Liam decomitting

[Home Jersey 5,460]

3 minutes ago, KathywithaC said:

What question were you asking that I didn’t answer?

The one referenced here: 

 

[KathywithaC 286]

On 3/9/2024 at 10:38 AM, TadQueasy said:

Maybe I have missed somethings, and that is very possible.  But it seems some of you are pretty harsh on our new poster KathyC.  I have no idea if she is someone important or not, but she has seemed to carry herself fairly well here and try to be as open and honest as she can be.  

I’ve tried to patiently explain the “how” of the decision making process, along with the “why” to the extent that I know it to be. Difficult for some, especially people who don’t have much time around IU beyond their time as a student, to be able to understand those things, which I get. 

[DoctorP 837]

6 minutes ago, KathywithaC said:

I’ve tried to patiently explain the “how” of the decision making process, along with the “why” to the extent that I know it to be. Difficult for some, especially people who don’t have much time around IU beyond their time as a student, to be able to understand those things, which I get. 

Ban

[8bucks 6,208]

4 minutes ago, KathywithaC said:

I’ve tried to patiently explain the “how” of the decision making process, along with the “why” to the extent that I know it to be. Difficult for some, especially people who don’t have much time around IU beyond their time as a student, to be able to understand those things, which I get. 

You mentioned that the decision making at IU is a time honored tradition. Do those decision makers think that process has been successful?  I know at one point post RMK they wanted de-emphasize basketball or at least avoid having a larger than life coach. Wondering if trading wins for that has been considered ok by them. 

[Golfman25 4,831]

35 minutes ago, KathywithaC said:

I’ve tried to patiently explain the “how” of the decision making process, along with the “why” to the extent that I know it to be. Difficult for some, especially people who don’t have much time around IU beyond their time as a student, to be able to understand those things, which I get. 

But all you really said it was based on consensus but the BOT didn’t have the final say.  Which seems to say Dolson can make the decision without interference from the BOT.  Which doesn’t appear to be the case at all.  

[KathywithaC 286]

30 minutes ago, 8bucks said:

You mentioned that the decision making at IU is a time honored tradition. Do those decision makers think that process has been successful?  I know at one point post RMK they wanted de-emphasize basketball or at least avoid having a larger than life coach. Wondering if trading wins for that has been considered ok by them. 

I think it’s successful from the standpoint of those involved, though it frustrates plenty of people outside of the bubble. I don’t think they ever wanted to de-emphasize basketball, but they never wanted to feel like the coach wasn’t answerable or accountable to anyone. Even some of RMKs staunchest defenders became concerned about that toward the end of his tenure.

[KathywithaC 286]

4 minutes ago, Golfman25 said:

But all you really said it was based on consensus but the BOT didn’t have the final say.  Which seems to say Dolson can make the decision without interference from the BOT.  Which doesn’t appear to be the case at all.  

The BOT doesn’t have the final say, but they definitely have input, with some having more than others, for obvious reasons. I understand that people want this to be an either / or situation, but it really isn’t and never has been. Even Bill Orwig and Ralph Floyd got plenty of input from others and made decisions based on a consensus of views. 

[Golfman25 4,831]

1 minute ago, KathywithaC said:

The BOT doesn’t have the final say, but they definitely have input, with some having more than others, for obvious reasons. I understand that people want this to be an either / or situation, but it really isn’t and never has been. Even Bill Orwig and Ralph Floyd got plenty of input from others and made decisions based on a consensus of views. 

Then who, one person, has the final say?  Input is fine and dandy.  But if it’s bad input, the AD should be able to disregard and make the decision, no?  

[KathywithaC 286]

7 minutes ago, Golfman25 said:

Then who, one person, has the final say?  Input is fine and dandy.  But if it’s bad input, the AD should be able to disregard and make the decision, no?  

If it’s bad input, does it matter who gave it? Prior to our current situation, bad input produced Mike Davis, Kelvin Sampson, Tom Crean, Archie Miller, Gerry DiNardo, Bill Lynch, Kevin Wilson and Tom Allen. Some of that input came from Trustees, some came from members of search committees, some came from search firms, some came from IU Presidents, and some came from IU ADs. If people either don’t know what they’re evaluating or can’t see issues that are likely to occur down the road, bad results are likely to happen. I get that people think one person can do this, but it’s rarely that straightforward. I realize that’s frustrating but it’s almost never the reason why things haven’t gone well, and it has made fixing some things easier.

[MikeRoberts 6,858]

4 minutes ago, KathywithaC said:

If it’s bad input, does it matter who gave it? Prior to our current situation, bad input produced Mike Davis, Kelvin Sampson, Tom Crean, Archie Miller, Gerry DiNardo, Bill Lynch, Kevin Wilson and Tom Allen. Some of that input came from Trustees, some came from members of search committees, some came from search firms, some came from IU Presidents, and some came from IU ADs. If people either don’t know what they’re evaluating or can’t see issues that are likely to occur down the road, bad results are likely to happen. I get that people think one person can do this, but it’s rarely that straightforward. I realize that’s frustrating but it’s almost never the reason why things haven’t gone well, and it has made fixing some things easier.

You didn’t answer the question. Who has final say?

Unless there is a voting system, 1 individual has the ability to make the final call

[JF87 1,413]

Three-point shots are good basketball

[JSHoosier 19,663]

Bad input produced Mike Woodson and there's a refusal to fix it.

