Random Archie/Basketball Talk

[Old Friend 8,389]

54 minutes ago, mdn82 said:

Look on the first page. You can see my response to your initial quote. Then it was after that. Just look before you spout off idiotic things like this. You took offense to my comment about OSU on the first page. Who got chippy with who first? Treat people how I am treated.


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Here is your response...and as mentioned....you....responded to me.  I never referenced you, made mention of you, or replied to anything directly to you.  This is on you. :  What coaching style, both in tempo and offense/defense does Holtman run versus Thad Matta? You know he developed the Butler way right? Stevens was an assistant who adopted his playing style. Holtman and Archie both have ties to this system. When Holtman went to OSU he had a 5* Senior and other valuable pieces where he didn’t have to create a new culture. He stepped in and ran. Much like Archie would have done there. The culture was what Butler and Xavier had been the last 15 years. They just needed a new voice. We needed a new culture. 

Here's mine to that :  

Well, that would be the easy way to look at it if you're into excuses.  (Stevens did a lot more than adopt a style; and Matta's last 2 seasons at OSU were NIT and a missed postseason, so it's not as though that was something just "in place and an easy transition.")

When did we hear when Archie was hired it would take a "total rebuild?"   You think that's what he told recruits?  OSU lost 41 PPG off last season's team in just Tate, Williams, and Diop.  And still sit 16-7 and beat Indiana on its home floor a season later.  

Yeah, it's the Brooks thread, so I'll stop; leaving it at "you and I see things a little differently."  I agree on the culture; but with a top 10 recruiting class added to what came back, I think expectations should have been higher than 13-11; especially after a 12-2 start.

To borrow your words, you can look it up for yourself from there, but all I did was tell you Stevens did more than that, which you turned into Stevens being a plug and play and made up a bunch of things you said you said....which you didn't.  You got defensive telling me you're not my kid....for some reason.  And you're getting on me for taking offense?  Who's the one referring to the other using words like "dense" or "idiotic?"  Who started with condescension?   That's on you, my man.  Smiling.  Must be a long winter up there in Huntington...  So what's your end game?  

[mdn82 25,510]

Here is your response...and as mentioned....you....responded to me.  I never referenced you, made mention of you, or replied to anything directly to you.  This is on you. :  What coaching style, both in tempo and offense/defense does Holtman run versus Thad Matta? You know he developed the Butler way right? Stevens was an assistant who adopted his playing style. Holtman and Archie both have ties to this system. When Holtman went to OSU he had a 5* Senior and other valuable pieces where he didn’t have to create a new culture. He stepped in and ran. Much like Archie would have done there. The culture was what Butler and Xavier had been the last 15 years. They just needed a new voice. We needed a new culture.  Here's mine to that :  

 

Well, that would be the easy way to look at it if you're into excuses.  (Stevens did a lot more than adopt a style; and Matta's last 2 seasons at OSU were NIT and a missed postseason, so it's not as though that was something just "in place and an easy transition.")

When did we hear when Archie was hired it would take a "total rebuild?"   You think that's what he told recruits?  OSU lost 41 PPG off last season's team in just Tate, Williams, and Diop.  And still sit 16-7 and beat Indiana on its home floor a season later.  

Yeah, it's the Brooks thread, so I'll stop; leaving it at "you and I see things a little differently."  I agree on the culture; but with a top 10 recruiting class added to what came back, I think expectations should have been higher than 13-11; especially after a 12-2 start.

To borrow your words, you can look it up for yourself from there, but all I did was tell you Stevens did more than that, which you turned into Stevens being a plug and play and made up a bunch of things you said you said....which you didn't.  You got defensive telling me you're not my kid....for some reason.  And you're getting on me for taking offense?  Who's the one referring to the other using words like "dense" or "idiotic?"  Who started with condescension?   That's on you, my man.  Smiling.  Must be a long winter up there in Huntington...  So what's your end game?  

Keep going. You haven’t wrote me being crappy yet. Keep writing dissertations until you find it. My next post was literally saying what you said. Lol this is honestly funny to me. Oh and who was looking for excuses? That was needed for the post right? My next post was literally saying that.

 

 

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[Old Friend 8,389]

2 minutes ago, mdn82 said:

Keep going. You haven’t wrote me being crappy yet. Keep writing dissertations until you find it. My next post was literally saying what you said. Lol this is honestly funny to me.

