Fire Coach Woodson Thread

[kottke 766]

9 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

12.6 million I believe

Seems like our only hope is he "retires," maybe with some sore of negotiated buyout instead. $12 million seems steep after just paying, what, $10 million for Archie's just a few years ago? However, I don't know a damn thing so maybe (hopefully) I'm wrong. I'm also not sure they'd fire a loved former player either, after technically just one down year (even though it''s REALLY down).

Edit: sorry, I just saw where others pretty much said this already.

[JF87 1,437]

11 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

That's not true.

NBA Assistants make as little as low six figures, up to over $1 million annually. Looks like the average is $250-300k, and the top dog makes about $2 million/per.

My bad.  The first article that I Googled and Glass Door showed the lower salary.  I've now found other articles that show the average being around 250K.  

[Chris007 43,890]

11 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Jesus. Just pay that and let's move on. We saved 3 million by Archie being hired at Rhode Island. 

I think we could do it for half that. I know the department doesn't want to pay it since it just paid out Allen's. From what I'm hearing were still going to stand pat and not do anything. But there is still 7 games left. 

[Chris007 43,890]

16 minutes ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Why would we want Woodson in an advisor role? Not sure I’d want him advising on 2024 basketball given what he’s shown over the past 3 years. 

He's not walking away, so what the poster was doing was trying to find some middle ground. IU doesn't want to pay 12 million. We're trying to find some solutions instead of just doing nothing

[Certified Sunshine Pumper 9,072]

5 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

I think we could do it for half that. I know the department doesn't want to pay it since it just paid out Allen's. From what I'm hearing were still going to stand pat and not do anything. But there is still 7 games left. 

If they could negotiate to like 8 million... IU should make that work. 

[Hornsby 1,763]

He has already lost the fans. Nearly impossible to come back from that, especially at 66 years old. 
My fear is Dolson knows he isn't the guy but won't pull the trigger after three years, so waits for a fourth. Next year is more of the same and they let him go.
By then IU has missed out on their top two realistic candidates in May and Schertz who have taken other jobs, and the '25 class of Mullins, Sisley, and Robinson (among others) have all decided to play for the other state schools knowing that IU stinks. Yippee

And sets us back another year. We pay dearly for the God awful hiring decisions that are made. Purdue was just laughing at us the other night. Unreal.

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[hper50 1,196]

My P*rdue buddies are cheering for us the rest of the way in hopes of us retaining Woody. State of the program.

[Certified Sunshine Pumper 9,072]

I find it a joke we can't pay a 13 million-dollar buyout. 

IU is worth 3.5 billion

[Hoosierfan2017 21,229]

19 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

He's not walking away, so what the poster was doing was trying to find some middle ground. IU doesn't want to pay 12 million. We're trying to find some solutions instead of just doing nothing

Solutions have to actually make sense to be solutions. This is just “hey we can still be friends” after a breakup. It’s awkward for everybody. What’s the sell to the next coach? Hey by the way, the crappy coach we just fired is going to be your advisor, he’s got a direct line to you whenever he wants. 

Plus, Woody doesn’t really put effort into doing the job he already has. Seems unlikely he’ll take a $6 million haircut in exchange for another job/role. Just use some of that “most profitable athletic program” money and fire him. 

[IUc2016 7,121]

12 minutes ago, btownqb said:

I find it a joke we can't pay a 13 million-dollar buyout. 

IU is worth 3.5 billion

But hey lets pat ourselves on the back for being the top three in most profitable athletic departments. Why are we profitable again? it's not a for profit entity. SPEND IT ALL

[Hornsby 1,763]

I find it a joke we can't pay a 13 million-dollar buyout. 
IU is worth 3.5 billion

I find it a joke we set up a guy to get a 13 million dollar buyout that nobody else wanted. I guess it was the quinn buddy sweetheart contract.

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[Henryville Hoosier 972]

I wonder how much does Dolson makes as AD?

[Stuhoo 80,463]

I've posted this before, multiple times: 

The 'real' cost of the buyout would not be $12.6 million after this year.

• The buyout regresses considerably immediately after next year; to $4.2 million (50% of the remaining $8.4 m). Woody is well-aware of this.
  • Because of this, if he feels like he is done, he would agree to $6-8 million after this year. Because when the reduced buyout is factored in? He would be coaching next year for effectively nothing if he got an $8 million buyout now.

• That larger buyout figure is based on an extended payment of the total. If Woody were to get the entire amount up front? He would very likely agree to a reduced number. See: Allen, Tom.

• IU will take that reduced number and finance it over many years.
  • Say the final buyout cost is $6.75 million.
  • Now add the $1.25 million it would take to buyout Dusty May, for a total of $8 million,
  • Finance it over 20 years for a principal + interest total of about $12 million.
  • That would equal $600,000 annually for 20 years.
  • Now pay Dusty $3.6 million a year.
• Guess what? We just got Dusty May starting next year for the same annual as we are paying Mike Woodson. 

So back to my previous posts; I am still on record that IF this season ends kinda badly, I'd bet it's more likely May is the coach than Woodson come June, 2024.

