IUBB @ Penn State - Wednesday, 1/11/23 @ 7:00 on BTN

[IUCrazy2 2,980]

11 hours ago, Chris007 said:

Injuries are a part of the game but would love to hear how many other teams have lost two starters and have had to start 6 different starting lineups because of injuries. 

On one hand I agree and that is completely fair.  Then again on the other hand, we have literally had some "event" (excuse, factual reality that could be used to blame or explain poor play, or whatever you want to call it) for the better part of 2 decades now.  You can start about the time "Help is on the way" was uttered and basically go from there.

It isn't like we have dog meat sitting on the bench IF the players and staff are doing their jobs.  Yes, we lost X but we still have JHS and Bates.  Those guys are young but they came in very highly touted.  Race did go down but we have a junior in Geronimo and another really highly rated big in Reneau as back ups.  TJD isn't himself but he is still capable of putting up respectable numbers.

I just think this program has a real tendency to have a woe is me attitude about things.  It has been around for awhile.  "Somebody got hurt, what can we do now?"  It is this idea that play seems to be dictated by outside forces as opposed to internal drive.  "These guys work hard."  Great.  They move around and run around and physically practice hard.  Are they learning though?  Are they being taught properly?  Effort in sports is about more than physical things.  It is learning your sets and defensive assignments.  These players are the most coddled and taken care of players at Indiana University ever.  

I don't care about the excuses.  We all know what happened to Race and X.  So what are these other very highly rated guys going to do to keep winning games?  That is literally what they are getting paid for now.

[CSP 12,163]

5 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

On one hand I agree and that is completely fair.  Then again on the other hand, we have literally had some "event" (excuse, factual reality that could be used to blame or explain poor play, or whatever you want to call it) for the better part of 2 decades now.  You can start about the time "Help is on the way" was uttered and basically go from there.

It isn't like we have dog meat sitting on the bench IF the players and staff are doing their jobs.  Yes, we lost X but we still have JHS and Bates.  Those guys are young but they came in very highly touted.  Race did go down but we have a junior in Geronimo and another really highly rated big in Reneau as back ups.  TJD isn't himself but he is still capable of putting up respectable numbers.

I just think this program has a real tendency to have a woe is me attitude about things.  It has been around for awhile.  "Somebody got hurt, what can we do now?"  It is this idea that play seems to be dictated by outside forces as opposed to internal drive.  "These guys work hard."  Great.  They move around and run around and physically practice hard.  Are they learning though?  Are they being taught properly?  Effort in sports is about more than physical things.  It is learning your sets and defensive assignments.  These players are the most coddled and taken care of players at Indiana University ever.  

I don't care about the excuses.  We all know what happened to Race and X.  So what are these other very highly rated guys going to do to keep winning games?  That is literally what they are getting paid for now.

That isn't even close to enough ball handling/whatever else is needed on the perimeter, not even close. We aren't better than NW when we are down X and Race. Our roster makeup needs to improve more than anything. 

And their "rating" is truly irrelevant once they hit campus... if it ever mattered at all. 

[Chris007 62,614]

6 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

On one hand I agree and that is completely fair.  Then again on the other hand, we have literally had some "event" (excuse, factual reality that could be used to blame or explain poor play, or whatever you want to call it) for the better part of 2 decades now.  You can start about the time "Help is on the way" was uttered and basically go from there.

It isn't like we have dog meat sitting on the bench IF the players and staff are doing their jobs.  Yes, we lost X but we still have JHS and Bates.  Those guys are young but they came in very highly touted.  Race did go down but we have a junior in Geronimo and another really highly rated big in Reneau as back ups.  TJD isn't himself but he is still capable of putting up respectable numbers.

I just think this program has a real tendency to have a woe is me attitude about things.  It has been around for awhile.  "Somebody got hurt, what can we do now?"  It is this idea that play seems to be dictated by outside forces as opposed to internal drive.  "These guys work hard."  Great.  They move around and run around and physically practice hard.  Are they learning though?  Are they being taught properly?  Effort in sports is about more than physical things.  It is learning your sets and defensive assignments.  These players are the most coddled and taken care of players at Indiana University ever.  

I don't care about the excuses.  We all know what happened to Race and X.  So what are these other very highly rated guys going to do to keep winning games?  That is literally what they are getting paid for now.

I understand what your saying and you're not wrong but as fans, I think we want results immediately. Race got hurt late Thursday night, the team flew back from Iowa got in around 2 am, had classes Friday, learn the scouting report for NW and practice for two days and then play another game. Some will say I'm making excuses for these kids but I see it every day with 18-22-year-olds. Males that age are just not that mature to handle things very well. So hopefully everyone knows where they stand now for the next month and we start playing better. 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 9,314]

6 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

I understand what your saying and you're not wrong but as fans, I think we want results immediately. Race got hurt late Thursday night, the team flew back from Iowa got in around 2 am, had classes Friday, learn the scouting report for NW and practice for two days and then play another game. Some will say I'm making excuses for these kids but I see it every day with 18-22-year-olds. Males that age are just not that mature to handle things very well. So hopefully everyone knows where they stand now for the next month and we start playing better. 

What's the scouting report going to matter if the players don't care to follow it?

[Chris007 62,614]

2 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

What's the scouting report going to matter if the players don't care to follow it?

Maybe the short turnaround, the shock of one of their best friends getting hurt, and losing another starter kept them from learning the scouting report. Or they were just lazy and didn't care, or their not mature enough to handle this, I don't know what the reason was but I do know that the coaches don't just stop making a scouting report because it wasn't followed one game. 