 

 

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Yeah, I get it.  Me too.  It must be nice to live in a world where accountability is putting numbers in the correct sequence.   Goodnight, Huntington.  I'm sure I'll awaken to more because of, you know, that last word thing.    

[mdn82 25,510]

Yeah, I get it.  Me too.  It must be nice to live in a world where accountability is putting numbers in the correct sequence.   Goodnight, Huntington.  I'm sure I'll awaken to more because of, you know, that last word thing.    

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[MikeRoberts 7,021]

Where is Chris and others on this? There is something significant here and for nobody to know is odd.

Has Archie lost the team? Has the team lost each other in that there is hate/distrust amongst them? Why are historically decent shooters no longer able to shoot when they put on an IU uniform? Why are quick and athletic players incapable and hesitant to run a fast break? Why is there little fire being shown by anyone? This has become a super boring and annoying team to watch and there is no reason for that; we have all-bigten players, McDonalds All-Americans, 4 star players all over the court and bench and we can barely crack the 50 point mark at home anymore. Wtf is going on? How has no one close to the program shed light on this?


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[mdn82 25,510]

Where is Chris and others on this? There is something significant here and for nobody to know is odd.

Has Archie lost the team? Has the team lost each other in that there is hate/distrust amongst them? Why are historically decent shooters no longer able to shoot when they put on an IU uniform? Why are quick and athletic players incapable and hesitant to run a fast break? Why is there little fire being shown by anyone? This has become a super boring and annoying team to watch and there is no reason for that; we have all-bigten players, McDonalds All-Americans, 4 star players all over the court and bench and we can barely crack the 50 point mark at home anymore. Wtf is going on? How has no one close to the program shed light on this?


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The games I have went to there is no continuity. Usually one person on the bench engaged in the game. These players just don’t care for one another. I honestly don’t know anymore, but I am certain about that.


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[MikeRoberts 7,021]

The games I have went to there is no continuity. Usually one person on the bench engaged in the game. These players just don’t care for one another. I honestly don’t know anymore, but I am certain about that.


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That could be it. I don’t want to act like I know this team but I got the impression they were mostly good guys so it is hard to imagine so much discord amongst them to turn an otherwise promising season into one of the biggest dumpster fires we have seen. Losing 9 of 10 is like Crean walk on years type stuff, it’s incredible


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[Rico 3,057]

Now I realize why I had been away from this site so long.  Thanks for reminding me fellas.

[ap2345 7,877]

Where is Chris and others on this? There is something significant here and for nobody to know is odd.

Has Archie lost the team? Has the team lost each other in that there is hate/distrust amongst them? Why are historically decent shooters no longer able to shoot when they put on an IU uniform? Why are quick and athletic players incapable and hesitant to run a fast break? Why is there little fire being shown by anyone? This has become a super boring and annoying team to watch and there is no reason for that; we have all-bigten players, McDonalds All-Americans, 4 star players all over the court and bench and we can barely crack the 50 point mark at home anymore. Wtf is going on? How has no one close to the program shed light on this?


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I do find it funny that none of the people with sources have really said much on this topic on any of the sites. That’s like the issue in the locker room after last game that nobody shared the details of they all just kept saying it wasn’t that big of an issue. Which I personally figured but I’d still like to know a little more about what is really going on.


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[Rico 3,057]

4 minutes ago, ap2345 said:

I do find it funny that none of the people with sources have really said much on this topic on any of the sites. That’s like the issue in the locker room after last game that nobody shared the details of they all just kept saying it wasn’t that big of an issue. Which I personally figured but I’d still like to know a little more about what is really going on.


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Honestly, I don't think anybody is willing to leak that info other than what they have said.  Why it was leaked to begin with is beyond me.  When the season comes to an end it will likely become more obvious.  Most of me thinks Smith is the issue here...but I ain't an "insider".

[HoosierCoop 3,927]

If you look at 2018 vs 2019, the ball was distributed much differently.

Now in 2019 when the slide hit, there are too many instances where the ball stopped moving and we settled for this so-called isolation offense.  Now, this could be because of the injuries we had to switch but who knows.

Langford (rarely passes), Smith (rarely passes), and Morgan (does not kick it out, but doesn't need to).

If any of these three aren't clicking, it's doom and gloom very quickly.

