Injury Updates

[iuhoosierfan90 30]

I'm assuming that all NCAA programs are following something close to this with their concussion protocol and return to play.

 

https://www.playsmartplaysafe.com/focus-on-safety/protecting-players/nfl-return-to-participation-protocol/

 

Not all trainers at the HS, club sport level etc have been trained in concussion protocol.  Whomever referenced a player who took a hit to the head and then returned to play that same game is just uneducated.  Not all concussion symptoms show up immediately.  I know people who had a blow to the head, passed all of the neurological tests on the field given by a certified trainer, and  were cleared to return to play.  Then showed signs of a concussion the next morning.  Their return to play time was increased significantly by them returning to play that game.  

 

The issues with concussion protocol is that the athlete needs to be honest about minor symptoms.  Major symptoms like sensitivity to noise and light are difficult to hide as are major headaches.  Brain fogginess, slight headaches, tiredness, etc are easy to hide especially if an athlete is bound and determined to return to play as quickly as possible (which I would imagine is 99% of all Division 1 athletes)

 

Let the doctors and trainers do their jobs without second guessing them or complaining about how "cautious" IU's medical staff is.  

Here's some info from the Mayo Clinic website regarding concussions and that delayed symptoms are not uncommon.  

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/concussion/symptoms-causes/syc-20355594

[Str8Hoosiers 2,965]

5 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

So you literally have nothing but antecdotal evidence and yet strongly suspect Rob is just fine. 

Yep that is exactly the case. No point in discussing any further. Your opinion is what it is and so is mine. And neither of us is going to change the other....

Have you examined the players and their brains? What makes you the expert? Oh wait you are just going off others evidence... it is easy to  pick and choose who to believe to support your side, there is plenty of research on both sides but as long as you only introduce the stuff that supports your opinion then it is right.

[Chips&Dipo 1,464]

2 minutes ago, Str8Hoosiers said:

Yep that is exactly the case. No point in discussing any further. Your opinion is what it is and so is mine. And neither of us is going to change the other....

Have you examined the players and their brains? What makes you the expert? Oh wait you are just going off others evidence... it is easy to  pick and choose who to believe to support your side, there is plenty of research on both sides but as long as you only introduce the stuff that supports your opinion then it is right.

His evidence is what IU is doing per the team doctors. Yours is just your armchair opinion.

Just because one side has good sources and the other has bad sources doesn't mean that someone is being one sided.

[iuhoosierfan90 30]

13 minutes ago, Str8Hoosiers said:

I have seen MANY cases of somebody being diagnosed with a concussion and then later told the diagnosis was wrong and they NEVER actually had a concussion. I have heard stories from others on the testing procedures and how it is not a true baseline (see others posts above as additional examples).

I personally am NOT qualified to make any diagnosis and I am not making a diagnosis. i am saying the ones that are could be wrong. And even the medical Professionals and experts don't agree on the subject at all. Once you put the strict protocols in place that IU has apparently done then it no longer matters what a doctor says... the protocols overwrite the doctors opinions or diagnosis.

Concussions are primarily diagnosed by symptoms.  If someone was diagnosed with a concussion there MUST have been a symptom there.  Maybe it was a very mild concussion and the symptoms disappeared by the next morning. Just because the symptoms went away quickly that doesn't mean they weren't concussed.  

There is ZERO way to determine you didn't have a concussion post injury.  I find it very hard to believe that medical personnel saw symptoms, diagnosed a concussion then later changed their diagnosis.  That just doesn't add up!

 

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,294]

I know I’m a hard headed (dumb) athlete but I’d have to have super severe migraines, photosensitivity, or memory loss to keep me from playing the next possible game.

 

I was indeed knocked unconscious in a hockey game and played the rest of that game and the following games. No major symptoms.

 

But I am built that way. Dumb and strong.

 

 

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[Str8Hoosiers 2,965]

3 minutes ago, iuhoosierfan90 said:

Concussions are primarily diagnosed by symptoms.  If someone was diagnosed with a concussion there MUST have been a symptom there.  Maybe it was a very mild concussion and the symptoms disappeared by the next morning. Just because the symptoms went away quickly that doesn't mean they weren't concussed.  

There is ZERO way to determine you didn't have a concussion post injury.  I find it very hard to believe that medical personnel saw symptoms, diagnosed a concussion then later changed their diagnosis.  That just doesn't add up!

 

If you get hit in the head there is a good chance it will hurt, you may see blurry, you may have a headache.... that doesn't mean it is a concussion. Of course there are symptoms after taking a shot to the head... that is my point... just because it hurts doesn't mean it is a long term thing. And then when doing more test everything shows up fine... so could it be a concussion that immediately healed? possible... or could the original diagnosis of a concussion have been wrong? Again possible... 

The protocol and the test are exactly that. Trying to determine if you did or did not have a concussion post injury.

If there is ZERO way to determine you didn't have a concussion post injury then everybody DOES have a concussion everytime they are tested.

[WayneFleekHoosier 48,294]

I know I’m a hard headed (dumb) athlete but I’d have to have super severe migraines, photosensitivity, or memory loss to keep me from playing the next possible game.
 
I was indeed knocked unconscious in a hockey game and played the rest of that game and the following games. No major symptoms.
 
But I am built that way. Dumb and strong.
 
 
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This being said, I will never ever doubt someone following doctors orders and trying to do what is right for themselves.