[KathywithaC 286]

1 minute ago, MikeRoberts said:

You didn’t answer the question. Who has final say?

Unless there is a voting system, 1 individual has the ability to make the final call

I’ve repeatedly said this is a group effort. Rarely is there much disagreement, and there isn’t with Woody. I guess I’m surprised that people are so surprised. The AD reports to the President, by the way.

[HoosierTrav 7,624]

17 minutes ago, KathywithaC said:

The BOT doesn’t have the final say, but they definitely have input, with some having more than others, for obvious reasons. I understand that people want this to be an either / or situation, but it really isn’t and never has been. Even Bill Orwig and Ralph Floyd got plenty of input from others and made decisions based on a consensus of views. 

This is all we need to see to confirm that the basketball program will never reach elite status again. There’s too much bureaucratic nonsense. Constantly making head scratching decisions. Why Indiana has been nationally irrelevant for decades and will continue to be. You can come in here and run cover for Buckner, Dolson, and the administration but the proof is in the results of their decisions. If they’ve truly been trying to build a winning program, then they are awful at their jobs. It’s an embarrassment. 

[KathywithaC 286]

3 minutes ago, JSHoosier said:

Bad input produced Mike Woodson and there's a refusal to fix it.

Not everyone in positions of authority believe it needs to be fixed. Well if that changes. By the way, unless there’s a scandal related to rules or other personal conduct, it would be rare to have any decision rendered during the season. Only three scenarios have happened in the last 20 years where it was strongly considered and it occurred in two of those three situations.

[KathywithaC 286]

1 minute ago, HoosierTrav said:

This is all we need to see to confirm that the basketball program will never reach elite status again. There’s too much bureaucratic nonsense. Constantly making head scratching decisions. Why Indiana has been nationally irrelevant for decades and will continue to be. You can come in here and run cover for Buckner, Dolson, and the administration but the proof is in the results of their decisions. If they’ve truly been trying to build a winning program, then they are awful at their jobs. It’s an embarrassment. 

Not running cover for anyone but I don’t disagree with your notion that it is a great inhibitor to success. Why do you think RMK wanted total control of the basketball program, which he had for some time?

[JSHoosier 19,663]

4 minutes ago, KathywithaC said:

Not everyone in positions of authority believe it needs to be fixed. Well if that changes. By the way, unless there’s a scandal related to rules or other personal conduct, it would be rare to have any decision rendered during the season. Only three scenarios have happened in the last 20 years where it was strongly considered and it occurred in two of those three situations.

There needs to be a rebuild because of how badly Woodson has mishandled it, he didn't step into a needed rebuild he created it. Sorry, if someone doesn't think that needs fixed they shouldn't be involved in the decision making. 

He was a great college player over 40 years ago, but cannot manage a program. You damage a program by keeping bad coaches too long.

I never said he had to be fired during the season. They announced he's coming back, unless it was BS then they rendered a decision during without scandal.

[Golfman25 4,831]

17 minutes ago, KathywithaC said:

If it’s bad input, does it matter who gave it? Prior to our current situation, bad input produced Mike Davis, Kelvin Sampson, Tom Crean, Archie Miller, Gerry DiNardo, Bill Lynch, Kevin Wilson and Tom Allen. Some of that input came from Trustees, some came from members of search committees, some came from search firms, some came from IU Presidents, and some came from IU ADs. If people either don’t know what they’re evaluating or can’t see issues that are likely to occur down the road, bad results are likely to happen. I get that people think one person can do this, but it’s rarely that straightforward. I realize that’s frustrating but it’s almost never the reason why things haven’t gone well, and it has made fixing some things easier.

It’s such a non-answer answer.  I get it. When I make decisions for my company I get input.  But at the end of the day I can accept or reject that input and the final decision is mine and mine alone.  
 

Is it not the AD’s job to filter that input and make the best decision?  So he should recognize that bad input, discard it, and hire the right guy   

 

[KathywithaC 286]

7 minutes ago, JSHoosier said:

There needs to be a rebuild because of how badly Woodson has mishandled it, he didn't step into a needed rebuild he created it. Sorry, if someone doesn't think that needs fixed they shouldn't be involved in the decision making. 

He was a great college player over 40 years ago, but cannot manage a program. You damage a program by keeping bad coaches too long.

 

5 minutes ago, Golfman25 said:

It’s such a non-answer answer.  I get it. When I make decisions for my company I get input.  But at the end of the day I can accept or reject that input and the final decision is mine and mine alone.  
 

Is it not the AD’s job to filter that input and make the best decision?  So he should recognize that bad input, discard it, and hire the right guy   

 

That’s the difference between your company and a University. You have the authority to make decisions for your sales group or the guys who work in your department, and that’s typical. IU has always done things a little differently. I get the frustration, but it’s a process that’s helped come to the right decision, too. 

Edited March 10 by KathywithaC

[HoosierTrav 7,624]

Just now, KathywithaC said:

Not running cover for anyone but I don’t disagree with your notion that it is a great inhibitor to success. Why do you think RMK wanted total control of the basketball program, which he had for some time?

It’s the only recipe for success. Identify and hire a high level guy and stay out of his way. Other winning programs seem to do this. IU refusing just lends credence to when Knight said the university wanted to de-emphasize basketball. And if that’s the case, there should be some transparency with the fanbase (paying customers).