[Honkyman 1,670]

The team moves the ball much better with Davis at center, as was demonstrated in the Michigan State game. Davis should start at the 5 and Morgan at the 4.

[mdn82 25,510]

Now I realize why I had been away from this site so long.  Thanks for reminding me fellas.

No problem. I truly don’t remember you from 2015 when you signed up. It sucks. There have been some good discussions over that time. I actually don’t mind OF too much. I have been around him over 10 years pretty much daily. He isn’t harmful or a liar. We are both opinionated just see things differently. So it’s really not all that bad. It was really worse the year before Crean was fired board wide. Hopefully we don’t get to that point with Archie.

 

 

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[ElectricBoogaloo 4,307]

20 minutes ago, Honkyman said:

The team moves the ball much better with Davis at center, as was demonstrated in the Michigan State game. Davis should start at the 5 and Morgan at the 4.

Davis had 7 assists in one of the games last week. I agree - he should absolutely be the starting 5 and Morgan at the 4. I would love to see that. Morgan at the 4 creates actual spacing since Smith's defender gives him about 10 ft of open space on the perimeter.

[Old Friend 8,389]

9 hours ago, mdn82 said:

The games I have went to there is no continuity. Usually one person on the bench engaged in the game. These players just don’t care for one another. I honestly don’t know anymore, but I am certain about that.


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So I talked yesterday with someone very close to the team.  Won't name him, but he's on the bench or close every game.   Also spoke with a former player (walk on) who I trust...played for Crean.   Neither had any clue what to say.  Just that everyone's pointing fingers and not headed in the same direction.  One did say he knows Durham is bought in and loves the kid.  Also said Romeo is a little (and has been) disengaged.  I don't think there's an easy answer.   I'm not sure there IS an answer.  

My concern though is deeper than chemistry.   Something has changed since December; and I can't tell if teams have scouted us differently or what's happening, but we don't look like the same team.   I'd like to see more Davis, less Smith.  More Durham/Phinisee, less Green.  I'd like to see more transition.  I'd like to see Romeo with the ball in his hands 12-15 feet from the rim; not 22.  

[MikeRoberts 7,021]

So I talked yesterday with someone very close to the team.  Won't name him, but he's on the bench or close every game.   Also spoke with a former player (walk on) who I trust...played for Crean.   Neither had any clue what to say.  Just that everyone's pointing fingers and not headed in the same direction.  One did say he knows Durham is bought in and loves the kid.  Also said Romeo is a little (and has been) disengaged.  I don't think there's an easy answer.   I'm not sure there IS an answer.  
My concern though is deeper than chemistry.   Something has changed since December; and I can't tell if teams have scouted us differently or what's happening, but we don't look like the same team.   I'd like to see more Davis, less Smith.  More Durham/Phinisee, less Green.  I'd like to see more transition.  I'd like to see Romeo with the ball in his hands 12-15 feet from the rim; not 22.  

Those small adjustments would help. If I’m Archie I am telling Phinisee and Durham to take over and lead. They could be our guys for the next couple of years.


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[Old Friend 8,389]

2 minutes ago, MikeRoberts said:

Those small adjustments would help. If I’m Archie I am telling Phinisee and Durham to take over and lead. They could be our guys for the next couple of years.


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Absolutely

[JSHoosier 20,264]

Yeah, something seems to be off with this team lately.  Just don't look the same, the ball doesn't seem to move as much for one thing and more side to side.  Phinisee isn't playing nearly as well post concussion either.

This team visibly looks worse than last season with players that should be better.

[Rico 3,057]

1 hour ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Davis had 7 assists in one of the games last week. I agree - he should absolutely be the starting 5 and Morgan at the 4. I would love to see that. Morgan at the 4 creates actual spacing since Smith's defender gives him about 10 ft of open space on the perimeter.

Davis has absolute great court vision.  To me it is a no brainer to start him at the 5 and Juwan at the 4.  What to do with Smith is the question.

[HoosierAloha 30,068]

Those small adjustments would help. If I’m Archie I am telling Phinisee and Durham to take over and lead. They could be our guys for the next couple of years.


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Completely agree, if they step up to lead the team we have a chance at being better next season. I’d add that Davis could be that third leader or “enforcer” type of guy if he jumped on with Phin and Al.


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