[Hoosierfan2017 21,229]

5 minutes ago, Henryville Hoosier said:

I wonder how much does Dolson makes as AD?

$538k in 2021. Not bad for a guy whose top 2 programs either (a) won zero conference games  or (b) got steamrolled in the round of 64 that year.

[HoosierMatty 457]

The question is does Dolson already believe Mike isn't the guy? If he keeps him it's only to save money. To be honest with Mike gone I'm concerned who they pick next.

The only coach I see them going after is Dusty May. That's just because he's the low hanging fruit. If he doesn't work out then things get even worse.

This administration never ceases to amaze with their incompetence. For the past 30 years with all the built in advantages we've had they have found ways to screw things up.

You have to try to fail this bad.

 

 

[Chris007 43,890]

1 minute ago, HoosierMatty said:

The question is does Dolson already believe Mike isn't the guy? If he keeps him it's only to save money. To be honest with Mike gone I'm concerned who they pick next.

The only coach I see them going after is Dusty May. That's just because he's the low hanging fruit. If he doesn't work out then things get even worse.

This administration never ceases to amaze with their incompetence. For the past 30 years with all the built in advantages we've had they have found ways to screw things up.

You have to try to fail this bad.

 

 

I think one former basketball manager would love to hire another former basketball manager as the next coach. It's just getting everyone else on board. 

[Certified Sunshine Pumper 9,072]

17 minutes ago, Stuhoo said:

I've posted this before, multiple times. The 'real' cost of the buyout would not be $12.6 million after this year.

• The buyout regresses considerably immediately after next year; to $4.2 million (50% of the remaining $8.4 m). Woody is well-aware of this.
  • Because of this, if he feels like he is done, he would agree to $6-8 million after this year. Because when the reduced buyout is factored in? He would be coaching next year for effectively nothing if he got an $8 million buyout now.

• That larger buyout figure is based on an extended payment of the total. If Woody were to get the entire amount up front? He would very likely agree to a reduced number. See: Allen, Tom.

• IU will take that reduced number and finance it over many years.
  • Say the final buyout cost is $6.75 million.
  • Now add the $1.25 million it would take to buyout Dusty May, for a total of $8 million,
  • Finance it over 20 years for a principal + interest total of about $12 million.
  • That would equal $600,000 annually for 20 years.
  • Now pay Dusty $3.6 million a year.
• Guess what? We just got Dusty May starting next year for the same annual as we are paying Mike Woodson. 

So back to my previous posts; I am still on record that if this season ends kinda badly, I'd bet it's more likely May is the coach than Woodson come June, 2024.

Sort of what I assumed, the money isn't a real factor here. 

[realTomCrean 1,518]

1 hour ago, Hoosierfan2017 said:

Why would we want Woodson in an advisor role? Not sure I’d want him advising on 2024 basketball given what he’s shown over the past 3 years. 

Why? Because Woodson, believe it or not, knows more about Indiana basketball than anyone else collectively on this site and is in the 99% percentile in all of humanity in knowing the inner workings of IUBB. Relations with former players, boosters, knows methods to increase revenue for NIL, and as a program am I alone in wishing a coach would leave in good graces w/ the masses? He has been great at development, recruitment, and sending PF/C to NBA - while he may be lackluster as a coach when considering every aspect, he still knows things other simply do not. Hell, he may have relations with a family/coach/program that can end up offering us a great piece to a future team - that is not out of the realm of possibilities. 

In the military during Change of Command, there is what we call "Left seat, Right Seat" meaning the new Commander/Senior Enlisted personnel will spend a sizable amount of time with their replacement to ensure that everyday workings are covered and there will not be a drop off for the unit. I believe and have seen in CBB that the same approach proves to be beneficial. In fact, if Knight had not been fired, I find it hard to believe IU would've fell off to this extent. 

Lastly, Woodson has taken us to 2x tourneys after a half-decade dry spell. He was an All-American at IU and I believe he also owns a few businesses in Bloomington/Indy. Call it a respect thing, "thank you for your service". I also think it would be best for the program in more ways than one to have him "advise" while maintaining a few benefits as an ode to his contributions to the IU program. You can teach a lot of things, but experience and respect of service are not one of them. 

Now, this is just my 2c so attack at will - but it will fall upon deaf ears. 

[go iu bb 5,829]

1 hour ago, JF87 said:

My bad.  The first article that I Googled and Glass Door showed the lower salary.  I've now found other articles that show the average being around 250K.  

Some teams have tons of assistant coaches that aren't on the bench for games. Those are probably the salaries for those kind of positions.

[HoosierMatty 457]

1 minute ago, Chris007 said:

I think one former basketball manager would love to hire another former basketball manager as the next coach. It's just getting everyone else on board. 

I would support May's hiring. But l want a thoughtful and through hiring process where all candidates are considered. 

If Dusty gets the job it better be because he's the best candidate with the best vision. Not because he's the only one who won't say no.

For too long IU just doesn't seem to get this right. Bad timing, or parts of administration getting involved when it's the AD's job to hire someone.