[HoosierAloha 30,102]

37 minutes ago, BGleas said:

Pickett scares me. He can completely control a game and with Race out and JG being basically unplayable, we have nobody that matches up well with him. 

This is the matchup that worries me too. He slots right in between our defenders. JG would be the ideal candidate to guard him if he was defending at a high level. Unfortunately, I feel we're going to see him dropping buckets on Gallo, Kopp, and possibly Bates.

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 9,314]

Banks and Gunn won't play, guarantee Geronimo will get run, and at this point, there is no way he provides more positives than Banks. It's year 3, and he isn't near ready. 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 9,314]

1 minute ago, Chris007 said:

Maybe the short turnaround, the shock of one of their best friends getting hurt, and losing another starter kept them from learning the scouting report. Or they were just lazy and didn't care, or their not mature enough to handle this, I don't know what the reason was but I do know that the coaches don't just stop making a scouting report because it wasn't followed one game. 

I have a feeling they haven't followed many scouting reports. I'd also say, the game plan is either terrible or these players don't care. I'm not sure who is teaching to help off dudes 15 feet, but it will murder us tonight if they continue over helping. 

[Chris007 62,614]

4 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

Banks and Gunn won't play, guarantee Geronimo will get run, and at this point, there is no way he provides more positives than Banks. It's year 3, and he isn't near ready. 

I would make a bet that Gunn plays. I'm almost 100% certain

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 9,314]

3 minutes ago, Chris007 said:

I would make a bet that Gunn plays. I'm almost 100% certain

And he should play. Along with Banks. Hell give Duncomb a couple minutes. Play small and fast. Galloway could probably play the 4 for a minute. 

[Uspshoosier 54,602]

You either have enough talent to deal with injuries and just out talent teams or your have the culture and system in place where you make up for the talent gap.    IU is stuck in the middle where they really don’t have either at the moment.  They are not going to out  talent any team with a pulse especially with injuries and their program doesn’t have the culture to make up the difference.    Got to have 1 or even better you need  both to be great but when you don’t necessarily have either this is where you are.    Probably going to be in most games with a chance to win but not guaranteed any.     Watching a ton a college basketball my biggest concern is with IU would be player development.   You watch other teams players improve massively from year to year but for whatever reason just hasn’t happened at IU to this point 

[coonhounds 10,559]

If this is not a must win game, which I think it is, it is awfully close.
Lose this and we are 1-4 in the conference and would have to win 4 of the next 5 just to get back to .500.  Looking at the schedule I would be stunned if we win 4/5 of the games after PSU. We really can’t afford to go to three games under .500

Add in the fact both teams we play this week are coming off losses. This is going to be tough

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[CSP 12,163]

36 minutes ago, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

Banks and Gunn won't play, guarantee Geronimo will get run, and at this point, there is no way he provides more positives than Banks. It's year 3, and he isn't near ready. 

Banks and Gunn is that like a thing for some now? Like JG last year? 

As in, Woodson is negligent because he doesn't play them? 

[CSP 12,163]

19 minutes ago, Uspshoosier said:

You either have enough talent to deal with injuries and just out talent teams or your have the culture and system in place where you make up for the talent gap.    IU is stuck in the middle where they really don’t have either at the moment.  They are not going to out  talent any team with a pulse especially with injuries and their program doesn’t have the culture to make up the difference.    Got to have 1 or even better you need  both to be great but when you don’t necessarily have either this is where you are.    Probably going to be in most games with a chance to win but not guaranteed any.     Watching a ton a college basketball my biggest concern is with IU would be player development.   You watch other teams players improve massively from year to year but for whatever reason just hasn’t happened at IU to this point 

XJ improved quite a bit. I think Miller has, as well. Race and TJD too. Bates has. 

I think Banks, Gunn, Malik are where we can truly judge this staff. Bates can be thrown in there as well. If those guys take the necessary jumps... we start building that culture and that baseline that we need. 

[Chris007 62,614]

2 minutes ago, btownqb said:

XJ improved quite a bit. I think Miller has, as well. Race and TJD too. Bates has. 

I think Banks, Gunn, Malik are where we can truly judge this staff. Bates can be thrown in there as well. If those guys take the necessary jumps... we start building that culture and that baseline that we need. 

Trey's shot has definitely gotten better

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 9,314]

6 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Banks and Gunn is that like a thing for some now? Like JG last year? 

As in, Woodson is negligent because he doesn't play them? 

Gotta give em a chance. If Banks is so bad in practice at this point that he can't get minutes on a bottom 4 B1G team, then someone really screwed up on their recruiting. 

[CSP 12,163]

1 minute ago, Chris007 said:

Trey's shot has definitely gotten better

True true. I meant to say... more of a consistent impact. 

[CSP 12,163]

Just now, Loaded Chicken Sandwich said:

Gotta give em a chance. If Banks is so bad in practice at this point that he can't get minutes on a bottom 4 B1G team, then someone really screwed up on their recruiting. 

Not really how it works, but carry on. 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 9,314]

6 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Not really how it works, but carry on. 

If you have talented dudes on the bench, and the guy ahead of him is playing terrible, at some point you gotta put that kid in. Geronimo the last 2 games has been good awful. Geronimo being on the floor basically made it 6 on 4 against Northwestern. You're gonna tell me Banks can't give the same effort? 

[Loaded Chicken Sandwich 9,314]

8 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Not really how it works, but carry on. 

And go ahead and give us all the insight on "how it works."