Then Archie will go with a bigger or smaller lineup late in the game based on what worked. Not important to get hung up on the technical “Starters” when probably 7 or 8 guys will all have around the same minutes 

Completely agree and that was my overall point on my initial post I got blasted on. Because according to FK our most centered resident that was stupid because Al is our best player.... But it’s FK. So yeah lol... My thing is depth. I am not getting hung up on who is considered a starter. I expect minutes to go to Green and Al 1 and 2. I don’t expect both to start.

 

 

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[jk34]

I don't really care who starts. I can't wait to see who's on the floor in the last 4 or 5 minutes when the games on the line!

[BGleas]

9 minutes ago, mdn82 said:

Who do you have sitting? Brunk? Or Green? I think Green is more likely than Brunk if Al HAS to start. I think his versatility gives more options off of the bench to start. I still think Al ends up 3rd on mpg even if he doesn’t start. Purely going from what Archie said Monday and in the past I don’t see this as a situation where we go that route, but we will see. I know it’s the thing to do here is to say if someone doesn’t start that means you dislike them. I am not that at all when it comes to Al. I just like his versatility 1-3 dependent how the game starts. We all know Archie isn’t going to change his starting lineup much. To me? I really don’t care as he could sub in Al or whomever 30 seconds in and it’s the same difference.

 

 

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Phinisee, Green, Durham, Smith, TJD. Bench: Brunk, Franklin, Hunter, Thompson, Anderson. 

It was just one game, but the team looked much better with an athletic, more guard/wing oriented lineup, and add to it that Davis doesn't look right, which would justify bringing Brunk off the bench because of interior depth. 

I think all the "Archie said we're going big" talk has been overblown. He also has said IU can only go big if the bigs prove they can do it defensively. Postgame last night he also aknowleged that the team played better when they got more athletic with Smith and TJD at the forward spots together. 

[Napleshoosier]

I think Devonte is going to look somewhat like Carson Edwards this year but with some restraint as he will open up the court allowing the rest easy buckets especially if Al and Rob continue hot. This could be fun to watch. Coupled with “Indiana” being spelled with a “D” again since what feels like a bazillion years. Hope Smith is shooting 500 three’s a day with Al!


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[mdn82]

Phinisee, Green, Durham, Smith, TJD. Bench: Brunk, Franklin, Hunter, Thompson, Anderson. 

It was just one game, but the team looked much better with an athletic, more guard/wing oriented lineup, and add to it that Davis doesn't look right, which would justify bringing Brunk off the bench because of interior depth. 

I think all the "Archie said we're going big" talk has been overblown. He also has said IU can only go big if the bigs prove they can do it defensively. Postgame last night he also aknowleged that the team played better when they got more athletic with Smith and TJD at the forward spots together. 

It was one game where the other team was dramatically smaller, less athletic, and just not good. We will see. I personally would be pretty surprised if we go that way to start.

 

Edit: As for Davis this is how he has showed up early in the season all four years. He starts slow and then picks it up as the season gets going. I agree he was off. But that really is the same as every other year. But I don’t expect him to play more than 12-15 mpg due to us going small at times. I expect a 3 guard lineup maybe 15 mpg. A lot of that is dependent on Smith and Hunter playing well enough to keep the size on the floor.

 

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[Stuhoo]

12 minutes ago, mdn82 said:

And that could be fair if Al continues to shoot the ball well. Archie has been very open about Green being the main if not the only one that can create for his own shot regularly. That’s also why I said in my original post I suspect my lineup that FK scoffed at was for the FSU game when it gets real. The next 6 games will be heavily scripted (Archie’s words). I too could see them easing Green into it until then.

 

 

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That's on point. But, we don't know what we don't know about DeVonte's health and how soon until he completely re-integrates.

What we DO know is that Al Durham is likely to consistently remain one of five best players. I doubt Al is on the bench at the start of the game; I'm sure he won't be on the bench at the end of games.

 

[BGleas]

1 minute ago, mdn82 said:

It was one game where the other team was dramatically smaller, less athletic, and just not good. We will see. I personally would be pretty surprised if we go that way to start.


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Disagree. It puts everyone at their more natural position, at least in terms of how basketball is played in 2019. I also think the lineup will change at times. Of course playing Purdue or MSU we might go bigger for longer stretches. But if you want the most talented, athletic, skilled lineup on the court, until Hunter is fully ready to go, it's a lineup of 3 guards/wings and Smith and TJD at the forwards. That might not be the lineup that starts for whatever reason, but it's the best lineup. 

It makes IU athletic, skilled, a better shooting team, and able to play a more transition game which Archie has said he wants to do. It also brings more versatility and athleticism defensively. 

[mdn82]

 
That's on point. But, we don't know what we don't know about DeVonte's health and how soon until he completely re-integrates.
What we DO know is that Al Durham is likely to consistently remain one of five best players. I doubt Al is on the bench at the start of the game; I'm sure he won't be on the bench at the end of games.
 

Me too on the end of the game. To me he can be that Sheehey type player when we were good. I just think when Green wasn’t starting he wasn’t as engaged, and he struggled when he came in. As a starter far better. Kind of like Sheehey coming off the bench was great. As a starter? Not so much. That’s why I would go that route. But I really wouldn’t care either way that much as the first person in will come in at the 4 min mark. If we thin the rotation, the 2nd tv timeout. That’s been standard for Archie. It’s just great we can have this discussion because we finally have legit depth.


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[Stuhoo]

1 minute ago, mdn82 said:

Me too on the end of the game. To me he can be that Sheehey type player when we were good. I just think when Green wasn’t starting he wasn’t as engaged, and he struggled when he came in. As a starter far better. Kind of like Sheehey coming off the bench was great. As a starter? Not so much. That’s why I would go that route. But I really wouldn’t care either way that much as the first person in will come in at the 4 min mark. If we thin the rotation, the 2nd tv timeout. That’s been standard for Archie. It’s just great we can have this discussion because we finally have legit depth.


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I believe the term is "happy problems!"

 

[Hardwood83]

Al strikes me as a "team first" guy that would respond better to coming off the bench than some others. That, along with his versatility to play 1-3, makes me think he could be 6th man. Whatever else happens, I really hope last night was the coming out party for he and Smith. Having legit scoring options from those two makes IU so much tougher. 

Franklin was impressive too. 8 assists to 0 TO's is solid against any sentient opposition. The fact he's not even a Point Guard is terrific. 

[mdn82]

This isn’t at Stu or BGleas at all. This is more at the initial response that started this from FK. Can we all disagree and discuss things without being a complete asshat? Like this whole if you disagree with me you are stupid thing that started during the football season is annoying as hell. It has made it where people no longer know how to respond to someone they disagree with without being a complete dick from the start.


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[Stuhoo]

Just now, mdn82 said:

This isn’t at Stu or BGleas at all. This is more at the initial response that started this from FK. Can we all disagree and discuss things without being a complete asshat? Like this whole if you disagree with me you are stupid thing that started during the football season is annoying as hell. It has made it where people no longer know how to respond to someone they disagree with without being a complete dick from the start.


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^^I know that this post is not about me or BGleas, because we both are only partial asshats!^^