I am a gambler with my health probably. But to me the body is incredibly resilient and I think it takes a plethora of head trauma to produce this CTE stuff and I don’t think the odds of head trauma in basketball is very high. I’d take my chances unless my performance was bad enough to hurt my team.


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[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,210]

I haven't seen a single person on here say that they care more about winning games than the players' well-being, or even say anything that would imply that. 

So is that why a poster directly above this post, say we needed Rob bad? To me that implies winning is more important. While I agree we have a better chance with Rob, if the staff is cautious i have no problems.

 

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[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,210]

This is the problem... the testing...
The baseline. The protocol... 
You say he was clear tested and has 1, but by everything I have seen he clearly doesn't have 1... but because some test or some baseline in some test that isn't perfected says so then he is out.

Links to what you've seen?

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[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,210]

The amount of neurological experts on here is amazing. When it comes to the health of a young man, I will go with the experts.

Well they did all stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

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[woodenshoemanHoosierfan 6,210]

It could be that IU decided to be overly cautious because of the player safety issues we had under Coach Wilson. Heck, maybe we're not actually being overly cautious, other schools and pro leagues might not be cautious enough, making it look like we're overly cautious when we're doing what we're supposed to do. I really don't know. Whatever the reality is, I just hope Rob can get healthy and cleared soon. 

This is entirely possible. If so, erring on the side of a players future costs us a game or 2, so be it. It is after all, just a game that doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things.

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[Hoosierfan2017 21,299]

35 minutes ago, woodenshoemanHoosierfan said:

So is that why a poster directly above this post, say we needed Rob bad? To me that implies winning is more important. While I agree we have a better chance with Rob, if the staff is cautious i have no problems.

 

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I don't know their intent, but after the game Green had last night, someone saying we need Rob bad is just a statement of fact to me. 

[JSHoosier 20,158]

41 minutes ago, woodenshoemanHoosierfan said:

So is that why a poster directly above this post, say we needed Rob bad? To me that implies winning is more important. While I agree we have a better chance with Rob, if the staff is cautious i have no problems.

 

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I texted someone during the game that we need Phinisee back bad.  That's not saying his health is less is important, it's just a statement of fact.

[Walking Boot of Doom 18,170]

Guys, Tim Garl’s got this. You don’t think Archie and Co want Phin back? Relax, no one here actually knows what they’re talking about. Rob’s head might have hit much harder than we thought.

 

 

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[Bailey7878 2,506]

I have heard people say this before. Do you actually believe this will happen?
There is no chance, there is always somebody willing to take the risks.... there are a lot of people in really bad situations and the only way out is through sports... ANYTHING literally ANY RISK is worth the reward of being able to get out of those type of situations.

Yes i believe it with famalies in suburbs, etc. You will have 1/4 of the kids you have in youth sports now.

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[Str8Hoosiers 2,965]

1 minute ago, Bailey7878 said:

Yes i believe it with famalies in suburbs, etc. You will have 1/4 of the kids you have in youth sports now.

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I 100% agree that participation in youth sports is and will continue to decline through a myriad of factors.

However I do believe that there are still more than enough that decide the risk is worth the reward and overall we will not see a change in high level athletics. There will still be an NFL, NHL, NBA, NCAA etc.... And as long as there are enough people willing to take that risk those organizations aren't going to make sweeping changes that effect their own bottom line negatively.

[Hutch89 2,939]

Archie's post game comments about Rob: 
 

Based on Miller’s postgame comments, it sounds like the earliest Phinisee could return is next Friday at Maryland.

“I doubt he plays at Michigan. I would take that off the table,” Miller said. “Today (Thursday) was the first day that Rob smiled in a long time, so I know he’s feeling better. He’s been doing cardio work. He’s been doing some shooting. That’s about it. And as he doesn’t have any be problems or setbacks, they keep letting him do more.

“But today was the first time — at shoot around today was the first time I saw him where he was smiling. He had a really good way about him. So I think that’s probably the first step in understanding he’s feeling better.”

[coonhounds 8,900]

This thread is verified proof we will argue about anything

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[Bailey7878 2,506]

I 100% agree that participation in youth sports is and will continue to decline through a myriad of factors.
However I do believe that there are still more than enough that decide the risk is worth the reward and overall we will not see a change in high level athletics. There will still be an NFL, NHL, NBA, NCAA etc.... And as long as there are enough people willing to take that risk those organizations aren't going to make sweeping changes that effect their own bottom line negatively.

Lower income families sure but not ones well off.

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[WayneFleekHoosier 48,294]

Archie's post game comments about Rob: 
 

Based on Miller’s postgame comments, it sounds like the earliest Phinisee could return is next Friday at Maryland.

“I doubt he plays at Michigan. I would take that off the table,” Miller said. “Today (Thursday) was the first day that Rob smiled in a long time, so I know he’s feeling better. He’s been doing cardio work. He’s been doing some shooting. That’s about it. And as he doesn’t have any be problems or setbacks, they keep letting him do more.

“But today was the first time — at shoot around today was the first time I saw him where he was smiling. He had a really good way about him. So I think that’s probably the first step in understanding he’s feeling better.”

As the captain of the “read into things too much police”, Rob did seem distant looking on the bench when they would zoom in on him. Like he was distracted or thinking about other things.

I know I know.




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